Forgot Password
Pentax Camera Forums Home
 

Reply
Show Printable Version Search this Thread
02-02-2012, 01:31 PM   #16
Veteran Member
wlachan's Avatar

Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Canada
Photos: Albums
Posts: 2,626
QuoteOriginally posted by klkitchens Quote
I said "in normal lighting"
Words have meaning indeed. What is "normal" lighting? LCD on the back of any cameras are difficult to see on overcast days already. On sunny days, LCD is useless. Are those abnormal lighting? Also, viewfinder has the advantage of being less prone to camera shake due to the way the cameras will be held.

02-02-2012, 01:33 PM   #17
Veteran Member
dgaies's Avatar

Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Maryland / Washington DC
Posts: 3,917
QuoteOriginally posted by klkitchens Quote
I said "in normal lighting"
How exactly do you define "normal light"?
02-02-2012, 01:39 PM   #18
Veteran Member
hcarvalhoalves's Avatar

Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: São Paulo, Brazil
Posts: 836
Original Poster
QuoteOriginally posted by v5planet Quote
Because Canon and Nikon have really released strong contenders to the mirrorless market already, and Pentax's efforts end in 2012 with the K-01. Please.

You may not be happy with this offering, but please point me to the APS-C mirrorless cameras that Nikon and Canon currently offer. I am not aware of any. Also, it's called the K-zero-one for a reason. Expect changes and improvements to come in future iterations.
They don't have APS-C, but Pentax doesn't have a mirrorless with a viewfinder either. It's a draw for me.

And is it just how it is, the first product has to suck, and then you hold on expectations for the future? Why couldn't they release something that makes sense today - simply a K-mount mirrorless with a viewfinder?

In the timeframe it will take Pentax to release any new iteration on this, the competitors will probably have put forth 3-4 other models each. Just look at how many models Fuji (which was basically dead in the market) was able to pump in the last semesters. As soon as Canon or Nikon release an APS-C mirrorless able to take native mount lenses, with a decent EVF, Pentax will be out of the big game of an upcoming market - again.
02-02-2012, 01:50 PM   #19
Veteran Member
hcarvalhoalves's Avatar

Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: São Paulo, Brazil
Posts: 836
Original Poster
QuoteOriginally posted by konraDarnok Quote
I read it. I can understand wanting an eye-level viewfinder; that makes sense, and the k-5 has one. But I fail to see what you want an electronic one for specifically.
For one, an EVF offers many things lost since the 35mm-era, as well as new features:

A big viewfinder
Big, 100% coverage VF. Comparing the viewfinder in my ME - a comparatively tiny camera - with the ones in current DSLRs makes me wanna cry.

Doesn't have to black-out at smaller apertures / low-lighthing
Since image brightness can be increased via software. Makes it useful for long-exposures, ND-filters, etc.

Actually previews the correct DoF on fast lenses

Can show all kinds of information overlayed
For instance, can show where highlights or shadows blow, assistances for manual focus, levels, etc.

And all that without adding bulk to the camera. Not mention a mirrorless doesn't have a mirror or many movable parts, making it, in theory, a much more robust product.

The downside currently is the lack of constrast-ratio of current LED screens used in EVFs, but as soon as there's market demand for it, I don't see why those screens can't improve, specially considering how much it evolved in the past 1-2 years.

02-02-2012, 01:54 PM   #20
Pentaxian
v5planet's Avatar

Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Seattle
Photos: Albums
Posts: 1,904
QuoteOriginally posted by hcarvalhoalves Quote
They don't have APS-C, but Pentax doesn't have a mirrorless with a viewfinder either. It's a draw for me.

And is it just how it is, the first product has to suck, and then you hold on expectations for the future? Why couldn't they release something that makes sense today - simply a K-mount mirrorless with a viewfinder?

In the timeframe it will take Pentax to release any new iteration on this, the competitors will probably have put forth 3-4 other models each. Just look at how many models Fuji (which was basically dead in the market) was able to pump in the last semesters. As soon as Canon or Nikon release an APS-C mirrorless able to take native mount lenses, with a decent EVF, Pentax will be out of the big game of an upcoming market - again.
You could make the exact same argument about Nikon's J1. "It's a mirrorless, sure, but it doesn't have an EVF and isn't even APS-C! Clearly not appropriate for my uses. Why do first iterations of a product have to suck? It's not exactly what I wanted yet." People in Nikon forums are making those exact complaints.

