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03-11-2012, 02:31 AM   #31
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If there is so many negativity about the K-01 that it even requires its own thread, then there probably is some truth to that negativity too.

But I don't think it has anything to do with the K-01 camera itself. As stated before here in this thread. People are afraid this is THE way Pentax is going, replacing all high quality DSLR. A simple roadmap would give people a lot of rest. If that map confirms that Pentax will stop with real DSLRs, then all the "haters" can jump ship and move on. Not bothering the small amount of stayers for very long. And if the roadmap confirms DSLRs are here to stay, then not a hater will ever mention the mirrorless niche again. Heck, it doesn't even have to be a roadmap, just a mere statement would do MAGIC.


Last edited by Clavius; 03-11-2012 at 03:10 AM.
03-11-2012, 02:56 AM   #32
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Why all the drama in this thread? Since photography is a hobby for most posters here, it's only natural to be passionately for or against a product. It's not like the world is coming to an end. Also, in my opinion critical views have as much place here as positive ones. After all, this is a discussion forum and not the Pentax/Ricoh marketing department.

I personally do not hate the K-01 at all. They did so many things just right. But personally I do not understand why on earth did they release it with no built-in or external VF. So I'm not buying it for sure.

While talking about hating a product, there's the Q - which I have admittedly never even seen in reality...
03-11-2012, 03:08 AM - 1 Like   #33
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I love my k-5 sitting on the shelf. It looks so solid and stern. With its fancy 31ltd.
I love my q in my small purse. It handles so extremely well. A breeze.
MMMMmmmmmmm ... k-01, I wonder how that one would be. Curious I am.
My, you can focus with ovf evf amoledscreen ... or focuszone (ricoh comes to mind) (ah yeh that is someting pentaxy now too) and carry super featherweight or concreteheavyblockcams or a middle weight ... and all have quality to offer.
I am standing in front of the shopwindow with eager eyes and a pounding hart ... when I was 8 years old I had the same feeling standing in front of the shopwindow, only then I scrutinzed dolls. Heaving real children now I decided camera's are better toys.
03-11-2012, 04:16 AM   #34
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QuoteOriginally posted by monochrome Quote
My confidence in Pentax's and Ricoh's plans is well-founded.

My skin is thick enough, thank you very much. I have been openly and in PM's labeled an "unserious." photographer whose opinion is not as meaningful as one from more accomplished and informed members, JohnMFlores has literally been chased out of the Forum. Asahiflex isn't posting much. You may not have "seen" personal attacks, but they are happening and they are real.

The PM's are - interesting. Several good members have PM'ed me that this might be a good time to retire from the Forum for a while - perhaps they are correct.

Opinions are fine. Everyone is entitled to them. Badgering people who disagree isn't acceptable behavior.The Forum is approaching dpreview in its tone - a sad commentary.
This is what is sad to me. People always have differing opinions about things, but to drive people out of the forum because they are excited about the K-01 is plain wrong.

There seem to be two points of view about it. One is that it is too big (should have been four thirds) and the other is that it isn't big enough (should have had a good sized EVF). Either way it is what it is. Pentax said very clearly in their interview with Adam, very recently, that they aren't doing away with optical viewfinders any time soon, but certainly if the K-01 does well, it could launch a whole parallel line of cameras that will help support the k mount nicely.

03-11-2012, 05:25 AM   #35
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QuoteOriginally posted by monochrome Quote
My confidence in Pentax's and Ricoh's plans is well-founded.

My skin is thick enough, thank you very much. I have been openly and in PM's labeled an "unserious." photographer whose opinion is not as meaningful as one from more accomplished and informed members, JohnMFlores has literally been chased out of the Forum. Asahiflex isn't posting much. You may not have "seen" personal attacks, but they are happening and they are real.

The PM's are - interesting. Several good members have PM'ed me that this might be a good time to retire from the Forum for a while - perhaps they are correct.

Opinions are fine. Everyone is entitled to them. Badgering people who disagree isn't acceptable behavior.The Forum is approaching dpreview in its tone - a sad commentary.
Hmmm, I don't see any really personal attacks from you to anyone on this thread.

The problem is that even this site is 'im'personal.

Personal attacks in Private Messages are bad.

I joined here because it seemed to be friendly. Maybe it's not any more.
03-11-2012, 05:58 AM   #36
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QuoteOriginally posted by WWWench Quote
I am getting so tired of fellow Pentax photographers being vitriolic about the K-01, most IMHO, have never even held it!
It's almost like posting Pentax kudos or info in a Canon forum.

-- We all have noticed it has no mirror or prism viewfinder --
You should have seen the hate with the Q...
03-11-2012, 06:17 AM   #37
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QuoteOriginally posted by Clavius Quote
If there is so many negativity about the K-01 that it even requires its own thread, then there probably is some truth to that negativity too.

