[NecroticSoldier]

I recall reading that the average fast-food-joint manager earns more than the average working photographer. So get a job running a Burger Thing or Tim Horton's or whatever. Each day: Work 8 hours. Photograph 8 hours. Sleep 8 hours. On non-work days, travel and photograph 16 hours. Then back to sleep, and back to work.

Take your camera to work with you and fill in the spare moments. My artist sister moved from Nevada (painting murals in casinos) to New York City, and soon was working in the subways, selling tokens from little high-security booths. The bizarre customers she saw regularly became the subjects of her surrealistic art. Fast-food consumers can be just as worthy of preservation. Free models! Good light! Never a dull moment! Now you're a Restaurant Photographer! And you get paid!

Your other desires: Product photographer? Take classes in studio work; get an MFA. Portrait or event /wedding photographer? Be an unpaid gofer for a pro for a year or three, see how it's done -- it's called apprenticeship. Photojournalist? Get a degree in journalism, but avoid war zones. (Unless you take my suggestion to join the military as a photo specialist. Free training!)

And there's always blackmail. That's photojournalism, sort of...

Hmm for the other desires... should I go get a degree?

EDIT: I almost forgot the Ansel Adams approach: marry someone whose family runs the photo sales gallery in a national park.

Eh... Being a chef was my 2nd/3rd career plan (photography stuffs are also 2nd or 3rd) I can't do the Ansel Adams approach... also.

I should avoid warzones... but it adds an extra flare to the photography, makes it a bit more exciting (I've thought about joining the military... as... 5th career plan, but I'd rather shoot a gun than to shoot a camera out there.)

This is something to think about though ;P thanks for that statistic.

How sadly true. It's a tough way to make a living these days. Particularly as a wedding photographer. Studio work still has a better chance of doing well but also requires a much different skill set and a bigger investment.

Today's gear works so well that almost anyone can take the occasional good photo. As a result, they all think it's not worth paying much for.

Btw, I'm going to move this into the Business Forum.

Yeah ;( almost anyone can do it. Even my little brother!

[Peter Zack]

No you missed the point. Almost anyone can't do it. Look at all the crap on Facebook etc. Like everyone else here, I have seen some wedding, baby and portrait shots there that would make even the mother cry.

But the point is, Almost anyone can take a decent photo once in awhile. So as a result they think they can get 200 good shots at a wedding as long as they just hold the shutter button down for 6 hours. Only stopping to change cards and batteries. Somewhere in the 4000 frames they'll get a few keepers. That's what Pro's do isn't it?

[NecroticSoldier]

No you missed the point. Almost anyone can't do it. Look at all the crap on Facebook etc. Like everyone else here, I have seen some wedding, baby and portrait shots there that would make even the mother cry.

But the point is, Almost anyone can take a decent photo once in awhile. So as a result they think they can get 200 good shots at a wedding as long as they just hold the shutter button down for 6 hours. Only stopping to change cards and batteries. Somewhere in the 4000 frames they'll get a few keepers. That's what Pro's do isn't it?

Sorry ;(, I didn't get that... from the posts. That's true though. I see the ocassional decent photo, and heck I take about... 300 photos on a day out, but only 100 of them are decent and... maybe 2-10 are good.

Haha, (answers rhetorical question) NO! that's not what they do, they shoot sparingly and take actual time to compose the shot. They think of what they want in focus and what they do not. They must look at it with a trained eye, because only then they are truely seeing! It's a science! and an art!

Last wedding I went to... we had our pro cousin photographer take some pictures... but he's always busy and all over the place...

Sorry again, didn't get through to the me the first time I read it. (fail)

[RioRico]

I suppose my other answer would be, if you REALLY REALLY REALLY want to be a working photographer, GO FOR IT! Follow your dreams and obsessions! Nothing is ever accomplished by a reasonable person. But it means studying and studying, shooting and shooting, work work work.

If you're fascinated by certain things, shoot them: bands, bugs, naked people, naked dogs, lusty flowers, hot rocks, flowing water, volcanoes, wee beasties of the deep sea, graffiti, celebs, gangs, garbage, gizmos, whatever -- study them closely, and shoot. Build a portfolio or five. Find where markets are. Give yourself tough assignments to crack those markets, and to expand your range, and to accustom yourself to challenge. Get out there and hustle.

There's a lot of competition. Read Benjikan's posts and blog. Read everything here in the Professional & Business forum. Go to a physical library and read everything about the business of photography. Decide if it's really for you. Good luck.

[NecroticSoldier]

I suppose my other answer would be, if you REALLY REALLY REALLY want to be a working photographer, GO FOR IT! Follow your dreams and obsessions! Nothing is ever accomplished by a reasonable person. But it means studying and studying, shooting and shooting, work work work.

