Do we like it or not

eddie1960 · 02-02-2012, 10:09 AM

Originally posted by chuckp8

As many have stated prior, the lack of a viewfinder is a deal killer for me... but!

Maybe there will be another version on the horizon for people looking for a replacement K5. They can split the line into mirror less/no viewfinder with single numbers (K1) and another model with a viewfinder that has a D attached to it (K1-D). That way they can use the same numbers by splitting the line in two.

Unlikely, yes, but hey, a guy can dream can't he? I still like Pentax, still happy with my K10 & K5 and look forward to their next move.

This is not a K5 level camera. yes it has the same sensor. but this is aimed at kr and below. the kr replacement will be an SLR variant of this camera the K5 replacement will be 24 Mp and have all the upgrades here (and probably more)

I'm endlessly amused at the idea that every release should appeal to enthusiasts. this is the beginning for this category not the end I'm sure.

**boriscleto** · 02-02-2012, 10:09 AM

Originally posted by Geoff H

But put a viewfinder on it and then you'd have a camera as big as a KX? Is that the future for Pentax - no new KX but a weird looking pseudo SLR with AVF? The size is the biggest issue - if it's as big as an SLR but offers nothing beyond them at the same time as losing the viewfinder why buy one for a second body? A small SLR would do the same. I would hope any KX replacement will have the 16mpx and video capabilities - certainly the Nikon 3100 replacement will have and at a similar price.

Just a deeply puzzling camera for me. I really hope it works out and that there are many people looking for such a camera as I've been a 100% pentax man for 35 years and love my K5 to bits.

The K-x was replaced, by the K-r. The K-r replacement is forthcoming.

northcoastgreg · 02-02-2012, 10:12 AM

I suspect that a lot of the negativity toward the K-01 stems from too many people wanting this mirrorless camera to be a merely a substitute DSLR without a mirror. But that doesn't really play to the strengths of mirrorless, now does it? The primary strength of mirrorless is the reduced size; but because Pentax wished to keep the K-Mount (and they've already done the reduced-size thing with the Q), Pentax tried to leverage another supposed strength: reduced cost. With the XS lens it's also fairly compact, though not optimally so. But life's about tradeoffs. If you want to keep the K-Mount, you're going to get a bigger camera.

I suspect the lack of a VF is to keep the price down. I also suspect that, further on down the road, we'll see an accessory VF, as is quite common with these sort of cameras.

I must have no fashion sense at all, but I don't find the camera ugly. Admittedly, it's not really my cup of tea, but that's because I don't really care for mirrorless cameras. However, as long as a camera works and is not sticky to the touch or smells bad, I don't care what it looks like, and am rather surprised that other people do. (I wonder how many would find it ugly if it had a VF or an FF sensor?)

I think the camera has real potential for fans of mirrorless, particularly when Pentax gets around to creating a VF accessory for it.

Gyre · 02-02-2012, 11:39 AM

Great camera on the specs anyway waiting for reviews. So many people are whinging about what this camera is not instead of looking at what it is. It has a great sensor, good video specs, has a K mount, and is reasonably sized. If there is not room in your bag for it that is fine but there are a lot of people that will be able to see a use for it if they are not distracted my all the moaning. I am not a huge fan of the styling but I think it is miles above the current crop of Sonys. Most of all it is a breath of fresh air and a great start in an expanding market segment. I am glad it is not a 'me too' mirrorless and look forward to the future of the platform.

**grahame** · 02-02-2012, 02:04 PM - **1 Like**

Interesting camera. I saw many are disappointed with the size: it is not much smaller than K-X or even K5 .But to be compatible with K-mount lenses without an adapter, the camera has to be at least that much "thick" and "high". i guess they can make it narrower, but are you sure you want a camera in that shape? Hard to grip at least with a heavier tele lens.
It is not for me because I cannot shoot seriously without a viewfinder. But someone must feel OK without it.
i wish it has all manual control on video recording. We will see. to me, video is what the 01 made for.

johnmflores · 02-02-2012, 02:07 PM - **1 Like**

Funny, if someone had told the forum last year that in 2012 we'd have K-5 performance for K-r money, people would be dancing in the streets.

chuckp8 · 02-02-2012, 04:25 PM

Originally posted by eddie1960

This is not a K5 level camera. yes it has the same sensor. but this is aimed at kr and below. the kr replacement will be an SLR variant of this camera the K5 replacement will be 24 Mp and have all the upgrades here (and probably more)

I'm endlessly amused at the idea that every release should appeal to enthusiasts. this is the beginning for this category not the end I'm sure.

