Family Portrait Gig

Timtast1c · 07-01-2009, 07:16 PM

After carrying my small portfolio around with me to show family and friends, others inevitably got a chance to view it as well. I was recently offered a gig to do portraits/family portraits/ candids for a portion of a day. I have never done a hired shoot. They are aware that I am not a professional and that I have not conducted a shoot like this before. With an agreement that expectations are loose and that it would be an experiment on my part, they asked how much I would charge.

the money question.....sigh

how much should I charge?

here is what I know

Ill would probably spend 2- 2.5 hours taking photos
there are 5 family members
They want individual portraits and family shots
They will likely want about 15-20 good prints
for the prints they would like 3 16X20" (which I can get done for $3 each my own cost)
and 12-17ish prints from 8x11 or smaller (under $2 per print)

I honestly have no idea what to charge for my skill/time/cost to print.

any help out there???

cwood · 07-01-2009, 07:27 PM

Originally posted by iceemn360

After carrying my small portfolio around with me to show family and friends, others inevitably got a chance to view it as well. I was recently offered a gig to do portraits/family portraits/ candids for a portion of a day. I have never done a hired shoot. They are aware that I am not a professional and that I have not conducted a shoot like this before. With an agreement that expectations are loose and that it would be an experiment on my part, they asked how much I would charge.

the money question.....sigh

how much should I charge?

here is what I know

Ill would probably spend 2- 2.5 hours taking photos
there are 5 family members
They want individual portraits and family shots
They will likely want about 15-20 good prints
for the prints they would like 3 16X20" (which I can get done for $3 each my own cost)
and 12-17ish prints from 8x11 or smaller (under $2 per print)

I honestly have no idea what to charge for my skill/time/cost to print.

any help out there???

Since you are apparently not a pro and you are apparently aware of your limitations I would do the shoot for free and then mark up the prints so that your total time (if they buy the expected quantity) would be worth $50/hr including any post processing, travel etc.

It makes it a low risk proposition for everyone and saves you the embarrassment of having to return their money to them if the shots all turn out badly (or some of them do). It also ensures your are adequately paid if you do a good job.

But that's just my opinion...

tibbitts · 07-01-2009, 09:15 PM

Question: where are you getting pro-quality 16x20s for $3?

Paul

cwood · 07-01-2009, 10:14 PM

Originally posted by tibbitts

Question: where are you getting pro-quality 16x20s for $3?

Paul

Mine are $22. where are you getting $3?

tibbitts · 07-01-2009, 11:19 PM

Not sure if you're asking me, but from the OP:

Quote:

for the prints they would like 3 16X20" (which I can get done for $3 each my own cost)

Paul

Timtast1c · 07-01-2009, 11:23 PM

sorry for the confusion. Im just a student and I dont really know much about printing/processing. However my parents have been getting prints from costco of all places and the prints that i've made there seem pretty good. As long as you tell them to take the autocorrect off the machine, the prints come out just as good as other places i've printed (ie Wolf or Ritz camera) on the same paper. at Costco 16"x20" are $2.99. smaller sizes cost 1.49 and less depending on size.

Timtast1c · 07-01-2009, 11:24 PM

thanks! this is a great help. and it makes sense as well.

Originally posted by kunik

Since you are apparently not a pro and you are apparently aware of your limitations I would do the shoot for free and then mark up the prints so that your total time (if they buy the expected quantity) would be worth $50/hr including any post processing, travel etc.

It makes it a low risk proposition for everyone and saves you the embarrassment of having to return their money to them if the shots all turn out badly (or some of them do). It also ensures your are adequately paid if you do a good job.

But that's just my opinion...

Damn Brit · 07-01-2009, 11:31 PM

Beware of charging too little. These people will tell other people who will tell other people.
Before long you will be inundated with requests expecting rock bottom prices. Charge a reasonable hourly rate and a reasonable mark up on the pictures. Get the payment after you have produced the goods. No goods, no payment.