If you're fascinated by certain things, shoot them: bands, bugs, naked people, naked dogs, lusty flowers, hot rocks, flowing water, volcanoes, wee beasties of the deep sea, graffiti, celebs, gangs, garbage, gizmos, whatever -- study them closely, and shoot. Build a portfolio or five. Find where markets are. Give yourself tough assignments to crack those markets, and to expand your range, and to accustom yourself to challenge. Get out there and hustle.

There's a lot of competition. Read Benjikan's posts and blog. Read everything here in the Professional & Business forum. Go to a physical library and read everything about the business of photography. Decide if it's really for you. Good luck.

Thanks! I love shooting a lot of stuff... but they don't allow cameras into concerts anymore right? I really like taking a lot of things, but I guess I will have to narrow it down. I will read stuff and see if it really is for me, or am I just a hobby photographer.

[RioRico]

Thanks! I love shooting a lot of stuff... but they don't allow cameras into concerts anymore right?

Get to know bands, musicians. Hang out with them. Shoot them loafing around, at rehearsal, anywhere. Get invited to shoot them in concert, in the studio, on the bus. Take arts & design classes -- IIRC art students still form bands. Become the guy on the scene who shoots bands. Get into any club or dive where anybody is playing and shoot. Shoot the bouncers (and give them free prints). Shoot shoot shoot.

Get to know people in the local music/arts press. You must have some scene'zines around there, right? Give them your best shots for free (at first). Everybody in media needs material, always. Take journalism classes, cover the local music/arts scene on your own, start your own website -- make it the go-to place for local music/arts news, events, announcements, scandals. If the news and scandals are weak, invent some. Make the existing scene'zines come to YOU. It's been done before.

[johnmflores]

Put the photography aside for a moment and think about what kind of business you can flourish in. There was a study years ago that correlated the study habits of college students with their career paths. Simply put, those that studied in libraries needed structure and order and worked best in large corporate environments. Those that studied best in smaller workgroups liked the dynamic of small/midsize businesses. Those that studied alone in their rooms where comfortable blurring their personal and professional lives and did best as freelancers, sole proprietors, etc...

And be sure to take business and marketing classes. That's half the game. And learn how to network and represent yourself. That's the other half of the game. And work on your craft. That's the last half.

And don't assume that since it's more competitive that you can't make it. The rules are changing (i.e., newspaper photogs needing to shoot video) so be very aware of them. Realize that non-traditional opportunities are appearing - like him or not Ken Rockwell seems to be doing allright by just talking about cameras. And perfect the craft but also exercise your eye. Create a unique view, market it, and you may find success.

Good luck!

[jct us101]

I absolutely think that I would love having a job or career in photography. But every time that I think of it, the only things that pop into my mind are wedding photographers (that I have no experience doing, and don't think that I would really enjoy) and then photographers for things like magazine and stock photos. I know there's a lot of other things that you can do, such as journalism, but other than those small few, what else can you do with a job where all you do is take photos? Open a photo gallery?

[johnmflores]

I absolutely think that I would love having a job or career in photography. But every time that I think of it, the only things that pop into my mind are wedding photographers (that I have no experience doing, and don't think that I would really enjoy) and then photographers for things like magazine and stock photos. I know there's a lot of other things that you can do, such as journalism, but other than those small few, what else can you do with a job where all you do is take photos? Open a photo gallery?

Product photography, architecture, Sears Portrait Studio, etc...

Seriously, I know a guy that specializes in architecture. His stuff is used on the cover of architecture mags, brochures and websites for lux condos and townhomes, portfolios of interior decorators and architects, etc... He is a master at lighting scenes...

[quiksilver]

Totally agree with everything. I wanted to get out there so I could practice my skills. This came in the form of friends who were DJ's who then invited me to events, then to shoot them for promos.
It indeed is a smaller protion consiting of actual photography the rest is business and building relationships with people from what I have learned.
I am going for it on the side right now since I have more 'free' time I can not only read up more on lighting and techniques but also practice. Good luck.

[RioRico]

I absolutely think that I would love having a job or career in photography. But every time that I think of it, the only things that pop into my mind are wedding photographers (that I have no experience doing, and don't think that I would really enjoy)...

I shot one wedding (badly) and hated it. A bro-in-law shot weddings for years, and loved it. Again, all a matter of personal style and taste. Teh bro-in-law also shot schools, and corporate events, even seminars. These latter are part of marketing. I know of some who shoot stills and videos of business conferences, then sell edited DVDs of the proceedings. Not exciting enough for me, but it's a living.

what else can you do with a job where all you do is take photos? Open a photo gallery?

In some towns, that's you and everybody else. Bisbee Arizona is wall-to-wall galleries, some excellent, some not, some not lasting very long. If I'd stayed longer, I'd likely have had a gallery too.

