[AlphaGAK20D]

Though I'm interested in going down this road (at least to the degree possible in current context), I did not anticipate receiving a note like the following as I've done zero self-marketing (beyond posting pics on Flickr):

Hi, and greetings from (someplace in the USA). I found your very cool Drum Line photo (red drum in foreground) while searching for photos to consider for the cover of our upcoming high school drumline competition on March 14. I wanted something that was flashy but generic enough so that it depicted no particular school or band member. Would you consider allowing us to use your photo? We will be printing the cover in grayscale so that beautiful red won't come through, but it's such a neat picture, even in black and white. There will be about 35 schools represented, and it'll be an afternoon of great percussion, I'm sure.
Thanks so much for your consideration, and I look forward to hearing back from you. I just opened a yahoo account in order to communicate with you, but am not sure how to access it, so if you wouldn't mind replying to my usual email address at (some email), I would appreciate it. (It might go into suspect email first, but I'll look for it and put it in my inbox.)
Thanks again!
(some person)

OK...very cool...my initial response was this:

Hi (person):

Thank you very much for your note and for your consideration.

I'm extremely humbled/flattered that you'd like to use my photo for your publication. I know you probably need to get ready to go to press soon, so my short answer is "Yes."

However, several questions:

• Will photo credit and acknowledgement that the photo was used with permission be included somewhere in the publication?
• Is there any possible remuneration involved? Not that this is needed, but I'm hoping to start parlaying use of photos into money so that I can buy additional equipment that'll allow me to continue to hone and develop my skills and be able to shoot pictures in many different contexts. And to this point, I don't even have a number in mind; I know you're probably looking for advertising donations to offset the cost of printing and if my picture is also a donation, photo credit and copyright notice will be good enough.
• Will you be able to send me a copy of the printed publication?

Please let me know how I can help further and what your printer needs as far as the image is concerned.
Sincerely,

Lou

Was my response appropriate? Should I ask for some sort of signed release? If "Yes," does anybody have a copy of one they'd be willing to share? Any other thoughts/suggestions?

Thanks in advance to any/all responses!

Lou

[Jester_rm]

Sounds pretty good to me. When sending the photo (if you do), make sure to include a very clear usage document limiting to a one-time use in that specific publication (especially if you're sending it for free). Just something to cover your bases in the future.

[MRRiley]

Lou,

1. He does not explain what the product is. Is this just a promotional brochure announcing the competition or is it a book of photos of all of the bands? A brochure I would let them use it for free. If its a book that they are going to be selling I might request a small royalty per copy or a lump sum to be negotiated depending on sales expectations.

2. It doesn't sound like he is expecting you to send him anything. He probably expects to just use the photo directly off of Yahoo. In the interests of making sure your work is fairly represented you should specify that you will supply the printer with a high resolution digital file of the original image.

3. You don't need any form of release from him, he needs one from you. This should clearly state, as Jester said, that he and his organization is authorized to use the photo this one time for this specific purpose. You also need to state that additional usage on other promotional materials requires your specific and separate permission. I'll see if I can find a good sample when I get home.

4. You "asked" if there would be credit given you... This is the wrong way to go about this. The credit should be a condition of use... ie: "use of the aforementioned photograph requires clear and obvious credit to XYZ Photography on the inside cover or other appropriate location"

5. You asked for a copy of the printed publication... Again, this should be a condition of use... especially since you are not asking to be payed. Saying that its ok for them not to pay you but that it would be nice if they did is an invitation to use the image for free. You also need a production copy for your own record of publication/tear sheets.

Its nice that someone wants to use the photo, but don't let the flattery get to you. If its good enough that they want to use it, it should be good enough to give you at least credit for it. As is though, since you have already given him a blanket YES then it may be out of your control now. He could use the photo almost any way he sees fit and if you ever called him on it he can produce your e-mail telling him it was OK to use the photo.

Mike

[AlphaGAK20D]

Sounds pretty good to me. When sending the photo (if you do), make sure to include a very clear usage document limiting to a one-time use in that specific publication (especially if you're sending it for free). Just something to cover your bases in the future.

Thanks Jester. Would love to see a copy of a usage doc if you have one handy.

Lou,

1. He does not explain what the product is. Is this just a promotional brochure announcing the competition or is it a book of photos of all of the bands? A brochure I would let them use it for free. If its a book that they are going to be selling I might request a small royalty per copy or a lump sum to be negotiated depending on sales expectations.

I'm under the impression it's a program guide that'll be distributed (free or $$, I don't know) at the competition.

2. It doesn't sound like he is expecting you to send him anything. He probably expects to just use the photo directly off of Yahoo. In the interests of making sure your work is fairly represented you should specify that you will supply the printer with a high resolution digital file of the original image.

Agreed...pic is on my Flickr site

3. You don't need any form of release from him, he needs one from you. This should clearly state, as Jester said, that he and his organization is authorized to use the photo this one time for this specific purpose. You also need to state that additional usage on other promotional materials requires your specific and separate permission. I'll see if I can find a good sample when I get home.

Yes, I wasn't clear in my original post. What I meant was I'd provide them a release that they'd sign. I'd love to see a sample if you could dig one up.

4. You "asked" if there would be credit given you... This is the wrong way to go about this. The credit should be a condition of use... ie: "use of the aforementioned photograph requires clear and obvious credit to XYZ Photography on the inside cover or other appropriate location"

Good point; I've got no problems being direct with folks, just need to do so in this context as well.

5. You asked for a copy of the printed publication... Again, this should be a condition of use... especially since you are not asking to be payed. Saying that its ok for them not to pay you but that it would be nice if they did is an invitation to use the image for free. You also need a production copy for your own record of publication/tear sheets.