This is an emerging format based around technologies that are not mature. Pentax may not win the race, but having a lead on your competitors counts for a lot.
02-02-2012, 01:59 PM   #21
Pentaxian
konraDarnok's Avatar

Join Date: Aug 2007
Photos: Albums
Posts: 960
QuoteOriginally posted by hcarvalhoalves Quote
For one, an EVF offers many things lost since the 35mm-era, as well as new features:

A big viewfinder
Big, 100% coverage VF. Comparing the viewfinder in my ME - a comparatively tiny camera - with the ones in current DSLRs makes me wanna cry.

Doesn't have to black-out at smaller apertures / low-lighthing
Since image brightness can be increased via software. Makes it useful for long-exposures, ND-filters, etc.

Actually previews the correct DoF on fast lenses

Can show all kinds of information overlayed
For instance, can show where highlights or shadows blow, assistances for manual focus, levels, etc.

And all that without adding bulk to the camera. Not mention a mirrorless doesn't have a mirror or many movable parts, making it, in theory, a much more robust product.

The downside currently is the lack of constrast-ratio of current LED screens used in EVFs, but as soon as there's market demand for it, I don't see why those screens can't improve, specially considering how much it evolved in the past 1-2 years.



I actually agree that the future of cameras is EVF for all those reasons. But, that would be a successor to the K-5 -- not this camera. Which is not intended to be the next iteration of Pentax's flagship.
02-02-2012, 02:03 PM   #22
Veteran Member
hcarvalhoalves's Avatar

Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: São Paulo, Brazil
Posts: 836
Original Poster
QuoteOriginally posted by konraDarnok Quote
I actually agree that the future of cameras is EVF for all those reasons. But, that would be a successor to the K-5 -- not this camera. Which is not intended to be the next iteration of Pentax's flagship.
Well, but do you agree that Pentax would have a much more appealing product if they just added an EVF to the K-01? It may be not a perfect replacement for OVF right now, but why not settle for 80% instead of half-baked? I don't get it.

If they released this with EVF and WR, at a $ 1000 price point, they would still have a hit, arguably the best MILC in the market. But instead they released something that is just meh, mainly a K-mount camcorder in camera form-factor.
02-02-2012, 02:06 PM   #23
Veteran Member
wlachan's Avatar

Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Canada
Photos: Albums
Posts: 2,626
QuoteOriginally posted by hcarvalhoalves Quote
Well, but do you agree that Pentax would have a much more appealing product if they just added an EVF to the K-01? It may be not a perfect replacement for OVF right now, but why not settle for 80% instead of half-baked? I don't get it.
Now which Pentax DSLR isn't 1/2 baked?

02-02-2012, 02:07 PM   #24
Site Supporter
Vylen's Avatar

Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Sydney, Australia
Photos: Gallery
Posts: 1,248
QuoteOriginally posted by hcarvalhoalves Quote
For one, an EVF offers many things lost since the 35mm-era, as well as new features:

A big viewfinder
Big, 100% coverage VF. Comparing the viewfinder in my ME - a comparatively tiny camera - with the ones in current DSLRs makes me wanna cry.

Doesn't have to black-out at smaller apertures / low-lighthing
Since image brightness can be increased via software. Makes it useful for long-exposures, ND-filters, etc.

Actually previews the correct DoF on fast lenses

Can show all kinds of information overlayed
For instance, can show where highlights or shadows blow, assistances for manual focus, levels, etc.

And all that without adding bulk to the camera. Not mention a mirrorless doesn't have a mirror or many movable parts, making it, in theory, a much more robust product.

The downside currently is the lack of constrast-ratio of current LED screens used in EVFs, but as soon as there's market demand for it, I don't see why those screens can't improve, specially considering how much it evolved in the past 1-2 years.
No-one has really answered it clearly - ignoring lighting conditions, how would an EVF be "better" than using the bigger 3" screen on the back of the body? One person has said that it's less prone to camera shake because of the way you hold it, but each person is different so it may be the case for some and not for others.

Actually, lets put it like this. You have a mythical K-5 successor with an EVF, and the K-01 with its live-view screen. You're indoors in a well lit room (think a shopping mall, I guess) and they're both tripod mounted.

What advantages are there in an EVF, and what are the advantages in a live-view screen.
02-02-2012, 02:07 PM   #25
Veteran Member
hcarvalhoalves's Avatar

Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: São Paulo, Brazil
Posts: 836
Original Poster
QuoteOriginally posted by wlachan Quote
Now which Pentax DSLR isn't 1/2 baked?
Now you are just trolling
02-02-2012, 02:09 PM   #26
Veteran Member
wlachan's Avatar

Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Canada
Photos: Albums
Posts: 2,626
QuoteOriginally posted by hcarvalhoalves Quote
Now you are just trolling
I knew it!
02-02-2012, 02:12 PM   #27
Veteran Member
kent's Avatar

Join Date: May 2009
Location: Lithuania
Photos: Gallery
Posts: 344
Sorry haters, but I have to say, K-01 looks awesome. Case closed, good night
02-02-2012, 02:12 PM   #28
Veteran Member
hcarvalhoalves's Avatar

Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: São Paulo, Brazil
Posts: 836
Original Poster
QuoteOriginally posted by Vylen Quote
Actually, lets put it like this. You have a mythical K-5 successor with an EVF, and the K-01 with its live-view screen. You're indoors in a well lit room (think a shopping mall, I guess) and they're both tripod mounted.