January 2009 we'd 'won' a cruise ship outing. Ever been on a cruise ship? Embarking, you run a gauntlet of photographers. Onboard, you run the gauntlet of photographers targeting YOU constantly whilst you stagger between pool, games, feeding troughs, and your cabin. At ports of call, the terminal entrances swarm with photographers targeting YOU. If you sign up for a tour, each stop swarms with... you guessed it, photographers targeting YOU. Disembarking, your luggage is stuffed with copies of the photos and DVDs you've been persuaded to buy. (Not me. I ducked my face, and bought a couple paintings.)

My point is, organized tourism is big. Anyplace where people gather for forced fun -- cruises, ski slopes, theme parks, etc -- are possible targets for photographic enterprise. I'm 1.5 hours from Lake Tahoe. At boat tour docks, aerial trams / ski lifts, lakeside eateries -- photographers sell their services. Some are obviously making a living at it.

And Tahoe's better shopping minimalls have photo-art galleries, some run by the shooters. I've seen some GREAT mountainscape / wildlife work there. So a gallery in the right location / destination might work.

[Itai]

Well, I did the transition from part-time hobby to a full time photography career less than two years ago and I spoke to many photographers about it. There is a huge difference in those two states of being a photographer.

The advice from most is that the easiest way to be pro and pay the bills is to do weddings. They occur all the time and pay good money with little expense and little risk from the photographer. BUT you have to love that. The only way to do something well is to really enjoy doing it, so this is not the route I chose.

The options left are wide but all certainly harder. You have a fork in the road and you must choose to take pictures before or after being paid.

For the former, you go with stock agencies. You assume all the risk (going places, gear, etc) and the competition is extremely harsh because people easily undersell each other for all but truly unique shots. The advantage is that you are not constraint to the work you produce, you should what you want, wait for the right time and conditions and go where you want.

For the latter, you spend so much time on the phone and writing letters that it feels like a second full-time job, at least that is what it feels for me. Then, the pressure is on because this time you get sent with a budget and time constraint to take original pictures of specific things and events. It is not like find fantastic pictures in an ernoumous portfolio, you have to produce such pictures on demand in a location and time of someone else's choosing. That is much harder.

Yet what matters is do you love taking pictures? Is that what you want to do above all else? Do you wake up before everyone to take the perfect picture and you you keep shooting when everyone else folded their tripods? If yes, you have what it takes. You need to show the world and someone will pay you for it one day.

Good luck!

- Itai
Neoluminance | Fine Art Photography by Itai Danan

[NecroticSoldier]

Well, I did the transition from part-time hobby to a full time photography career less than two years ago and I spoke to many photographers about it. There is a huge difference in those two states of being a photographer.

The advice from most is that the easiest way to be pro and pay the bills is to do weddings. They occur all the time and pay good money with little expense and little risk from the photographer. BUT you have to love that. The only way to do something well is to really enjoy doing it, so this is not the route I chose.

The options left are wide but all certainly harder. You have a fork in the road and you must choose to take pictures before or after being paid.

For the former, you go with stock agencies. You assume all the risk (going places, gear, etc) and the competition is extremely harsh because people easily undersell each other for all but truly unique shots. The advantage is that you are not constraint to the work you produce, you should what you want, wait for the right time and conditions and go where you want.

For the latter, you spend so much time on the phone and writing letters that it feels like a second full-time job, at least that is what it feels for me. Then, the pressure is on because this time you get sent with a budget and time constraint to take original pictures of specific things and events. It is not like find fantastic pictures in an ernoumous portfolio, you have to produce such pictures on demand in a location and time of someone else's choosing. That is much harder.

Yet what matters is do you love taking pictures? Is that what you want to do above all else? Do you wake up before everyone to take the perfect picture and you you keep shooting when everyone else folded their tripods? If yes, you have what it takes. You need to show the world and someone will pay you for it one day.

Good luck!

- Itai
Neoluminance | Fine Art Photography by Itai Danan

That was inspiring! Sadly though... I love my music more than photography right now, but I really do like taking pictures, I'd love to take pictures from 6am - 1am... but I think I'd be physically exhausted. Not sure if I like taking pictures of weddings... but I love being at weddings... does that count? hehe.

[justinr]

Photography as a career?

Over the past few weeks I have attended two large charity events, a show put on by a local players group, the towns confirmation ceremony and a concert.

The hundreds of photos taken have been put on my site or forwarded to the subjects. I have had phone calls and emails telling me how wonderful they are, so how many prints do you think I've sold? Go on guess...


Yep....



That's right......



One.

[SpecialK]

Photography as a career?


The hundreds of photos taken have been put on my site or forwarded to the subjects. I have had phone calls and emails telling me how wonderful they are, so how many prints do you think I've sold? Go on guess...


Yep....



That's right......



One.

And you probably bought it yourself :-)