Timtast1c · 07-02-2009, 11:52 AM

Originally posted by Damn Brit

Beware of charging too little. These people will tell other people who will tell other people.
Before long you will be inundated with requests expecting rock bottom prices. Charge a reasonable hourly rate and a reasonable mark up on the pictures. Get the payment after you have produced the goods. No goods, no payment.

thanks gary

maxwell1295 · 07-02-2009, 12:46 PM

I got burned a couple of time waiting on expected prints sales that never materialized. I try to make as much as I can up front by charging a sitting fee. I charge $250 for the sitting fee, which includes web resolution images on CD and 4x6 proofs in a "brag book". I can do the editing in Lightroom pretty quickly and 4x6 prints are cheap. At the end of a 1 hour session plus 1 hour of editing, I've already made my money. Print orders are just a bonus at that point and they can add up pretty quickly.

Prints are sold a la carte in the popular sizes (4x6, 5x7, 8x10, 11x14) and in any combination they want.

walro · 07-02-2009, 01:54 PM

If you are wanting to grow a business, then you will want to consider getting your prints made at a professional lab. Cosco may do a good enough job for some things, but if you want to look professional, I would recommend getting your work printed on professional paper. Most labs print on Kodak Endura paper. The back of the paper states that this is professional paper and that the photo is copyrighted. I've found that just using that paper alone can really impress people, and it can sometimes save your work from being copied illegally.

Labs do not have to be expensive. In the past I have used MPix and Adorama, and liked them both. However, now that I am bumping things up to a little more professional level, I am using American Color Imaging (mainly because of service, packaging, and product options such as albums). But I would highly recommend MPix for a beginner.

deludel · 07-07-2009, 09:54 AM

iceemn360 - I am in a similar boat, maybe 6-9 months ahead of you. I've recently launched my "Captured Moments" business, but still have yet to get an LLC. I spend an hour or two with families to capture their moments.

Sample gallery: Captured Moments by Lori | Albert Family
(don't pay attention to the pricing on these photos, this was a pro-bono thing to launch my business, the print prices are base lab prices)

Pricing is very difficult! As someone already said in this thread, the last thing you want to do is get your name out there as a "cheap" photographer. Your name will get passed around, inevitably. It started for me where I did my friend's low-key wedding for free, and others asked me for my "card". ACK! I created cards the next week!

As an amateur, I started thinking I should charge $50/hour. Travel is something to consider, too. I charged one family $50/hour, but traveled an hour in each direction to get to them! I was seriously underpaid. You should charge an additional fee if you go more than 15-30 miles in any direciton. I am finally comfortable charging $75/hour for now.

Regarding pricing .... Don't use Costco/Walgreens/CVS/etc!! Their quality is terrible!! Especially for a paid gig. I was hooked up to mpix.com and never went back. Their prices are great, and their quality is better. I ordered the same prints through Walgreens, and through mpix, and there was no comparison.

Consider crop ratios. You take a picture, but the client wants it cropped to 5x7 or 8x10, etc. Places like Walgreens/Costco do an automatic-crop and will cut things off that you dont want cut off. With places like mpix, you have much more control.

Lastly, for an amateur who wants to showcase and sell their work ... I just signed up with zenfolio.

Zenfolio | hosting service for photo galleries | a place to learn and enjoy photography
Zenfolio | Features and Plans

I signed up for the preium account and it is terrific. I set my price lists, and the customers order their prints right from my gallery. mpix is the lab that produces the prints.

As for print pricing ... there's work that goes into getting those prints ready, usually (post-processing/editing) .. your print prices should reflect that. This is a big arena, so you need to make your best decision. I charge $4.99 for a 4x6, $7.99 for 5x7, $19.99 for 8x10, $39.99 for 11x17.

Here are the prices to have these printed through mpix:
Mpix.com - Print Pricing
So, I pay zenfolio an 8% service fee, plus the lab fee.

Example: 5x7 print
My fee: $7.99
Lab fee: $1.29
My profit: $5.90
8% Fee to Zenfolio: $0.80

Good Luck! It's overwhelming but rewarding

maxwell1295 · 07-09-2009, 11:36 AM

I think there's a misconception regarding Costco prints. While you don't have the selection of paper that some of the premium labs do, Costco uses the exact same (Noritsu) printers. what makes this even better is that you can download the profiles for their printers and match colors perfectly on you monitor (provided your monitor has been calibrated). I've never had to use the profiles because my prints come out perfectly matched without them.

Another thing to consider is that they use premium archive paper and not the CVS/RiteAid/Walgreens crap paper. My local store uses Fuji Crystal Archive paper and I'm sure other Costco stores use the same stuff since they probably buy it in bulk.