Hey Eddie.

Perhaps it was my mistake to guess that since this camera is called a K1 it would be replacing the K5 (as opposed to Kr-1 or Ks replacing the Kr), but I don't think I've seen anyone here saying that all cameras that Pentax releases should appeal to every enthusiast of the brand. I just see some folks commenting about what they think of this new camera, both good and bad.

While overreaction and hang wringing about the features of a new camera can be tiring, I find that the mocking tone others take with them is worse.

Regards.

trublubiker · 02-02-2012, 05:21 PM

First up, let me say that I don't dislike the camera.

As far as looks go I'm not a 'colour' person, basic black is my go, so function is much more important than appearance.

And it is in the area of function that the designers seem to have lost the plot. I have read all the pros and cons on the lack of an eye level viewfinder and the cons seem to be leading by about 20 to 1.

I have to ask the designers what were they thinking when they conceived the biggest and heaviest mirrorless SL camera on the market, and decided it could do without either an OVF or an EVF.

OK, it may be manageable to focus for some at arms length with the Limiteds, but I'll be surprised if most of the fairer sex don't find it to heavy for them.

Now try it with your 16-50mm f2.8, 600g with hood. That's camera @ 560g and 16-50 @ 600g, total 1160g, or about 2 1/2lb for the non metric folk. Don't even think about your 60-250mm or 300mm without a tripod or monopod. That's right, this 'P & S' beater will need propping up for most of the lens that it supports.

With our arms away from our body, we lose the ability to stabilise the camera. As I said above "What were they thinking"?

I guess I'm a little disappointed that the brand I have chosen to invest in has made what I perceive to be some fundamental errors in design.

And yes, I do have Pentax gear. My new K5, DA15, DA40, DA*300, M 1.7, F 70-210, Sigma 70-210 etc.

I believe the K-01 will be well received by the predominantly video/occasional stills shooters.

I hope there is some way an OVF/EVF can be attached and offered as an option.

As a Pentax shooter I want to see the brand flourish and that will only happen if we are offered well thought out and well engineered products.

konraDarnok · 02-02-2012, 05:31 PM

Originally posted by trublubiker

I have to ask the designers what were they thinking when they conceived the biggest and heaviest mirrorless SL camera on the market, and decided it could do without either an OVF or an EVF.

I ask the same question about *lighter* and thinner implementations of mirrorless cameras. The entire NEX line looks unwieldy to say the least. I, personally, would rather have an eye level viewfinder or even better a waist level viewfinder -- but if you have to hold the thing at arm's length, weight and larger size is an advantage for taking clear images.

These tiny cameras with large lenses are goofy. In that that respect alone the k-01 does a better job than most mirrorless options.

hcarvalhoalves · 02-02-2012, 05:51 PM

Originally posted by johnmflores

Funny, if someone had told the forum last year that in 2012 we'd have K-5 performance for K-r money, people would be dancing in the streets.

Jeez, I would be dancing right now too. The problem is that they've put all this performance in a crippled body without a VF. How good are features if you can't even use the camera.

arnie0674 · 02-02-2012, 06:01 PM

Originally posted by hcarvalhoalves

How good are features if you can't even use the camera.

No wonder its so cheap. you cant even use it!

hcarvalhoalves · 02-02-2012, 06:11 PM

Originally posted by arnie0674

No wonder its so cheap. you cant even use it!

I couldn't word it better myself

I mean, they get a K-5, take away the mirror, the viewfinder, put in a non-WR body of dubious taste (to their merit, I will say they really put good video features, but that's simply an area were Pentax lagged behind the market, so they just did the home work there). Then they charge $ 800. Am I supposed to think this is a deal? It removed more features than it added!

arnie0674 · 02-02-2012, 06:15 PM

Originally posted by hcarvalhoalves

I couldn't word it better myself

I mean, they get a K-5, take away the mirror, the viewfinder, put in a non-WR body of dubious taste (to their merit, I will say they really put good video features, but that's simply an area were Pentax lagged behind the market, so they just did the home work there). Then they charge $ 800. Am I supposed to think this is a deal? It removed more features than it added!

