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02-03-2012, 06:26 AM   #241
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QuoteOriginally posted by Clavius Quote
Well, I'm not trying to detract anybody. I myself see the benefits of the shorter registry distance. But we have to be open and honest about everything, both the pro's and the cons of both mirrored and mirrorless systems.
Could not agree more. But as of late, it seems there are more people that are vehemently promoting it as the only solution to photography, which is rather disturbing.

02-03-2012, 06:46 AM   #242
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I have to say that I like the design a lot. Very functional and sparse.
02-03-2012, 07:04 AM   #243
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QuoteOriginally posted by benjikan Quote
I have to say that I like the design a lot. Very functional and sparse.
Oh great - it appeals to the "fashion crowd!"

I actually wish there was more Marc Newson in the design. Sparse+organic!
02-03-2012, 07:13 AM - 1 Like   #244
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QuoteOriginally posted by K1D27H Quote
Could not agree more. But as of late, it seems there are more people that are vehemently promoting it as the only solution to photography, which is rather disturbing.
Well mirrorless is the big thing right now and we can expect some fanboyism to be percolating through. There is (was) the 4/3rd group, we have the FF segment, etc etc. It's important to some to justify their personal preferences as being superior over others. I'm not implying that everyone here that is pro mirrorless is over the top, but it gets a bit tiring to see a few who are quick to jump on others when they indicate a preference for SLRs.

Can you imagine if we used the same philosophy for food? Arguing to others that their enjoyment of spicy food is somehow wrong. Belittling others because they like oysters, insisting that beef results in a "better" taste bud reaction.

Photography is one of the few areas that mixes creativity / art with technogeekness, which creates a volatile mix of two very different genre of people.

As far as the K-01 goes...I like it and think it's different than what else is out there on the market. That's a good thing!


Last edited by SteveM; 02-03-2012 at 07:19 AM.
02-03-2012, 07:14 AM   #245
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QuoteOriginally posted by panoguy Quote
Oh great - it appeals to the "fashion crowd!"

I actually wish there was more Marc Newson in the design. Sparse+organic!
Well, if you want organic, DigitalRev added some green fluff to the k-r, so I'm sure you can do that with the K-01.
02-03-2012, 08:40 AM   #246
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QuoteOriginally posted by Clavius Quote
That defies logic.
I've seen many things defying your logic recently, Clavius. I am now following your posts for entertainment value only.
02-03-2012, 08:54 AM   #247
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QuoteOriginally posted by SteveM Quote
Well mirrorless is the big thing right now and we can expect some fanboyism to be percolating through. There is (was) the 4/3rd group, we have the FF segment, etc etc. It's important to some to justify their personal preferences as being superior over others. I'm not implying that everyone here that is pro mirrorless is over the top, but it gets a bit tiring to see a few who are quick to jump on others when they indicate a preference for SLRs.

Can you imagine if we used the same philosophy for food? Arguing to others that their enjoyment of spicy food is somehow wrong. Belittling others because they like oysters, insisting that beef results in a "better" taste bud reaction.

Photography is one of the few areas that mixes creativity / art with technogeekness, which creates a volatile mix of two very different genre of people.
Did you follow this thread before commenting? The mirrorless comments you are picking on were simply addressing a concern expressed in the post below. John and I described our experience and some people were irked to have their dust gathering hypothesis contradicted. What kind of talk do you actually expect on a thread about a mirrorless camera?

QuoteOriginally posted by Catalana Quote
It is a pre-production model, so who knows, but now I am wondering how long the sensor will stay clean if it gets exposed that much during lens changes.
QuoteOriginally posted by SteveM Quote
As far as the K-01 goes...I like it and think it's different than what else is out there on the market. That's a good thing!
So you're not concerned that dust will gobble up on your sensor and eat its IQ? You some mirrorless fanboy or something? Clavius no like you mister!

02-03-2012, 09:06 AM   #248
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At least people will stop saying, Pentax should make a mirror-less camera. They'll just start saying Pentax should make a better mirror-less camera. The FF people are already saying Pentax should make a FF mirror-less camera, I think one even said there should be a 645 mirror-less camera. Pentax should make a mirror-less camera witha OVF, a tilting screen, I'd like one with a built in condom dispenser in case mirror-less is really as sexy as everyone wants it to be. The more things change, the more they stay the same.
I wonder, all these people who want stuff... maybe what we need is just a set of camera hardware and software that you can manufacture your own case for in any configuration you want. A funny collection of ciruit boards with buttons hanging off wires, just waiting to be mounted in the correct places. It could come with your full set of sensors so if APS-c isn't good enough just install an FF or 645. Radio Shack where are you now that we really need you? I think I'd build a 4x5 camera with a 30 inch monitor to view the image, front and back tilt accesses and a robot to move the thing around for me. I don't want to carry my camera I want to drive it, like an ATV , and maybe a jet pack so I could shoot from 60 feet in the air when necessary or the big game gets too close. IQ? If I got my way, I'd show y'all some freaking IQ.

