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03-08-2014, 07:26 AM - 1 Like   #1
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Pentax vs all the rest...

These numbers are just rough and not entirely up to date but you get the idea
as to what Pentax may be up against when it comes to technical and capital resources
compared to the competition. Read it and weep.

I'll let you do the conversions.

************************************************************************************************

Ricoh Company, Ltd.

Revenue $ 21.5 billion
Net income $ 298.0 million
Employees 108,525
Pentax Corporation---------------------------------------------------
Revenue 157.3 billion yen
Net income 3.57 billion yen
Employees 1,661
=========================================
Sony Corporation

Revenue US$ 72.349 billion
Oper incom US$ 2.448 billion
Net income US$ 458 million
Total assets US$ 151.131 billion
Total equity US$ 28.523 billion
Employees 146,300
========================================
Mitsubishi Group

Revenue US$ 248.6 Billion
Profit US$ 7.2 Billion
Employees 350,000
Nikon Corporation--------------------------------------------------------
Revenue ¥887.5 billion
Oper inc ¥54.1 billion
Net income ¥27.3 billion
Employees 24,409
========================================
Canon Inc.

Revenue ¥3.557 trillion
Operating inc ¥378.071 billion
Profit ¥248.630 billion
Total assets ¥3.930 trillion
Total equity ¥2.551 trillion
Employees 198,307

03-08-2014, 07:41 AM   #2
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This has nothing to do with anything.
03-08-2014, 07:45 AM   #3
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Reminds me of a joke....

A university professor is giving a lecture about the big picture of the universe at one point, he says, "the universe will end in about 5 billion years".
A student at the back of the class half asleep suddenly sits bolt upright and says "What did you say?"
The professor says "the universe will end in about 5 billion years".
The student says "whew, for a second there I thought you said 5 million.".
03-08-2014, 07:45 AM   #4
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QuoteOriginally posted by monochrome Quote
This has nothing to do with anything.
Tell that to the CEO of Pentax.

03-08-2014, 07:48 AM - 1 Like   #5
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Re-read your sig.

Last edited by monochrome; 03-08-2014 at 09:04 AM.
03-08-2014, 07:57 AM   #6
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QuoteOriginally posted by monochrome Quote
Re-read your sig.
hahaha. made my day
03-08-2014, 08:46 AM   #7
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QuoteOriginally posted by wildman Quote
These numbers are just rough... Read it and weep.

So... are you suggesting since Ricoh/Pentax characterizes itself as a niche player/leader that the world market/order is static? Dunno... seems like one could make an upside case that in today's world, the step from niche leader to world leader is getting lower and lower, per...


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03-08-2014, 09:04 AM   #8
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Fortune Global 500:
  • Samsung; 26th largest company on earth, R $178 BBN, P $4.7 BBN
  • Hitachi; 54th largest company on earth, R $108 BBN, P $2.1 BBN
  • Panasonic; 83rd largest company on earth, R $87 BBN, P <$9.1 BBN>
  • Sony; 94th largest company on earth, $R 82 BBN, P $0.5 BBN
  • Misubishi; 118th largest company on earth, R $72BBN, P $4.8 BBN (owns 40% of Nikon shares)
  • Toshiba; 126th largest company on earth, R $70BBN, P $0.9 BBN
  • Fujitsu; 186th largest company on earth, R $53 BBN, P $<$0.9>
  • Canon; 236th largest company on earth, R $44 BBN, P $2.8 BBN
  • Fujifilm; 437th largest company on earth, R $27 BBN, P $0.7 BBN
  • Ricoh; 500th largest company on earth, R $24 BBN, P $0.4 BBN
Sony, Nikon and Canon should be quaking in their boots.

Ricoh. 500th. Earned about as much profit as Sony - but - PentaxIsDoomed™

Last edited by monochrome; 03-09-2014 at 07:18 AM.
03-08-2014, 12:27 PM   #9
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QuoteOriginally posted by wildman Quote
Tell that to the CEO of Pentax.
I looked at your figures, etc.