It is half the price. Does the mirror, viewfinder and WR really cost an extra $750 (list)?

Look, if those features are important to your needs and you are willing to pay for them, then get a k5. AFAIK, they are still selling them.

Docrwm · 02-02-2012, 06:19 PM

Originally posted by claimed4all

Looks like Tv & Av are on the dial. Not sure where you heard that they were taken away, but they are still there.

Thanks. Those along with M & P with the new HDR. Again, there has been such a mashup of fantasy and reality on this one. Some of the pre-release blogs had it as not having those modes. Reality is looking better for it, although it still seems tuned primarily for P&S transitioners and video.

hcarvalhoalves · 02-02-2012, 06:31 PM

Originally posted by arnie0674

It is half the price. Does the mirror, viewfinder and WR really cost an extra $750 (list)?

Look, if those features are important to your needs and you are willing to pay for them, then get a k5. AFAIK, they are still selling them.

Nah... the K-5 is at $ 1000 now.

Besides, that's not the point, people who want a K-5 can just buy a K-5. The point is that they released a camera that, performance-wise, is just as good as the K-5, but is crippled since it just takes away features (VF, WR) without adding anything back.

How good is a body $ 300 cheaper if you can't even use it? Not to mention that it featuring a K-mout is close to useless. Using it with anything other than AF primes will be an lesson in bad ergonomics, since you have to hold it at arms-length. Double-failure.

02-02-2012, 11:39 AM	#94
Gyre New Member Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: Wyoming Photos: Albums Posts: 15	What it is and is not Great camera on the specs anyway waiting for reviews. So many people are whinging about what this camera is not instead of looking at what it is. It has a great sensor, good video specs, has a K mount, and is reasonably sized. If there is not room in your bag for it that is fine but there are a lot of people that will be able to see a use for it if they are not distracted my all the moaning. I am not a huge fan of the styling but I think it is miles above the current crop of Sonys. Most of all it is a breath of fresh air and a great start in an expanding market segment. I am glad it is not a 'me too' mirrorless and look forward to the future of the platform.

02-02-2012, 02:04 PM - 1 Like	#95
grahame Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Aug 2011 Photos: Albums Posts: 2,041	If you like the K-mount like I do, you will have to except the size Interesting camera. I saw many are disappointed with the size: it is not much smaller than K-X or even K5 .But to be compatible with K-mount lenses without an adapter, the camera has to be at least that much "thick" and "high". i guess they can make it narrower, but are you sure you want a camera in that shape? Hard to grip at least with a heavier tele lens. It is not for me because I cannot shoot seriously without a viewfinder. But someone must feel OK without it. i wish it has all manual control on video recording. We will see. to me, video is what the 01 made for.

02-02-2012, 10:09 AM	#91
eddie1960 Veteran Member Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: Toronto Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 13,667	Originally posted by chuckp8 As many have stated prior, the lack of a viewfinder is a deal killer for me... but! Maybe there will be another version on the horizon for people looking for a replacement K5. They can split the line into mirror less/no viewfinder with single numbers (K1) and another model with a viewfinder that has a D attached to it (K1-D). That way they can use the same numbers by splitting the line in two. Unlikely, yes, but hey, a guy can dream can't he? I still like Pentax, still happy with my K10 & K5 and look forward to their next move. This is not a K5 level camera. yes it has the same sensor. but this is aimed at kr and below. the kr replacement will be an SLR variant of this camera the K5 replacement will be 24 Mp and have all the upgrades here (and probably more) I'm endlessly amused at the idea that every release should appeal to enthusiasts. this is the beginning for this category not the end I'm sure.