But I don't think it has anything to do with the K-01 camera itself. As stated before here in this thread. People are afraid this is THE way Pentax is going, replacing all high quality DSLR. A simple roadmap would give people a lot of rest. If that map confirms that Pentax will stop with real DSLRs, then all the "haters" can jump ship and move on. Not bothering the small amount of stayers for very long. And if the roadmap confirms DSLRs are here to stay, then not a hater will ever mention the mirrorless niche again. Heck, it doesn't even have to be a roadmap, just a mere statement would do MAGIC.
Your bias is showing. I guess I'm in the small group.
03-11-2012, 06:18 AM   #38
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QuoteOriginally posted by mtansley Quote
Hmmm, I don't see any really personal attacks from you to anyone on this thread.

The problem is that even this site is 'im'personal.

Personal attacks in Private Messages are bad.

I joined here because it seemed to be friendly. Maybe it's not any more.
Remember this all started January 26th.

03-11-2012, 06:21 AM   #39
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With a night to sleep on this - it just doesn't matter. It is a consumer product or maybe a tool for someone to earn a living with (though they all seem to have moved on by now). It isn't something that will change the world if Ricoh never silvers another mirror.

And what makes everyone so self-important that Pentax should tell you what their plans are anyway? As I've said, some posters on this Forum aren't getting what they want RIGHT NOW so they've thrown a six seek temper tantrum.
03-11-2012, 06:38 AM   #40
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Apologies for posting a non-Pentax image. I do it to show what's possible without an eyepiece-style viewfinder. To take this photo I needed to stand on a rock while hanging over the water gripping a tree with my left hand. The camera (Lumix LX5, LCD-only) was in my right hand and my right arm was extended as far as possible over the water. I was able to frame the picture using the screen. This picture would have been impossible if I was relying on a so-called traditional viewfinder.

I'm an experienced photographer. Using an LCD to frame is just a different way of working. It has its own advantages. The idea that only beginners use LCDs and "real" photographers use viewfinders is a myth. There's a fairly well-known pro who does street photography using a Ricoh P&S; Alex Majoli won photojournalist of the year in 2003 using an Olympus C5050Z; I just read of a pro who won a Guggenheim award with an iPhone. Also, Ansel Adams.

I do love a good optical viewfinder - check out the Sony A900 some time - but given a choice between an LCD or an eyepiece style EVF, I would rather use the screen. I find EVFs annoying and difficult to frame, but that's just me and my opinion. I don't go in to forums and pound on EVF cameras based on my dislike. That wouldn't be fair.

But I will defend a camera from misplaced criticism. Especially one I consider a potential gem. Life is full of possibilities. The viewfinder-only advocates might do better challenging their own comfort zones, instead of posting anti-K01 comments here.

BTW, this link will take you to a website of my travel photos using a Pentax K7 w. a 16-50 zoom in central America.
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03-11-2012, 07:06 AM   #41
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QuoteOriginally posted by Venturi Quote
I really haven't seen many (any?) people bashing K-01 owners (TBF I'm not looking either), only people bashing the K-01 itself and/or Pentax's folly in producing two "alt" cameras while discontinuing 50% of their dSLR line and not even hinting that they are going to continue producing dSLRs.
Since I've actually gotten this beautiful camera and have been busy mastering it and shooting with it, I haven't been looking either, but in the month of February after its announcement, this forum was littered with nasty comments about the sort of person who might buy the K-01. The comments boiled down to two basic types: earnest, self-proclaimed "serious" photographers who maintained that Pentax was going after the "unserious" photographer market, the kind of people who were only used to low-end point-and-shoots. These comments were/are less blatantly insulting and more casually dismissive. The other type also came from self-proclaimed "serious" photographers, were snarky and mean, were blatanly insulting, and suggested that the type of person who would buy this camera were only doing so because they wanted a fashion accessory. One particularly nasty person went on a tirade that stopped just short of being a personal attack, ranting and raving about those of us who didn't mind the fact that there was no viewfinder were making ridiculous justifications, despite the fact that this person had been repeatedly told that some of us have medical reasons why viewfinders are difficult to use ....

I could go on here. Some of us received nastygram PMs about this. The vitriol about this camera is really, seriously out of control.

I'm a new member of the forum and I have to conclude that the portion in the tagline about this place being "friendly" is true and that this is all an anomaly. In any case, I've been on the internetz since forever and I know how these things work, but still, I can't recall a simple camera stirring up so much hatred among a certain set. And the funny thing is, it seems restricted to here and to other hardcore camera-tech geek types.

Others, the kind of people who just like to take good photos as opposed to arguing about what gear you use to take those photos with, seem really intrigued by this camera. A friend of mine, who is the executive director of the only fine art photography center in this region, is really interested in it and told me that she's jealous that I have one already!
03-11-2012, 07:25 AM   #42
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Nice to hear from reasonable people, they may not like some part of the camera but if others do like that part, great.

That's what it SHOULD be about.