Maybe before we get into these discussions .. we really need to ask... what problem are you trying to solve? Many solutions create new problems. As far as I can see, we've pretty much pushed the limits with what we've done. The only thing that cam make any difference at all in IQ, as I see it would be improved sensor technology. And that can be applied to any camera.


Last edited by normhead; 02-03-2012 at 09:29 AM.
02-03-2012, 09:47 AM   #249
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QuoteOriginally posted by SteveM Quote
Well mirrorless is the big thing right now and we can expect some fanboyism to be percolating through. There is (was) the 4/3rd group, we have the FF segment, etc etc. It's important to some to justify their personal preferences as being superior over others. I'm not implying that everyone here that is pro mirrorless is over the top, but it gets a bit tiring to see a few who are quick to jump on others when they indicate a preference for SLRs.
I'd hazard a guess that anyone here talking about their experiences with mirrorless have shot or still shoot with dSLRs and have a body of real world experience that I suspect many dismissing mirrorless lack.

My K-5 is the big dog in a kennel of otherwise mirrorless cameras. I've spent significant time and invested significant money on both sides of the divide.

My experiences not matching your notions doesn't make me a fanboy.
02-03-2012, 09:54 AM - 1 Like   #250
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QuoteOriginally posted by Laurentiu Cristofor Quote
Did you follow this thread before commenting?

So you're not concerned that dust will gobble up on your sensor and eat its IQ? You some mirrorless fanboy or something? Clavius no like you mister!

Yes, and actually, I was commenting on a large number of threads and posts on this forum as of late that pit Mirrorless against SLRs.

As mentioned in my post, there appear to be people that are taking their personal preference to religious extremes.

Here is the difference.......while my personal preference is to use an SLR, I am not saying there is anything *wrong* with Mirrorless cameras. For me an SLR might be better, but I am not saying that they are instinctively better, nor are I demanding that they are better for others. I am not declaring that the next SLR will be the end of Mirrorless or vise-versa.

There are pros and cons to both. Which aspects you value are based on personal preference. It's fine to communicate what one feels is better, but it's arrogant to argue that someone else's preference is somehow wrong.

People might like the K-01 for they way it looks. People might think it's too small....or large, be annoyed that it takes K mount lenses which demand it be larger, or whatever. I think it's important to put things into perspective. What might be good for one person isn't good for another.
02-03-2012, 09:57 AM   #251
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QuoteOriginally posted by johnmflores Quote
I'd hazard a guess that anyone here talking about their experiences with mirrorless have shot or still shoot with dSLRs and have a body of real world experience that I suspect many dismissing mirrorless lack.

My K-5 is the big dog in a kennel of otherwise mirrorless cameras. I've spent significant time and invested significant money on both sides of the divide.

My experiences not matching your notions doesn't make me a fanboy.
Agreed, and I wasn't implying that you specifically were a fanboy. Again, just because someone prefers one over the other is fine. If anything, your posts have shown some balance.
02-03-2012, 10:22 AM   #252
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QuoteOriginally posted by SteveM Quote
Agreed, and I wasn't implying that you specifically were a fanboy. Again, just because someone prefers one over the other is fine. If anything, your posts have shown some balance.
Thank for a reasonable response!
02-03-2012, 10:34 AM   #253
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What I find humorous about the whole "mirrorless means the death of SLR" is that when the first SLRs came out, there were probably those who shouted (in smoky rooms with leather arm-chairs, as "forums" were like back then) "oh no, SLR will mean the death of mirrorless cameras!" But rangefinders and other non-SLR cameras never really went away - they've just been waiting to be popular again.
02-03-2012, 10:37 AM   #254
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QuoteOriginally posted by falconeye Quote
The time you push the trigger, the first curtain closes, the exposure begins, the first curtain opens, the second curtain closes, exposure stops, and second curtain rewinds to the default open position. In a normal shutter, both curtains would have to rewind after an exposure taken.
Or they use a similar technique as Canons silent-mode with an electronic first curtain so when the exposure begins there is no mechanical movement at all (merely a clearing of the sensor in a way that mimics the movement of a first curtain), but the exposure ends with an mechanical curtain.
02-03-2012, 12:34 PM   #255
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QuoteOriginally posted by Gimbal Quote
Or they use a similar technique as Canons silent-mode with an electronic first curtain
True, but an electronic first curtain shutter requires support from the sensor.

AFAIK, the K-5 sensor does not have it. However, the NEX-5N does have it, so it will be interesting to observe where the K-01 stands in this respect.
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