02-02-2012, 10:09 AM	#92
boriscleto Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: North Syracuse, NY Photos: Gallery Posts: 16,477	Originally posted by Geoff H But put a viewfinder on it and then you'd have a camera as big as a KX? Is that the future for Pentax - no new KX but a weird looking pseudo SLR with AVF? The size is the biggest issue - if it's as big as an SLR but offers nothing beyond them at the same time as losing the viewfinder why buy one for a second body? A small SLR would do the same. I would hope any KX replacement will have the 16mpx and video capabilities - certainly the Nikon 3100 replacement will have and at a similar price. Just a deeply puzzling camera for me. I really hope it works out and that there are many people looking for such a camera as I've been a 100% pentax man for 35 years and love my K5 to bits. The K-x was replaced, by the K-r. The K-r replacement is forthcoming.

02-02-2012, 10:12 AM	#93
northcoastgreg Pentaxian Join Date: Feb 2010 Location: Northern Michigan Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 6,175	I suspect that a lot of the negativity toward the K-01 stems from too many people wanting this mirrorless camera to be a merely a substitute DSLR without a mirror. But that doesn't really play to the strengths of mirrorless, now does it? The primary strength of mirrorless is the reduced size; but because Pentax wished to keep the K-Mount (and they've already done the reduced-size thing with the Q), Pentax tried to leverage another supposed strength: reduced cost. With the XS lens it's also fairly compact, though not optimally so. But life's about tradeoffs. If you want to keep the K-Mount, you're going to get a bigger camera. I suspect the lack of a VF is to keep the price down. I also suspect that, further on down the road, we'll see an accessory VF, as is quite common with these sort of cameras. I must have no fashion sense at all, but I don't find the camera ugly. Admittedly, it's not really my cup of tea, but that's because I don't really care for mirrorless cameras. However, as long as a camera works and is not sticky to the touch or smells bad, I don't care what it looks like, and am rather surprised that other people do. (I wonder how many would find it ugly if it had a VF or an FF sensor?) I think the camera has real potential for fans of mirrorless, particularly when Pentax gets around to creating a VF accessory for it.

02-02-2012, 02:07 PM - 1 Like	#96
johnmflores Veteran Member Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: Somerville, NJ Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 5,361	Funny, if someone had told the forum last year that in 2012 we'd have K-5 performance for K-r money, people would be dancing in the streets.

02-02-2012, 04:25 PM	#97
chuckp8 Junior Member Join Date: Aug 2011 Location: Los Angeles Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 33	Originally posted by eddie1960 This is not a K5 level camera. yes it has the same sensor. but this is aimed at kr and below. the kr replacement will be an SLR variant of this camera the K5 replacement will be 24 Mp and have all the upgrades here (and probably more) I'm endlessly amused at the idea that every release should appeal to enthusiasts. this is the beginning for this category not the end I'm sure. Hey Eddie. Perhaps it was my mistake to guess that since this camera is called a K1 it would be replacing the K5 (as opposed to Kr-1 or Ks replacing the Kr), but I don't think I've seen anyone here saying that all cameras that Pentax releases should appeal to every enthusiast of the brand. I just see some folks commenting about what they think of this new camera, both good and bad. While overreaction and hang wringing about the features of a new camera can be tiring, I find that the mocking tone others take with them is worse. Regards.

02-02-2012, 05:21 PM	#98
trublubiker Senior Member Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Hunter Valley NSW AUSTRALIA Posts: 143	First up, let me say that I don't dislike the camera. As far as looks go I'm not a 'colour' person, basic black is my go, so function is much more important than appearance. And it is in the area of function that the designers seem to have lost the plot. I have read all the pros and cons on the lack of an eye level viewfinder and the cons seem to be leading by about 20 to 1. I have to ask the designers what were they thinking when they conceived the biggest and heaviest mirrorless SL camera on the market, and decided it could do without either an OVF or an EVF. OK, it may be manageable to focus for some at arms length with the Limiteds, but I'll be surprised if most of the fairer sex don't find it to heavy for them. Now try it with your 16-50mm f2.8, 600g with hood. That's camera @ 560g and 16-50 @ 600g, total 1160g, or about 2 1/2lb for the non metric folk. Don't even think about your 60-250mm or 300mm without a tripod or monopod. That's right, this 'P & S' beater will need propping up for most of the lens that it supports. With our arms away from our body, we lose the ability to stabilise the camera. As I said above "What were they thinking"? I guess I'm a little disappointed that the brand I have chosen to invest in has made what I perceive to be some fundamental errors in design. And yes, I do have Pentax gear. My new K5, DA15, DA40, DA*300, M 1.7, F 70-210, Sigma 70-210 etc. I believe the K-01 will be well received by the predominantly video/occasional stills shooters. I hope there is some way an OVF/EVF can be attached and offered as an option. As a Pentax shooter I want to see the brand flourish and that will only happen if we are offered well thought out and well engineered products.