As for print size and cropping, that is all done by you before uploading the files to their website. You can also upload the full JPEG and crop the mage online.....I just prefer to do it in Lightroom before exporting and uploading. Rarely do I walk in and order prints using a flash drive or CD. I crop and unload the images, order the prints online, and pick them up myself at the local store (20 mins away). I've never had a problem with the quality of their prints.

I also use the Zenfolio/MPIX combo for direct internet orders, but use Costco for anything I hand deliver or ship out myself. Zenfolio/MPIX is great because there's no handling involved and customers have been pleased with the quality of the prints.

Zenfolio/MPIX works well......I just hate to see Costco lumped in with the likes of CVS and Walgreens when they offer a product that is much better.

deludel · 07-09-2009, 11:38 AM

Originally posted by maxwell1295

I think there's a misconception regarding Costco prints.

Zenfolio/MPIX works well......I just hate to see Costco lumped in with the likes of CVS and Walgreens when they offer a product that is much better.

Thank you - I stand corrected. I admit, I *ASS*UMED that Costco was in the same category .. noted, don't assume unless you have tried it yourself.

~Lori

maxwell1295 · 07-09-2009, 07:28 PM

Originally posted by deludel

Thank you - I stand corrected. I admit, I *ASS*UMED that Costco was in the same category .. noted, don't assume unless you have tried it yourself.

~Lori

No problem Lori. That was just a general statement and not necessarily directed at you.....you just happened to be the one standing there.

BTW, I like your previous avatar (the one in color) better...

07-01-2009, 07:16 PM	#1
Timtast1c Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: San Francisco, CA Posts: 330	Family Portrait Gig After carrying my small portfolio around with me to show family and friends, others inevitably got a chance to view it as well. I was recently offered a gig to do portraits/family portraits/ candids for a portion of a day. I have never done a hired shoot. They are aware that I am not a professional and that I have not conducted a shoot like this before. With an agreement that expectations are loose and that it would be an experiment on my part, they asked how much I would charge. the money question.....sigh how much should I charge? here is what I know Ill would probably spend 2- 2.5 hours taking photos there are 5 family members They want individual portraits and family shots They will likely want about 15-20 good prints for the prints they would like 3 16X20" (which I can get done for $3 each my own cost) and 12-17ish prints from 8x11 or smaller (under $2 per print) I honestly have no idea what to charge for my skill/time/cost to print. any help out there???

Similar Threads
Thread	Thread Starter	Forum	Replies	Last Post
Family portrait	Gnomka	Monthly Photo Contests	0	08-01-2010 08:45 AM
family portrait	suzuki-j	Monthly Photo Contests	0	08-01-2010 07:41 AM
People Family portrait	Ash	Post Your Photos!	25	01-11-2010 03:26 PM
Portrait of my family	YJD	Post Your Photos!	0	01-27-2009 02:38 PM
Outdoor family portrait	Ash	Post Your Photos!	8	05-01-2008 02:15 PM

07-01-2009, 07:27 PM	#2
cwood Veteran Member Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: California Posts: 851	Originally posted by iceemn360 After carrying my small portfolio around with me to show family and friends, others inevitably got a chance to view it as well. I was recently offered a gig to do portraits/family portraits/ candids for a portion of a day. I have never done a hired shoot. They are aware that I am not a professional and that I have not conducted a shoot like this before. With an agreement that expectations are loose and that it would be an experiment on my part, they asked how much I would charge. the money question.....sigh how much should I charge? here is what I know Ill would probably spend 2- 2.5 hours taking photos there are 5 family members They want individual portraits and family shots They will likely want about 15-20 good prints for the prints they would like 3 16X20" (which I can get done for $3 each my own cost) and 12-17ish prints from 8x11 or smaller (under $2 per print) I honestly have no idea what to charge for my skill/time/cost to print. any help out there??? Since you are apparently not a pro and you are apparently aware of your limitations I would do the shoot for free and then mark up the prints so that your total time (if they buy the expected quantity) would be worth $50/hr including any post processing, travel etc. It makes it a low risk proposition for everyone and saves you the embarrassment of having to return their money to them if the shots all turn out badly (or some of them do). It also ensures your are adequately paid if you do a good job. But that's just my opinion...

