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03-27-2012, 12:11 PM   #31
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QuoteOriginally posted by regor Quote
Hum... to me the 'subject' appears properly exposed, it's just not the desired effect, which is to expose for the background, and fill in with the flash. To me it looks and sounds like the camera is simply doing what it is told to do, i.e. expose the subject that would otherwise underexposed properly. Confusing I admit, but without a dedicated "fill in Flash" mode, how is the camera supposed to know what you want to do ?
Well, I see why you'd think that, but the camera was in full matrixed metering mode, so it should have balanced the entire scene. And note that this is with the flash exposure turned all the way down to -0.2EV. For spot metering, I'd expect this result, though even for spot metering it's still overexposed. What's missing is the "fill flash" capability that every other camera I've owned has had. For a (very nice, very capable) "snapshot" camera, it should have this somewhere, even if it's in the scene modes. But I couldn't find it anywhere.

I still like the K-01. It's just a shame that this capability is buggy.

03-27-2012, 12:14 PM   #32
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FWIW, the rubber door doesn't bother me, but I can see how it's not implemented very well. Since lots of these rubber doors close by pressing in, I'm sure lots of people try to close it that way, with varying success. The K-01 door actually operates somewhat like the K5 door, in that it slides out parallel to the body, then swings open. With a flexible rubber door, that can be a little tricky to do. However, if done this way, my door always sits flush with no bumps or gaps.
03-27-2012, 12:40 PM   #33
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I was looking at sunset mode as an option but it appears flash will not fire in sunset mode.
03-27-2012, 02:40 PM   #34
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QuoteOriginally posted by monochrome Quote
I was looking at sunset mode as an option but it appears flash will not fire in sunset mode.
I don't understand. According to the Manual p59 (I don't have a K-01), the Flash has a slow-synch mode, which quote: "When using this to shoot a portrait with the sunset in the background, both the person and the background are captured beautifully.", so what other "sunset mode" are you looking for ? Ditto for Fill-in Flash,which should always be in Slow-Synch mode, i.e.the camera exposes as without the Flash.

03-27-2012, 03:36 PM   #35
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QuoteOriginally posted by rfortson Quote
Well, I see why you'd think that, but the camera was in full matrixed metering mode, so it should have balanced the entire scene. And note that this is with the flash exposure turned all the way down to -0.2EV. For spot metering, I'd expect this result, though even for spot metering it's still overexposed. What's missing is the "fill flash" capability

I've tried every possible metering mode, but it doesn't work - outside of full manual override of settings. In relation to the original post; it was tried in aperature priority with one of the "more open" settings - I believe f4.0 or so. And since it was daylight and all; the camera still kept the original aperature and then the shutter speed dropped to the sync speed, almost automatically overexposed the pic.

Technically it is fixable under full manual and with sopme experimentation.

Also I'll be looking into some off camera settings, also with GN's base upon metered lighting
03-27-2012, 04:12 PM   #36
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QuoteOriginally posted by regor Quote
I don't understand. According to the Manual p59 (I don't have a K-01), the Flash has a slow-synch mode, which quote: "When using this to shoot a portrait with the sunset in the background, both the person and the background are captured beautifully.", so what other "sunset mode" are you looking for ? Ditto for Fill-in Flash,which should always be in Slow-Synch mode, i.e.the camera exposes as without the Flash.
There is quite a number of scene modes, including Sunset. I had looked to try one of the scene modes as a work-around for thhis fill-flash problem. The flash will not discharge in either Sunset or Blue Sky in Auto Scene Modes. Night Scene Portrait allows the flash to fire.
03-27-2012, 04:45 PM   #37
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QuoteOriginally posted by monochrome Quote
There is quite a number of scene modes, including Sunset. I had looked to try one of the scene modes as a work-around for thhis fill-flash problem. The flash will not discharge in either Sunset or Blue Sky in Auto Scene Modes. Night Scene Portrait allows the flash to fire.
Does the slow-synch mode works in TAv Mode ?
03-27-2012, 04:51 PM   #38
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Slow speed sync works in Tv or the SCN Night Scene Portrait Mode.

