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02-14-2012, 12:55 PM   #646
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QuoteOriginally posted by Raffwal Quote
The sensor technology advanced at such a pace that often a new sensor of a certain size nearly wipes the floor with bigger sensors of previous generation. Like the K-5 sensor seemed to measurbate better than earlier FF sensors in other aspects than high ISO. Now a fresh µ4/3 sensor competes very well (and perhaps even "wins") the great APS-C sensor.

It'll be very interesting to see where we're in some years. And also, what will a FF sensor of today's best technology be capable of.
Don't forget Dynamic Range, thats crucial, as anyone who's taken a picture outdoors on a sunny day can attest to. It's the limited DR that gives that unpleasant "digital" feeling on prints.

and we'll find out soon enough what the latest FF sensors bring to the table with the upcoming D4 and D800.

02-14-2012, 01:35 PM   #647
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Lets face it guys ( n gals )
Since the advent of the D300, Digital has just about cracked it. Top end cameras are now easily outperforming the lenses.
Its as important, if not more important now to fit the best glass as you can afford or suits your requirments.
The quality of the pic now firmly rests on just how good your lens is.
Even Dynamic range has been vastly improved on four thirds and is no longer a problem either.
I think we have reached a point that IQ is hardly relevent in top end cameras since they all produce amazing results.
Choices now will be far more about camera spec and how it feels and opperates and the lens system etc.
You can now choose what suits you firstly in format size. Do you go for four thirds with lots of DOF and great ability for shooting large aprature lenses with high
quality or shallow deph of feild control offered by full frame and better for huge prints and low noise or the middle ground of APSC offering poss the best of both worlds.
02-14-2012, 02:31 PM   #648
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We are looking at the Panasonic version and I expect the Olympus version to be better. Lighter AA filter and generally better detail. Panasonic has always trailed Olympus on IQ when they are using the same sensor.
The GX-1 might not be using the same sensor as the E-M5. Some people over on the 4/3 boards seem to think the new E-M5 will have the same sensor as the soon to be announced GH-3. The GH series of camera have the ADC built onto the sensor. I'm not sure if this is the same sensor as what is in the GX-1.

Not even sure if Panasonic makes it. Samsung has been trying to sell Olympus for a while now.

And there is a new chapter of the “sensor mystery story”! The Olympus manager Toshiyuki Terada revealed in an interview with Quesabesde (Click here): “It’s true we have used Panasonic sensors in the past, but this time we can’t tell the name of the E-M5 sensor maker. I have to say this is an all new sensor.”

M4/3 market share is growing faster than any other, so any one would be happy to supply sensors given the volume and high yields.

There is rumor that Sony has a new sub-20MP APS-C sensor under development. We might see a new 18MP+/- Sony sensor with measurably better DR/noise than the current 16MP. I don't know if it is being developed exclusively for Nikon and the new D400. The 36MP developed for the D800 is a Nikon exclusive until 2013 according to SR. Nikon does sell enough APS-C bodies to justify exclusive use for a period of time.
02-14-2012, 02:34 PM   #649
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what's "SR"?

and don't say Shake Reduction

02-14-2012, 02:48 PM   #650
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QuoteOriginally posted by illdefined Quote
what's "SR"?

and don't say Shake Reduction
Sony Rumors. They have been pretty accurate on sensor technology over the past year.

The D800 has a 36MP

The A99 will have a 24MP (new design)

There is a new sub-20MP sensor under design. The 24MP Sony NEX-7 has been having some problems with certain lenses that the 16MP NEX-5n has not been having. More color shifts and fringing. Not sure if it is sensor related, but people who have both have reported that the 24MP sensor is not playing nice with some older glass. Might be more than the older lenses can handle. I'm not talking about cheap lenses either. I was looking at some samples from a Voightlander on both the NEX-5n and NEX-7 that showed color shifts/fringing in the corners when used on the NEX-7, but not the NEX-5n. Could be a image processing issue?
02-14-2012, 02:52 PM   #651
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I dont really want to go bigger than 16 million pixels so with luck it will just be improved 16 million pixel.
All you get is silly file sizes. More than 18 million and I will prob desert lol.
I love the E5 but I dont think Olympus plan to produce anymore SLR otherwise I wouldnt hessitate.
Oddly I left olympus originaly because the file sizes were to small for some of my clients. That was the 5 million pixel E1 though.
How quickly things change lol. 16 million pixels actualy exceeds my needs but its nice to have the quality and speed.
02-14-2012, 02:57 PM   #652
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with all these advances in sensors, the GXR system with a mount module starts to make even more sense.
02-14-2012, 02:58 PM   #653
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QuoteOriginally posted by Winder Quote
We are looking at the Panasonic version and I expect the Olympus version to be better. Lighter AA filter and generally better detail. Panasonic has always trailed Olympus on IQ when they are using the same sensor.
The GX-1 might not be using the same sensor as the E-M5. Some people over on the 4/3 boards seem to think the new E-M5 will have the same sensor as the soon to be announced GH-3. The GH series of camera have the ADC built onto the sensor. I'm not sure if this is the same sensor as what is in the GX-1.