07-01-2009, 09:15 PM	#3
tibbitts Pentaxian Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Oklahoma USA Posts: 2,196	Question: where are you getting pro-quality 16x20s for $3? Paul

07-01-2009, 10:14 PM	#4
cwood Veteran Member Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: California Posts: 851	Originally posted by tibbitts Question: where are you getting pro-quality 16x20s for $3? Paul Mine are $22. where are you getting $3?

07-01-2009, 11:19 PM	#5
tibbitts Pentaxian Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Oklahoma USA Posts: 2,196	Not sure if you're asking me, but from the OP: Quote: for the prints they would like 3 16X20" (which I can get done for $3 each my own cost) Paul

07-01-2009, 11:23 PM	#6
Timtast1c Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: San Francisco, CA Posts: 330 Original Poster	sorry for the confusion. Im just a student and I dont really know much about printing/processing. However my parents have been getting prints from costco of all places and the prints that i've made there seem pretty good. As long as you tell them to take the autocorrect off the machine, the prints come out just as good as other places i've printed (ie Wolf or Ritz camera) on the same paper. at Costco 16"x20" are $2.99. smaller sizes cost 1.49 and less depending on size.

07-01-2009, 11:24 PM	#7
Timtast1c Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: San Francisco, CA Posts: 330 Original Poster	thanks! this is a great help. and it makes sense as well. Originally posted by kunik Since you are apparently not a pro and you are apparently aware of your limitations I would do the shoot for free and then mark up the prints so that your total time (if they buy the expected quantity) would be worth $50/hr including any post processing, travel etc. It makes it a low risk proposition for everyone and saves you the embarrassment of having to return their money to them if the shots all turn out badly (or some of them do). It also ensures your are adequately paid if you do a good job. But that's just my opinion...

07-01-2009, 11:31 PM	#8
Damn Brit Guest	Beware of charging too little. These people will tell other people who will tell other people. Before long you will be inundated with requests expecting rock bottom prices. Charge a reasonable hourly rate and a reasonable mark up on the pictures. Get the payment after you have produced the goods. No goods, no payment.

07-02-2009, 11:52 AM	#9
Timtast1c Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: San Francisco, CA Posts: 330 Original Poster	Originally posted by Damn Brit Beware of charging too little. These people will tell other people who will tell other people. Before long you will be inundated with requests expecting rock bottom prices. Charge a reasonable hourly rate and a reasonable mark up on the pictures. Get the payment after you have produced the goods. No goods, no payment. thanks gary

07-02-2009, 12:46 PM	#10
maxwell1295 Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Long Island, New York Photos: Gallery Posts: 2,703	I got burned a couple of time waiting on expected prints sales that never materialized. I try to make as much as I can up front by charging a sitting fee. I charge $250 for the sitting fee, which includes web resolution images on CD and 4x6 proofs in a "brag book". I can do the editing in Lightroom pretty quickly and 4x6 prints are cheap. At the end of a 1 hour session plus 1 hour of editing, I've already made my money. Print orders are just a bonus at that point and they can add up pretty quickly. Prints are sold a la carte in the popular sizes (4x6, 5x7, 8x10, 11x14) and in any combination they want.

07-02-2009, 01:54 PM	#11
walro Forum Member Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Indiana Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 74	If you are wanting to grow a business, then you will want to consider getting your prints made at a professional lab. Cosco may do a good enough job for some things, but if you want to look professional, I would recommend getting your work printed on professional paper. Most labs print on Kodak Endura paper. The back of the paper states that this is professional paper and that the photo is copyrighted. I've found that just using that paper alone can really impress people, and it can sometimes save your work from being copied illegally. Labs do not have to be expensive. In the past I have used MPix and Adorama, and liked them both. However, now that I am bumping things up to a little more professional level, I am using American Color Imaging (mainly because of service, packaging, and product options such as albums). But I would highly recommend MPix for a beginner.

