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02-14-2019, 02:33 AM   #1
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New Canon entry level mirrorless

Is this a category killer?
Is Pentax doomed?
Canon announces EOS RP full-frame mirrorless camera at aggressive $1,299 price - The Verge
My guess is it'll demystify full frame by making it accessible and ordinary. Hopefully it'll make photographers more critical about the sort of camera they really need.

02-14-2019, 02:41 AM - 1 Like   #2
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Camera body does the hook, then they pull the money from the bank account with the lenses. All beginners get trapped into this, it works every time (Sony do the same with the A7 series).
02-14-2019, 02:52 AM   #3
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QuoteOriginally posted by biz-engineer Quote
Camera body does the hook, then they pull the money from the bank account with the lenses. All beginners get trapped into this, it works every time (Sony do the same with the A7 series).
The lenses seems the most interesting thing for the moment when comes to Canon mirrorless. 6 new lenses will soon be released and I'm sure than at least another 4 will come by the end of the year.

Canon developing six new RF lenses, including ultra-compact 70-200 F2.8: Digital Photography Review
02-14-2019, 03:35 AM   #4
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QuoteOriginally posted by Dan Rentea Quote
The lenses seems the most interesting thing for the moment when comes to Canon mirrorless. 6 new lenses will soon be released and I'm sure than at least another 4 will come by the end of the year.
Looks interesting. For me the problem is , I already have too many modern Pentax DFA lenses and full frame 36Mpixels without filter. From my experience of the last 20 years of upgrades, I've realized that we don't get much "bang for the bucks" by upgrading equipment of the same format. The only time where upgrading apsc was worth the money was when the sensor tech changed from CDD to CMOS, CMOS provided 1 stop noise advantage over CDD and this hasn't changed much after that. Also, I am now on the trend to reduce the amount of lenses I own. In apsc times, I ended up with 12 lenses, now I have 6 but I should have 4 only. So, whenever I would upgrade from the K1 system, I would do it with a medium format system with 2 lenses (typical setup for me would be the GFX50 with the 32-64 and 110 f2 and that would be all).

02-14-2019, 04:16 AM   #5
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85mm with APD.... slurp
02-14-2019, 04:32 AM   #6
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Hmm... if the already unimpressive R is made $1000 cheaper, what was cut down?

By the way:
https://www.imaging-resource.com/news/2019/02/13/juicy-tidbits-on-canon-eos-...erview-q-and-a
02-14-2019, 05:56 AM   #7
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QuoteOriginally posted by biz-engineer Quote
Looks interesting. For me the problem is , I already have too many modern Pentax DFA lenses and full frame 36Mpixels without filter. From my experience of the last 20 years of upgrades, I've realized that we don't get much "bang for the bucks" by upgrading equipment of the same format. The only time where upgrading apsc was worth the money was when the sensor tech changed from CDD to CMOS, CMOS provided 1 stop noise advantage over CDD and this hasn't changed much after that. Also, I am now on the trend to reduce the amount of lenses I own. In apsc times, I ended up with 12 lenses, now I have 6 but I should have 4 only. So, whenever I would upgrade from the K1 system, I would do it with a medium format system with 2 lenses (typical setup for me would be the GFX50 with the 32-64 and 110 f2 and that would be all).
My experience is different. I made a massive improvement going from 16mp APS K-30 {with which I normally limit myself to ISO 800} to 24mp APS KP with 'accelerator' {with which I normally limit myself to ISO 12800}. I have a total of 3 lenses in my KP bag - Sigma 10-20, DA 18-135, DA 55-300 PLM - although I admit to having other lenses doing other duty in other bags.
02-14-2019, 06:02 AM   #8
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QuoteOriginally posted by reh321 Quote
My experience is different. I made a massive improvement going from 16mp APS K-30 {with which I normally limit myself to ISO 800} to 24mp APS KP with 'accelerator' {with which I normally limit myself to ISO 12800}. I have a total of 3 lenses in my KP bag - Sigma 10-20, DA 18-135, DA 55-300 PLM - although I admit to having other lenses doing other duty in other bags.
I'm not saying staying with same format upgrades doesn't improve. My point is that an upgrade to a larger format bring more increase of IQ per dollar spent. I spent the same amount of money for 2 apsc upgrades than I spend from apsc to FF, but the IQ improvement from apsc to FF was the most noticeable. If I upgrade my K1 with a Z7 or EOS R or S1R, the improvement in IQ will be very little if at all, the mirrorless feature will cost me about 70% of the budget I'd need for a medium format combo.