Not even sure if Panasonic makes it. Samsung has been trying to sell Olympus for a while now.

And there is a new chapter of the “sensor mystery story”! The Olympus manager Toshiyuki Terada revealed in an interview with Quesabesde (Click here): “It’s true we have used Panasonic sensors in the past, but this time we can’t tell the name of the E-M5 sensor maker. I have to say this is an all new sensor.”

M4/3 market share is growing faster than any other, so any one would be happy to supply sensors given the volume and high yields.
This would be great news, if the E-M5 has a better sensor than the GX-1. The only real hesitation I have before purchasing the E-M5 is the possible lack of DR compared to current APS-C sensors. I'd like to take it hiking/backpacking, and would most likely be doing some landscape photography with it. It would be a shame to miss out on the super DR of the K-5 just to save some weight. I'll probably wait and see, unless I get an itchy trigger finger before it gets reviewed..

02-14-2012, 03:13 PM   #654
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hmm, not a Panasonic sensor? that's worrying.

it'll be tough to outdo the GX1 sensor at that size. Unless it's made by Sony, I'd be a little nervous.
02-14-2012, 08:25 PM   #655
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QuoteOriginally posted by illdefined Quote
don't judge the hair as noise thing for the K-5, a lot of that is the old lens DPR uses (FA 50 I believe). If you want to judge read noise look at a dark spot, here I posted these last night on another thread:
There is one strange problem of pictures of DPREVIEW. Need to convert yourself.
I've downloaded Pentax K-5's files, opened it in ACR, converted in JPEG with NR put to 0 and got much better results than my eyes see at the sample of DPREVIEW...
02-14-2012, 08:47 PM   #656
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QuoteOriginally posted by ogl Quote
There is one strange problem of pictures of DPREVIEW. Need to convert yourself.
I've downloaded Pentax K-5's files, opened it in ACR, converted in JPEG with NR put to 0 and got much better results than my eyes see at the sample of DPREVIEW...
The tests are always rigged at DPReview in favor of their favourite brands. That is the reason I stop looking at image comparison section and look somewhere else like imagingresource.
02-14-2012, 11:00 PM   #657
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QuoteOriginally posted by K1D27H Quote
The tests are always rigged at DPReview in favor of their favourite brands. That is the reason I stop looking at image comparison section and look somewhere else like imagingresource.
By the way, I've downloaded DPREVIEW's RAW files of K-5. I thought that K-5 is out of focus. Checked it and was surprised...
02-14-2012, 11:14 PM   #658
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QuoteOriginally posted by ogl Quote
By the way, I've downloaded DPREVIEW's RAW files of K-5. I thought that K-5 is out of focus. Checked it and was surprised...
Rather funny on their review "....and suggests that the K-5 has a particularly light anti-aliasing filter". And yet in the forum of DPR a person said "D7000 vs K-5 and the K-5 is lower resolution. HOWEVER, it is because it has a stronger AA filter, you can clearly see aliasing in the NEX 5n and D7000 that both share the same sensor"

Another thing to make me believe I should not take this site seriously anymore.

Also, I was a long time lurker of this forum and read that K-5 softness debacle too many times over.

Last edited by K1D27H; 02-15-2012 at 01:00 AM.
02-15-2012, 09:13 AM   #659
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Test Olympus OM-D E-M5 : galerie d'images - Focus Num

RAW files are now available for download of the E-M5 for those interested.

It does appear that the E-M5 will have better IQ than the GX1. Better than the Canon 7D, but still not quite as good as the K-5. But for a 4/3 sensor is this pretty amazing.

Last edited by Winder; 02-15-2012 at 09:36 AM.
02-15-2012, 10:05 AM   #660
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QuoteOriginally posted by Winder Quote
Test Olympus OM-D E-M5 : galerie d'images - Focus Num

RAW files are now available for download of the E-M5 for those interested.

It does appear that the E-M5 will have better IQ than the GX1. Better than the Canon 7D, but still not quite as good as the K-5. But for a 4/3 sensor is this pretty amazing.
How to convert it? JPEG shows NR at all ISO. The results are worse than my K200D. K-r level is higher level in terms noise/colour/details/sharpness.

http://img1.focus-numerique.com/focus/articles/1380/olympus-om-d-e-m5-preserie-exemple22.jpg
it's very close to IQ of Nikon 1...for me.

Last edited by ogl; 02-15-2012 at 10:11 AM.
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