I've looked at company sizes, employee numbers , etc....but I'm left with a feeling that your numbers, etc...seem different with past figures I've seen with these companies. Can't put my finger on it.

Now, I'm not going to do a search and check things out...I guess I'll take your word for it...but in my mind...something doesn't ring right when I review the info.
03-08-2014, 01:25 PM   #10
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Of course there are ramifications to having a large pile of money available. You can finance your roadmap.

That's something Pentax benefited from when Ricoh became the owner instead of Hoya.

But a large company with multiple product portfolios can be under shareholder pressure to cut funding to struggling divisions or shut them down/sell them off eg Sony.

A blessing in general, but can be a curse.
03-08-2014, 10:13 PM   #11
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QuoteOriginally posted by monochrome Quote
Re-read your sig.
pwahhahahahahahahaahhahaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa

---------- Post added 03-08-14 at 09:13 PM ----------

could you maybe do the conversions since all of them are already done except one.
03-09-2014, 02:51 AM - 1 Like   #12
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Interesting choices.

We have Ricoh, from which Ricoh Imaging is just a small part, classified as "Others".
We have Sony, a well-diversified giant (but it's camera business is somewhat troubled).
But then instead of Nikon we have the entire Mitsubishi group, and I wonder what does it has to do with anything... maybe because otherwise people would see that Nikon is smaller than Ricoh, and the whole "point" would be invalidated? But if we accept this, then Ricoh and Canon really are the same "company", i.e. Fuyo Group
And last, Canon; they're making good printers.

Posting misleading figures in an attempt to make people "weep" (over what?), and there's no way this wasn't intentional. This is trolling.
03-09-2014, 05:56 AM   #13
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QuoteOriginally posted by Kunzite Quote
But then instead of Nikon we have the entire Mitsubishi group, and I wonder what does it has to do with anything...
To show the entire conglomerate that a subsidiary is a small part of because it implies the depth of resources the subsidiary may ,potentially, have access to. Some of the larger units were left out simply because I couldn't readily find it. If anyone else can - feel free.

QuoteOriginally posted by Kunzite Quote
the whole "point" would be invalidated?
The whole "point" was there was no "point". I simply put out the raw data and assumed that people could, and would, come to their own conclusions about what the data may mean. Yes the data is rough and incomplete but at least good enough to speculate about the possible future for Pentax. Speculation isn't entirely unknown on the forum after all. Apparently I assumed too much.

QuoteOriginally posted by Kunzite Quote
Posting misleading figures in an attempt to make people "weep" (over what?), and there's no way this wasn't intentional. This is trolling.
Aren't you being just a tad defensive and paranoid about my motives?
All I can say is that nothing sinister was intended but perhaps next time I need to be more explicit about my purpose for posting.

Oh well, live and learn.

Last edited by wildman; 03-09-2014 at 06:28 AM.
03-09-2014, 06:03 AM   #14
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Well, you know what they say about ASSuming anything.
03-09-2014, 07:09 AM   #15
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QuoteOriginally posted by wildman Quote
To show the entire conglomerate that a subsidiary is a small part of because it implies the depth of resources the subsidiary may ,potentially, have access to. Some of the larger units were left out simply because I couldn't readily find it. If anyone else can - feel free.
The whole point is - the revenue and assets of the whole conglomerate are entirely irrelevant. Capital allocation is marginal. All capital flows to the projects deemed most likely to offer the best return to the entire enterprise, in order of importance and likelihood, until all investment capital is exhausted. At the margin, the next least worthy project is not funded.

The #1 company may not even get all the way down to cameras before the investment capital has all been allocated, while the #500 company might fund all its camera projects and make up some more to do before it even starts on office copiers.

Everything is dependent on the mix of investment opportunities within the contrasted companies.

Furthermore, in practical terms there isn't any real difference between $178BBn and $21BBN. It's all Billions.

If that isn't sufficient explanation, then "You are wrong" will just have to do.

Last edited by monochrome; 03-09-2014 at 07:43 AM.
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