Ditto re: #4...

Its nice that someone wants to use the photo, but don't let the flattery get to you. If its good enough that they want to use it, it should be good enough to give you at least credit for it. As is though, since you have already given him a blanket YES then it may be out of your control now. He could use the photo almost any way he sees fit and if you ever called him on it he can produce your e-mail telling him it was OK to use the photo.

Hopefully she (yes, not a he) understands that the "Yes" is not w/out consideration of the questions I raised as well as a signed release. On this last point, if you could toss a generic sample my way, I'd appreciate it. I'll circle back with her and make it clear that at the very least I need a signed release, credit, and a copy of the program.

Mike

Thanks for the responses! Mike, I made some specific comments to each of your points in-line.

[sluggo913]

If you are going to allow them to use your photo that is fine but are you also going to let them convert it to balck and white? I would suggest that you offer a B/W version to them adjusted to your liking to best represent (Your) photo.

[George Lama]

MrRiley hit it square on the head as far as the business aspect of it, so I'll just comment on the type of event you're getting involved with.

In a typical highschool band circuit, chances are they will charge a modest amount for the program so as to cover printing costs and raise band money for the host band or the organization hosting it. They probably will also sell ads for local businesses for the same reason.

In all the programs I've seen, each band typically gets a page of the booklet which includes a promo paragraph about the band, their previous merits, the leaders, the drum major(s), a blurb about what they are performing, the school and/or band logo, maybe even a photo or two (not necessarily in that order).

And sometimes, for the benefit of those who chase their school band from contest to contest every season, results from previous events will also be included.

For our local high school band, when the county competition comes to our turf, we have about 7-10 bands showing. We get about 400-500 people present not counting a single band-member. For regional that amount climbs considerably.

With 35 bands present (wow), you can easily figure a crowd in the thousands.

So it's a pretty big deal.

[MJB DIGITAL]

frog

thanks for that post. i like to see where money comes and goes in issues like this. and im sure the OP does to.

8)

[Jester_rm]

I don't think there's any standard for what a usage document contains, I've seen several and most of them aren't anything like a template form, just on letterhead. Mainly you want to make sure you spell out:

1) Who you're granting the permission to
2) What exact photo you're granting permission for
3) What the exact use you are permitting consists of (one time use in the band brochure for instance)
4) What compensation you are receiving for that permission (anything from nothing to photo credit to money...should be at least photo credit but it's up to you).

You should also send a high res version of the photo (maybe offer to do the BW conversion yourself to ensure good quality) so that the printer has the best source to work with, you certainly want to show off your work to its' best potential.

[AlphaGAK20D]

I would suggest that you offer a B/W version to them adjusted to your liking to best represent (Your) photo.

Good suggestion and I've done this. I gave them two versions to look at - one hi-contrast, one low-contrast.

MrRiley hit it square on the head as far as the business aspect of it, so I'll just comment on the type of event you're getting involved with.

In a typical highschool band circuit, chances are they will charge a modest amount for the program so as to cover printing costs and raise band money for the host band or the organization hosting it. They probably will also sell ads for local businesses for the same reason.

In all the programs I've seen, each band typically gets a page of the booklet which includes a promo paragraph about the band, their previous merits, the leaders, the drum major(s), a blurb about what they are performing, the school and/or band logo, maybe even a photo or two (not necessarily in that order).

And sometimes, for the benefit of those who chase their school band from contest to contest every season, results from previous events will also be included.

For our local high school band, when the county competition comes to our turf, we have about 7-10 bands showing. We get about 400-500 people present not counting a single band-member. For regional that amount climbs considerably.

With 35 bands present (wow), you can easily figure a crowd in the thousands.

So it's a pretty big deal.

Frog - thanks for this info. In my mind, I was coming up with a similar number as yours. This said, based upon the dialogue I've had with my contact, they're on a very tight budget; a small town, in Michigan no less, and I get the sense this event is as much/more about the love of music as anything. Perhaps John Cougar can show up and do a benefit concert too.

The reason they want B&W photo is they're using MSFT Publisher to create the program and they're printing "in house" on the heavy-duty printer at the high school. This makes me shudder a bit.

frog

thanks for that post. i like to see where money comes and goes in issues like this. and im sure the OP does to.

Indeed...thanks for stopping in MJB

8)

I don't think there's any standard for what a usage document contains, I've seen several and most of them aren't anything like a template form, just on letterhead. Mainly you want to make sure you spell out:

1) Who you're granting the permission to
2) What exact photo you're granting permission for
3) What the exact use you are permitting consists of (one time use in the band brochure for instance)
4) What compensation you are receiving for that permission (anything from nothing to photo credit to money...should be at least photo credit but it's up to you).

You should also send a high res version of the photo (maybe offer to do the BW conversion yourself to ensure good quality) so that the printer has the best source to work with, you certainly want to show off your work to its' best potential.

Thanks, Jester. I was able to muster up a few examples on the web that, fortunately, helped me create a Word document that spoke to each of your points. I also took care of the high-res versions today, though as noted above, ultimate quality is going to be up to the school's heavy duty printer - hopefully they set to "best" quality output.

[Jester_rm]

Here's hoping that everything looks good on their end!

Which town in Michigan? My wifes from there (small town called Clio, north of Flint).

[AlphaGAK20D]

Here's hoping that everything looks good on their end!

Which town in Michigan? My wifes from there (small town called Clio, north of Flint).

Indeed - one of the two x-res versions should do the trick (I'd guess the hi, but maybe their school printer is top quality).

Town = Milford.