What advantages are there in an EVF, and what are the advantages in a live-view screen.
Sure, because in 99% of the cases, that's the condition people shoot pictures. Indoors, and they take a tripod everywhere.

Are you serious?
02-02-2012, 02:13 PM   #29
Site Supporter
Vylen's Avatar

Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Sydney, Australia
Photos: Gallery
Posts: 1,248
QuoteOriginally posted by hcarvalhoalves Quote
Sure, because in 99% of the cases, that's the condition people shoot pictures. Indoors, and they take a tripod everywhere.

Are you serious?
Yes, quite. I'm asking an "even" question where variables involving differing people would result in different answers.
02-02-2012, 02:20 PM   #30
Loyal Site Supporter
eddie1960's Avatar

Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Toronto
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 12,168
QuoteOriginally posted by hcarvalhoalves Quote
For one, an EVF offers many things lost since the 35mm-era, as well as new features:

A big viewfinder
Big, 100% coverage VF. Comparing the viewfinder in my ME - a comparatively tiny camera - with the ones in current DSLRs makes me wanna cry.

Doesn't have to black-out at smaller apertures / low-lighthing
Since image brightness can be increased via software. Makes it useful for long-exposures, ND-filters, etc.

Actually previews the correct DoF on fast lenses

Can show all kinds of information overlayed
For instance, can show where highlights or shadows blow, assistances for manual focus, levels, etc.

And all that without adding bulk to the camera. Not mention a mirrorless doesn't have a mirror or many movable parts, making it, in theory, a much more robust product.

The downside currently is the lack of constrast-ratio of current LED screens used in EVFs, but as soon as there's market demand for it, I don't see why those screens can't improve, specially considering how much it evolved in the past 1-2 years.

first the Kx finder you use is a lousy finder compared to old film ones, but Pentax has said all future OVF will be 100% finders. i imagine the dimmer pentamirror will be the low end and the pentaprism will remain in the high end. The large 35mm finder is a function of the larger film size. a FF body will have a large OVF.
one of the reasons to buy up to a K5/K7 is the brighter Pentaprism finder.
all the other reason apply to the LCD as well.

Projected overlays could also be done for some of the ideas on an OVF.

Reality is the is the entry product not the top model. it's the first step into the market and stiocks to a reasonable pricve. The Nex 7 has what you want (at a much higher price. so does the Xpro1 also a much higher price. the Nex 5 optional EVF adds $400 to the nex price (sony store price), the NEX OVF is $250 (like the Q one) - which i find stupidly expensive.

I'm pretty certain when the enthusiast mirrorless arrives it will add the EVF WR, dual wheels etc. thias just isn't the camera that will be targeted at you
(the new kr which likely is this camera with a 100% OVF and PDAf focus may well be an alternative for some people
Reply

Bookmarks
  • Submit Thread to Facebook Facebook
  • Submit Thread to Twitter Twitter
  • Submit Thread to Digg Digg
Tags - Make this thread easier to find by adding keywords to it!
body, camera, evf, k-01, k-mount, k01, mirrorless, mode, pentax, pentax k-01, sense, video
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
When will Pentax 12-35mm going to be released? catastrophe Pentax SLR Lens Discussion 2 09-22-2011 10:07 AM
Sigma 85mm/1.4 price for Pentax mount now released. Pentaxor Pentax SLR Lens Discussion 91 10-25-2010 08:14 PM
Pentax 645D to be released April 2010 Freevision Pentax News and Rumors 164 03-25-2010 09:16 PM
What did the k-7 cost when released? alehel Pentax DSLR Discussion 3 02-28-2010 04:42 AM
Pentax RAW codec released for Vista joele Pentax News and Rumors 5 04-30-2007 06:17 AM



All times are GMT -7. The time now is 01:47 PM. | See also: NikonForums.com, part of our network of photo forums!
  • Red (Default)
  • Green
  • Gray
  • Dark
  • Dark Yellow
  • Dark Blue
  • Old Red
  • Old Green
  • Old Gray
  • Dial-Up Style
Hello! It's great to see you back on the forum! Have you considered joining the community?
register
Creating a FREE ACCOUNT takes under a minute, removes ads, and lets you post! [Dismiss]
Top