03-27-2012, 05:15 PM   #39
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g
QuoteOriginally posted by monochrome Quote
Slow speed sync works in Tv or the SCN Night Scene Portrait Mode.
Tx, so it is really a matter of selecting Slow-Synch in one of the "non-full-auto" modes to do Fill-in Flash then. Is that a bug or a "design" feature ?
03-27-2012, 06:11 PM   #40
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QuoteOriginally posted by regor Quote
g
Tx, so it is really a matter of selecting Slow-Synch in one of the "non-full-auto" modes to do Fill-in Flash then. Is that a bug or a "design" feature ?
I really don't know yet. I can't say whether anything is a bug yet. The design features are different than I am accustomed to. For instance, TAv is not a MODE selection. Rather it is implemented under M Mode (Manual) with ISO set to full Auto. That means to really shoot manual with a K or M lens you set ISO to a single number (as film) set your aperture on the lens, hit the Green Button to meter and the camera adjusts the Shutter Speed to correct the exposure. There are nuances of just this function caused by the K-r button layout (fewer buttons) having varying functions in the different Modes. Certain Menu functions are grayed out in certain Modes. Mappable Buttons may have choices, but the effect of those choices on the Modes isn't easily understandable (at least to me), so it is easy to get a setting wrong, then not be able to udnerstand why a function won't work as it should.

I'm just learning the camera, with the few other people here who bought it. I know the K10D pretty well but not the K-r and not the newer models. Having read the manual and fired 400 clicks I believe nearly all the functionality of a K-5 is available through some combination of settings and Modes. Many settings and features are Mode-specific, so learning them all is a chore. It is possible sophisticated Flash setups aren't available. We don't know yet. We haven't yet founf the answer for proper exposure Daylight Fill-flash - doesn't mean it isn't there..

The manual isn't written in a Guide format, rather in a Menu Functions format. IOW, rather than saying, "To accomplish this set these settings," it is written, "This Menu setting does this. (You can set the camera to permit the use of an aperture ring on a manual aperture lens. do this . . .) But it never tells you how to expose with a K or M lens"

To answer most questions such as yours I have to look the answer up in the manual - the answer can be in many different places, or can be a combination of several places and settings.

For instance, right now I'm trying to figure out why I can enable !SO 25600 but not ISO 100. I ahve no idea, and I shoot a lot of ISO100, film and K10D.

There is a link to a pdf of the manual on one of the threads in the K-01 Forum.
03-28-2012, 04:28 AM   #41
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It was to my understanding (although I've been wrong at times) that when shooting RAW+jpeg and also in the three star setting - that the iso starts out at the range of 200. I'll re-check on it a bit later though.

It's unfortunate it doesn't go down to iso 50
03-28-2012, 06:58 AM   #42
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QuoteOriginally posted by Medium FormatPro Quote
It was to my understanding (although I've been wrong at times) that when shooting RAW+jpeg and also in the three star setting - that the iso starts out at the range of 200. I'll re-check on it a bit later though.

It's unfortunate it doesn't go down to iso 50
Thank you! I'll try to find that little factoid in the manual. Though I really don't understand the point of of 100ISO with a degraded file.
03-28-2012, 09:29 AM   #43
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QuoteOriginally posted by regor Quote
I don't understand. According to the Manual p59 (I don't have a K-01), the Flash has a slow-synch mode, which quote: "When using this to shoot a portrait with the sunset in the background, both the person and the background are captured beautifully.", so what other "sunset mode" are you looking for ? Ditto for Fill-in Flash,which should always be in Slow-Synch mode, i.e.the camera exposes as without the Flash.
You know, you're probably right and I should've checked that. I'll try it out and report back.
03-28-2012, 11:39 AM   #44
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Crappy door solution. It opens accidently when holding the camera in just one (right hand). It may very well cause you to drop the camera. This is a huge design mistake. I would have wanted some kind of thumb grip thing to the left side of the rubber door, in order to ensure, that the right hand thumb doesn't accidently open the door, causing the camera to slip out of the hand, and on to the ground. This is a bad ergonomic design, and very unlike PENTAX, IMO.

Regards
Jens
03-31-2012, 03:54 PM   #45
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QuoteOriginally posted by Medium FormatPro Quote
I've tried every possible metering mode, but it doesn't work - outside of full manual override of settings. In relation to the original post; it was tried in aperature priority with one of the "more open" settings - I believe f4.0 or so. And since it was daylight and all; the camera still kept the original aperature and then the shutter speed dropped to the sync speed, almost automatically overexposed the pic.

Technically it is fixable under full manual and with sopme experimentation.

Also I'll be looking into some off camera settings, also with GN's base upon metered lighting
Yeah, I tried it again today and it not even close....just waaay off. So, to me it's a bug. I can't say it's a missing feature as every other camera I've used can nail this. Hopefully it can be fixed in FW but if not, I'll just have to live with it.
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