I do remember some other thread where someone made the comment that ANYONE who used Facebook in any way was practically a moron. I had to restrain myself on that one, my friend list is about 25 (people I REALLY know) and my wife's is limited to a couple of old school friends in England who she chats to. FB is quite a good way to keep in touch with people. If people don't like it or don't use it, fine. Don't insult ME because I do.

People sending nasty PM's should basically be banned outright. People posting nasty public messages should be restricted or banned after a warning.

It does look a nice camera.

MY personal concern after using DSLRs is how usable is the camera in bright sunlight without a shaded viewfinder of any type.

Anyone like to provide a good comment about that?
03-11-2012, 07:58 AM   #43
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QuoteOriginally posted by Venturi Quote
...Pentax's folly in producing two "alt" cameras while discontinuing 50% of their dSLR line and not even hinting that they are going to continue producing dSLRs.
Such drama, 50%! I can go to a major reseller like Amazon.com and order a K-5 and K-r. It is not unusual to stop the manufacture of a product with moonths or years worth of supply warehoused.

Why would Pentax need to "hint" that they are going to produce DSLRs, when that is the core business? Does everyone need to"hint" at a product far in advance, or else you lose confidence?

I'd say that the recently released lens roadmap "hints" that more DSLRs are in the works.
03-11-2012, 08:00 AM   #44
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QuoteOriginally posted by Clavius Quote
People are afraid this is THE way Pentax is going, replacing all high quality DSLR.
Were people afraid when Pentax started selling P&S cameras?
03-11-2012, 08:20 AM   #45
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QuoteOriginally posted by mtansley Quote

MY personal concern after using DSLRs is how usable is the camera in bright sunlight without a shaded viewfinder of any type.

Anyone like to provide a good comment about that?
That is a real and reasonable question. So far none of the few members who has a K-01 has yet to comment on that limitation - that I have seen. I wear a hat with a wide brim (to shield my bald pate from sun) that I expect will solve that problem.

I won't be able to test that issue for a day or two - maybe a quick lunch break tryout Tuesday.

FWIW, my intended use is primarily with manual focus lenses that are extremely difficult for me to use with a modern dSLR viewfinder. I've kept my hobby going since 2007 by finding those vintage Pentax film bodies that have bright, split-image focusing screens.

One thing almost no one has discerned yet is how to hold the camera. Many immediately imagine it must be held like a compact Point-and-Shoot (and they sneer at that). Rather, the camera should be held like an SLR was held in the film days - cradled in the left palm, arms in at the sides, strong body position, raised to just BELOW eye level. There should be no "holding at arms' length" weight problem. I HOPE I can use the K-01 up to 200mm lenses. I don't have anything longer besides a light DA55~300, and if I did I would use a dSLR for that purpose. Video is an interesting and new aspect of the hobby that I plan to explore. This camera may actually be a preferred tool for that.

I've responded in this fashion, with these points, on thread after thread after thread and these suggestions have been summarily dismissed, as ibkc.pointed out above.

I am a reasonably self confident person and couldn't care what some anonymous person in "who knows where" posts, quoting my previous comment. I am a long-term Pentax user - since the late 60's.

I believe (with some reason to support my belief) Ricoh plans to develop the Pentax brand and compete for a place in the dSLR market. Ricoh has stated they are hiring engineers back; Pentax has stated the K-5 will stay in production throughout 2012; the Prime M imaging engine is an advancement; the DA560/5.6 prototype is a physical indication and the published lens roadmap is at least a statement of intent of the plans. The K=r replacement question is valid - perhaps Ricoh out that on hold as they assimilate Pentax into their company.

Certainly Pentax can change direction at any moment and there is nothing any of us can do about it. If they do then I have a bag full of lenses whose market value will disappear overnight - but then there might be some really nice lenses available at significantly reduced prices overnight! Those members. though, (not including mtansley) who would now defend their recent posts by dissembling and stating they were "sending a message" to Pentax are at best being disingenuous and perhaps intentionally argumentative.

The K-01 isn't for every user, nor for every situation, any more than an XA was in the film era, but it has a place for many enthusiasts and in many camera bags. Due to recent eye surgeries that have made focusing through a standard eyepiece at best uncomfortable I'm now selling most of my film cameras and hope to have the K10D, the K-01 and an LX as my enthusiast tools.

I don't think I am being unreasonable when I point out the irrational response to the K-01 - but perhaps I should have followed Mike Cash's advice on day 3 and just added the K-01 Forum to my Ignore list. Th best responses will be images - they should start appearing shortly.

[EDIT] Here's a more tame post from just a few minutes ago that illustrates our point about the tone of PF recently. Pentax can't be a "serious" camera company because colored cameras aren't "serious" cameras. Ergo, a K-01 user can't be a serious photographer, HEE Hee Hah Hah - look, a K-01.

Last edited by monochrome; 03-11-2012 at 08:32 AM.
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