07-07-2009, 09:54 AM	#12
deludel Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Durham, CT Posts: 196	iceemn360 - I am in a similar boat, maybe 6-9 months ahead of you. I've recently launched my "Captured Moments" business, but still have yet to get an LLC. I spend an hour or two with families to capture their moments. Sample gallery: Captured Moments by Lori \| Albert Family (don't pay attention to the pricing on these photos, this was a pro-bono thing to launch my business, the print prices are base lab prices) Pricing is very difficult! As someone already said in this thread, the last thing you want to do is get your name out there as a "cheap" photographer. Your name will get passed around, inevitably. It started for me where I did my friend's low-key wedding for free, and others asked me for my "card". ACK! I created cards the next week! As an amateur, I started thinking I should charge $50/hour. Travel is something to consider, too. I charged one family $50/hour, but traveled an hour in each direction to get to them! I was seriously underpaid. You should charge an additional fee if you go more than 15-30 miles in any direciton. I am finally comfortable charging $75/hour for now. Regarding pricing .... Don't use Costco/Walgreens/CVS/etc!! Their quality is terrible!! Especially for a paid gig. I was hooked up to mpix.com and never went back. Their prices are great, and their quality is better. I ordered the same prints through Walgreens, and through mpix, and there was no comparison. Consider crop ratios. You take a picture, but the client wants it cropped to 5x7 or 8x10, etc. Places like Walgreens/Costco do an automatic-crop and will cut things off that you dont want cut off. With places like mpix, you have much more control. Lastly, for an amateur who wants to showcase and sell their work ... I just signed up with zenfolio. Zenfolio \| hosting service for photo galleries \| a place to learn and enjoy photography Zenfolio \| Features and Plans I signed up for the preium account and it is terrific. I set my price lists, and the customers order their prints right from my gallery. mpix is the lab that produces the prints. As for print pricing ... there's work that goes into getting those prints ready, usually (post-processing/editing) .. your print prices should reflect that. This is a big arena, so you need to make your best decision. I charge $4.99 for a 4x6, $7.99 for 5x7, $19.99 for 8x10, $39.99 for 11x17. Here are the prices to have these printed through mpix: Mpix.com - Print Pricing So, I pay zenfolio an 8% service fee, plus the lab fee. Example: 5x7 print My fee: $7.99 Lab fee: $1.29 My profit: $5.90 8% Fee to Zenfolio: $0.80 Good Luck! It's overwhelming but rewarding

07-09-2009, 11:36 AM	#13
maxwell1295 Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Long Island, New York Photos: Gallery Posts: 2,703	I think there's a misconception regarding Costco prints. While you don't have the selection of paper that some of the premium labs do, Costco uses the exact same (Noritsu) printers. what makes this even better is that you can download the profiles for their printers and match colors perfectly on you monitor (provided your monitor has been calibrated). I've never had to use the profiles because my prints come out perfectly matched without them. Another thing to consider is that they use premium archive paper and not the CVS/RiteAid/Walgreens crap paper. My local store uses Fuji Crystal Archive paper and I'm sure other Costco stores use the same stuff since they probably buy it in bulk. As for print size and cropping, that is all done by you before uploading the files to their website. You can also upload the full JPEG and crop the mage online.....I just prefer to do it in Lightroom before exporting and uploading. Rarely do I walk in and order prints using a flash drive or CD. I crop and unload the images, order the prints online, and pick them up myself at the local store (20 mins away). I've never had a problem with the quality of their prints. I also use the Zenfolio/MPIX combo for direct internet orders, but use Costco for anything I hand deliver or ship out myself. Zenfolio/MPIX is great because there's no handling involved and customers have been pleased with the quality of the prints. Zenfolio/MPIX works well......I just hate to see Costco lumped in with the likes of CVS and Walgreens when they offer a product that is much better.

07-09-2009, 11:38 AM	#14
deludel Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Durham, CT Posts: 196	Originally posted by maxwell1295 I think there's a misconception regarding Costco prints. Zenfolio/MPIX works well......I just hate to see Costco lumped in with the likes of CVS and Walgreens when they offer a product that is much better. Thank you - I stand corrected. I admit, I ASSUMED that Costco was in the same category .. noted, don't assume unless you have tried it yourself. ~Lori

07-09-2009, 07:28 PM	#15
maxwell1295 Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Long Island, New York Photos: Gallery Posts: 2,703	Originally posted by deludel Thank you - I stand corrected. I admit, I ASSUMED that Costco was in the same category .. noted, don't assume unless you have tried it yourself. ~Lori No problem Lori. That was just a general statement and not necessarily directed at you.....you just happened to be the one standing there. BTW, I like your previous avatar (the one in color) better...