02-02-2012, 05:31 PM	#99
konraDarnok Veteran Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Photos: Albums Posts: 969	Originally posted by trublubiker I have to ask the designers what were they thinking when they conceived the biggest and heaviest mirrorless SL camera on the market, and decided it could do without either an OVF or an EVF. I ask the same question about lighter and thinner implementations of mirrorless cameras. The entire NEX line looks unwieldy to say the least. I, personally, would rather have an eye level viewfinder or even better a waist level viewfinder -- but if you have to hold the thing at arm's length, weight and larger size is an advantage for taking clear images. These tiny cameras with large lenses are goofy. In that that respect alone the k-01 does a better job than most mirrorless options.

02-02-2012, 05:51 PM	#100
hcarvalhoalves Pentaxian Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: São Paulo, Brazil Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,019	Originally posted by johnmflores Funny, if someone had told the forum last year that in 2012 we'd have K-5 performance for K-r money, people would be dancing in the streets. Jeez, I would be dancing right now too. The problem is that they've put all this performance in a crippled body without a VF. How good are features if you can't even use the camera.

02-02-2012, 06:01 PM	#101
arnie0674 Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2012 Photos: Albums Posts: 173	Originally posted by hcarvalhoalves How good are features if you can't even use the camera. No wonder its so cheap. you cant even use it!

02-02-2012, 06:11 PM	#102
hcarvalhoalves Pentaxian Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: São Paulo, Brazil Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,019	Originally posted by arnie0674 No wonder its so cheap. you cant even use it! I couldn't word it better myself I mean, they get a K-5, take away the mirror, the viewfinder, put in a non-WR body of dubious taste (to their merit, I will say they really put good video features, but that's simply an area were Pentax lagged behind the market, so they just did the home work there). Then they charge $ 800. Am I supposed to think this is a deal? It removed more features than it added!

02-02-2012, 06:15 PM	#103
arnie0674 Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2012 Photos: Albums Posts: 173	Originally posted by hcarvalhoalves I couldn't word it better myself I mean, they get a K-5, take away the mirror, the viewfinder, put in a non-WR body of dubious taste (to their merit, I will say they really put good video features, but that's simply an area were Pentax lagged behind the market, so they just did the home work there). Then they charge $ 800. Am I supposed to think this is a deal? It removed more features than it added! It is half the price. Does the mirror, viewfinder and WR really cost an extra $750 (list)? Look, if those features are important to your needs and you are willing to pay for them, then get a k5. AFAIK, they are still selling them.

02-02-2012, 06:19 PM	#104
Docrwm Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2010 Location: Somewhere in the Southern US Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 12,285	Originally posted by claimed4all Looks like Tv & Av are on the dial. Not sure where you heard that they were taken away, but they are still there. Thanks. Those along with M & P with the new HDR. Again, there has been such a mashup of fantasy and reality on this one. Some of the pre-release blogs had it as not having those modes. Reality is looking better for it, although it still seems tuned primarily for P&S transitioners and video.

02-02-2012, 06:31 PM	#105
hcarvalhoalves Pentaxian Join Date: Aug 2010 Location: São Paulo, Brazil Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,019	Originally posted by arnie0674 It is half the price. Does the mirror, viewfinder and WR really cost an extra $750 (list)? Look, if those features are important to your needs and you are willing to pay for them, then get a k5. AFAIK, they are still selling them. Nah... the K-5 is at $ 1000 now. Besides, that's not the point, people who want a K-5 can just buy a K-5. The point is that they released a camera that, performance-wise, is just as good as the K-5, but is crippled since it just takes away features (VF, WR) without adding anything back. How good is a body $ 300 cheaper if you can't even use it? Not to mention that it featuring a K-mout is close to useless. Using it with anything other than AF primes will be an lesson in bad ergonomics, since you have to hold it at arms-length. Double-failure.