[Wheatfield]

Thing is, it's about the only camera they now make (is you discount the theta) that was a Ricoh original - I think they want then prestige of keeping it that way, even with a lot of crossover tech between the brands

The GR series seems to have quite a following. I read somewhere that Ricoh’s plan was to continue making fixed lens cameras under the Ricoh name and reserve the Pentax brand for interchangeable lens cameras. People are brand conscious enough that changing the GR line to Pentax branding might not go over very well.
Remember the K3 that was Ricoh branded on the back and the hand wringing that accompanied that. I almost wonder if that wasn’t Ricoh testing the waters for a brand change of Pentax to Ricoh. If it was, it went over like a lead balloon as it was something they never repeated. Now the only place the Ricoh name appears is in very small letters on the base of the cameras, where visibility is minimal.

[Mistral75]

@Wheatfield

i completely agree with your former message on the previous page save for one small detail.

(...) Asahi Optical started making cameras to have something to put their lenses on. They called the expanded company Asahi Pentax. (...)

There has never been such thing as a company, expanded or not, called Asahi Pentax. The 1919-founded Asahi Optical was renamed Pentax in 2002.

1919: 旭光学工業合資会社 = Asahi Kōgaku Kōgyō Goshi-gaisha = Optical Factory of the Rising Sun (usually translated by Asahi Optical) Joint Stock Co.
1938: 旭光学工業株式会社 = Asahi Kōgaku Kōgyō Kabushiki-gaisha = Optical Factory of the Rising Sun / Asahi Optical Co., Ltd.
2002: ペンタックス株式会社 = Pentakkusu Kabushiki-gaisha = Pentax Corporation.

Asahi Pentax is the like of Panasonic Lumix, Zeiss Otus or Sony Alpha: (part of) the name of a company plus a brand name used by said company.

[Wheatfield]

@Wheatfield

i completely agree with your message save for one small detail.



There has never been such thing as a company, expanded or not, called Asahi Pentax. The 1919-founded Asahi Optical was renamed Pentax in 2002.

1919: 旭光学工業合資会社 = Asahi Kōgaku Kōgyō Goshi-gaisha = Optical Factory of the Rising Sun (usually translated by Asahi Optical) Joint Stock Co.
1938: 旭光学工業株式会社 = Asahi Kōgaku Kōgyō Kabushiki-gaisha = Optical Factory of the Rising Sun / Asahi Optical Co., Ltd.
2002: ペンタックス株式会社 = Pentakkusu Kabushiki-gaisha = Pentax Corporation.

Asahi Pentax is the like of Panasonic Lumix, Zeiss Otus or Sony Alpha: (part of) the name of a company plus a brand name used by said company.

Thanks for the correction. My point was that there was no change in ownership at that time, as was stated by another poster, just a change in name.

[Mistral75]

Exactly.

The Pentax trademark / brand has had two successive owners: Asahi Optical (renamed Pentax in 2002) from 1953 to 2007 and Hoya since 2007. Ricoh are a licensee since 2011.
(...)

On the other hand, between 1986 and 2012 Leica Camera have experimented five to six changes in control.

[monochrome]

About building brand image, why market the GRIII under the brand Ricoh?
To me, Ricoh = printers & copiers. The GRIII is an appraised camera, it deserves the top brand.

Do you remember Hocir? The people who buy GR cameras (and Thetas) think Ricoh is the top brand. We certainly didn't like the little tiny RICOH on the back of the K-3. How do you think they would feel about Pentax on the back of the GRlll?

[Merv-O]

Thanks for the correction. My point was that there was no change in ownership at that time, as was stated by another poster, just a change in name.

You skipped the Hoya takeover "Hoya Pentax Imaging". just saying...

---------- Post added 02-24-19 at 06:23 PM ----------

Exactly.


On the other hand, between 1986 and 2012 Leica Camera have experimented five to six changes in control.

On the other hand, Leica never became "Hermes Leica" either. It remained a separate brand of a holding company....RIcoh packaging since the K-5 on say RICOH Pentax (model no.)---the K-3 had a bold RICOH decal under the LCD too-on camera. Just saying.

[Wheatfield]

You skipped the Hoya takeover "Hoya Pentax Imaging". just saying...

I was disputing all the OTHER times you implied were changes of ownership.
Just saying




---------- Post added 02-24-19 at 06:23 PM ----------

[/COLOR]

On the other hand, Leica never became "Hermes Leica" either. It remained a separate brand of a holding company....RIcoh packaging since the K-5 on say RICOH Pentax (model no.)---the K-3 had a bold RICOH decal under the LCD too-on camera. Just saying.

Thanks Captain Obvious, we know what happened with Pentax, Hoya and Ricoh.

[Fenwoodian]

I’ve written before that Hoya gutted the company of properties, patents and engineers, decimated the European and North American distribution network, liquidated the inventory of lenses into the US market at fire sale prices, ‘retired’ Jun Hirakawa because he wouldn’t compromise his design standards -

.

The life's blood of any company that designs and manufactures camera lenses are its' engineers. They are the "rock stars", the "divas" of the camera lens making world.

Leica's engineers (e.g. Hubert Nasse, Peter Karbe. etc.) are highly regarded world wide, and are frequently published and interviewed on the Internet. They are the ultimate ambassadors for Leica lenses. I dream of some day having a Karbe designed Leica lens.

Conversely, at Pentax, their engineers are totally invisible to me. With recent Pentax lenses designed by Tamron (and maybe even Tokina) I wonder if Pentax even had any optical engineers left? Maybe a major step in the right direction by Pentax would be to hire a leading lens engineer and to regularly get him/her out in front of the public?