02-14-2019, 06:07 AM   #9
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QuoteOriginally posted by biz-engineer Quote
I'm not saying staying with same format upgrades doesn't improve. My point is that an upgrade to a larger format bring more increase of IQ per dollar spent. I spend the same amount of money for 2 apsc upgrades than I spend from apsc to FF, but the IQ improvement from apsc to FF was more significant. If I upgrade my K1 with a Z7 or EOS R or S1R, the improvement in IQ will be very little, the mirrorless feature will cost me about 70% of the budget I'd need for a medium format combo.
Maybe your example shows what a good value the K-1 is.


added: personally, I would love to have an MILC variant of the KP; when photographing a raccoon the other night at ISO values over 200K, I had to hold the camera using a variation of 'zombie style' and MF / compose with the LCD because I couldn't see it in the OVF .... an EVF would have been much better.

Last edited by reh321; 02-14-2019 at 06:17 AM.
02-14-2019, 07:13 AM   #10
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QuoteOriginally posted by reh321 Quote
added: personally, I would love to have an MILC variant of the KP; when photographing a raccoon the other night at ISO values over 200K, I had to hold the camera using a variation of 'zombie style' and MF / compose with the LCD because I couldn't see it in the OVF .... an EVF would have been much better.
I would tend to think the same way. I never understood why mirrorless is deployed around full frame sensors, because the size advantage is negated by the size of lenses. Whereas lenses are generally smaller for apsc limited image circle, I would have thought that camera makers leave full frame as DSLR and develop compact apsc camera using mirrorless tech. in order to keep apsc small with both body and lens together. I feel like Fuji have it right with the X series and small primes. Also GRIII concept is a good one.
02-14-2019, 07:33 AM - 1 Like   #11
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QuoteOriginally posted by biz-engineer Quote
I would tend to think the same way. I never understood why mirrorless is deployed around full frame sensors, because the size advantage is negated by the size of lenses. Whereas lenses are generally smaller for apsc limited image circle, I would have thought that camera makers leave full frame as DSLR and develop compact apsc camera using mirrorless tech. in order to keep apsc small with both body and lens together. I feel like Fuji have it right with the X series and small primes. Also GRIII concept is a good one.
Look at the upcoming Canon 70-200mm f2.8L lens designed for mirrorless. It's half the size of the Canon 70-200mm for DSLR.
02-14-2019, 07:42 AM   #12
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QuoteOriginally posted by Dan Rentea Quote
Look at the upcoming Canon 70-200mm f2.8L lens designed for mirrorless. It's half the size of the Canon 70-200mm for DSLR.
Still not small anyway. And.. my budget is around 1200 per year (6K / 5Y) so , it doesn't really matter how many new cameras and lenses are being released. For the time being I'm set with the Pentax K1 system: next looking to buy for me will be horizon 2022. By 2022, who knows how all those new product lines will have unfolded. If there is a lot of choice, it will be good to build the system we want.
02-14-2019, 09:49 AM - 1 Like   #13
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QuoteOriginally posted by biz-engineer Quote
Still not small anyway.
Not small enough??? Look at the size of this lens (the white one in the picture). Is just a little bigger than 24-70mm. And it's an f2.8 lens. If this is not small enough, then I don't know what kind of lens you want that can have the build and the performance of an L lens.
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02-14-2019, 09:56 AM   #14
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Hoo Boy. How long would it take to sell all my K-Mount stuff and submit to the borg?
02-14-2019, 10:45 AM - 1 Like   #15
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Can't help but wonder if Pentax was peeling away sales with a "better" lower priced full frame solution with the K-1/K-1 II. Is this Canon trying to grab back a part of the market Pentax was nailing? Pentax certainly had the bang for the buck quotient nailed.
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