Part of believing in a product is believing in those who design and built it. I recently bought a new $1300 Meyer-Optik Guerlitz lens that completely fell apart the first month that I owned it. Turns out the defect was a minor design defect (two tiny pins that were not adequately hardened). That experience taught me the critical importance of the lens engineers. To me the lens engineer is even more important than the country where the lenses are manufactured.

[Merv-O]

I was disputing all the OTHER times you implied were changes of ownership.
Just saying




---------- Post added 02-24-19 at 06:23 PM ----------

Thanks Captain Obvious, we know what happened with Pentax, Hoya and Ricoh.

Well if it was that 'obvious' you clearly missed it--so maybe it wasn't as obvious as you think....Branding is key and Pentax has been kicked around. Leica may have been sold but it was never sacrificed or made a "division" of....leica also has 80 stores around the world and 100's of dealers. Pentax has zero stores and fewer dealers. I have to go to North jersey to see the new Pentaxes (at Adorama) or NYC (B&H)--otherwise, I buy via internet and hope for the best.
Is that a long term gain? I don't know. I am heavily invested in Pentax because I like the cameras. If one fails, I'll use the remaining 4 bodies until or unless they become extinct. If Ricoh's long-term plan is to merge Pentax into RICOH for brand clarity, who can blame them? Look at what Sony did to Konica Minolta in 2007---merged into SONY--a famous marque disappeared and its DNA in now in Sony.
I stand by what I said: you didn't understand it, but It's ok, carry on. At least I stayed in the conversation--didn't get defensive. Or am I still being Capt. Obvious? Why not become a site supporter if you feel that strongly Wheatfield? Or is that too obvious?

[Wheatfield]

.

The life's blood of any company that designs and manufactures camera lenses are its' engineers. They are the "rock stars", the "divas" of the camera lens making world.

Leica's engineers (e.g. Hubert Nasse, Peter Karbe. etc.) are highly regarded world wide, and are frequently published and interviewed on the Internet. They are the ultimate ambassadors for Leica lenses. I dream of some day having a Karbe designed Leica lens.

Conversely, at Pentax, their engineers are totally invisible to me. With recent Pentax lenses designed by Tamron (and maybe even Tokina) I wonder if Pentax even had any optical engineers left? Maybe a major step in the right direction by Pentax would be to hire a leading lens engineer and to regularly get him/her out in front of the public?

Part of believing in a product is believing in those who design and built it. I recently bought a new $1300 Meyer-Optik Guerlitz lens that completely fell apart the first month that I owned it. Turns out the defect was a minor design defect (two tiny pins that were not adequately hardened). That experience taught me the critical importance of the lens engineers. To me the lens engineer is even more important than the country where the lenses are manufactured.

I'm wondering if that wouldn't be little more than nerd value. The proof of a lens is it's performance, not the person who headed up the design team. I'm not saying designers aren't the lifeblood of a company that depends on engineering designs for it's product, I just question the value of trotting the engineers out like it's a dog show.
Pentax made a pretty big deal of having the exterior of a camera designed by Marc Newson. All indicators are that in spite if it's "rock star" designer, the product itself was pretty much a failure.
I really don't care who designed a product, only that the product works for me.

[Merv-O]

Here is a picture of my three main prime Leica M-Mount Lenses: 35mm f/2; 50mm f2.5, and; 90mm f/4. The 35mm is about 6 months old, the 50mm is 5 years old and the 90mm I bought used is over 20 years old...all work with the precision of a new lens. These lenses are also quite small and offer amazing clarity. Very few Pentax lenses equal these for optical and manufacturing quality. On the other hand they also are quite expensive. As far as who designed them, it's moot to me. Because regardless of how excellent the optical quality is, not one of my M cameras can compete with the speed of the AF on any Pentax. So the utility is in their street, landscape, portrait and still usage.
I think Pentax produces great glass for its genre and therefore, Pentax DSLR v. Leica's RF Mirrorless is not a fair compare as they are two different systems. In different price points.

[ZombieArmy]

I think Pentax has slowly been seeping into the minds of photographers in recent years.There was a time that Pentax wouldn't even get mentioned in media at all, let alone considered a real company. Nowadays Pentax is considered a real option, and even though it is the butt of a lot of jokes (mainly at video) a newer generation of photographer is learning the name.

I think given the high quality and obvious generational improvements Ricoh has been putting into these cameras I have no doubt that Pentax will be around a long time.

I really think Ricoh is doing a great job.

[BigMackCam]

I think Pentax has slowly been seeping into the minds of photographers in recent years.There was a time that Pentax wouldn't even get mentioned in media at all, let alone considered a real company. Nowadays Pentax is considered a real option, and even though it is the butt of a lot of jokes (mainly at video) a newer generation of photographer is learning the name.

I think given the high quality and obvious generational improvements Ricoh has been putting into these cameras I have no doubt that Pentax will be around a long time.

I really think Ricoh is doing a great job.

Well said, and what a breath of fresh air. I read so many doom and gloom posts that they can become quite dis-heartening, though they've never influenced my own views of Ricoh or the Pentax brand. Your post has made my day

[Merv-O]

Well said, and what a breath of fresh air. I read so many doom and gloom posts that they can become quite dis-heartening, though they've never influenced my own views of Ricoh or the Pentax brand. Your post has made my day

Hey Big Mack: why do you have a Soviet Cosmonaut Icon ?

[BigMackCam]

Hey Big Mack: why do you have a Soviet Cosmonaut Icon ?

I'm a prolific collector, fan and user of vintage Soviet lenses I have a few Soviet cameras, too, but my main interest is in the glass. I guess I also have an interest in the Soviet Union generally, having grown up mostly during the 70s and 80s...