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12-18-2012, 09:02 AM   #1
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issues with K-01 built-in flash

At work, I have two cameras; mine (K-01 40mm XS) & a Canon EOS 500D (18-55)

Lighting is shit & the color rendition on my K-01 40mm is infinitely better than tha 500D
However; when I bounce the built-in flash (off the ceiling), i usually either get a bit under-exposed or, the real issue, a blue tint over-cast on the entire picture and the colors are VERY faded compared to the crappy, worn out 18-55mm on the EOS

I know no one really uses the built-in flash but would the issue be due to poor CRI of the built in flash or white balance? or what?

P.S: by bouncing the flash i mean i put a folded piece of paper; a little light gets diffused and the most gets reflected & bounced off the white ceiling

12-18-2012, 11:05 AM - 1 Like   #2
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Sounds like you have flourescent lighting.

When you are bouncing like that it is going to mess with the auto white balace.

Try setting the white balance to Tungsten and it should take care of the blue tint.
12-18-2012, 12:22 PM   #3
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putting a piece of paper in front of your pop up flash and expecting good results is unreasonable to say the least. You are reducing the amount of light and must compensate by increasing the flash setting a stop or so, and white balance might be off because of the colour of the paper.
12-18-2012, 01:00 PM   #4
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Pretty much what Franky said ... try and find other ways to bounce light ... or better yet, diffuse the light (for built-in flashes).
Or even better ... get an external flash. I don't think you can control the power output on your built-in flash.

Simply put, when you bounce light ... the light "travels further" and by the time it gets onto your subject is already weak (especially when light bounces from 2 objects before gets to subject). You must compensate by changing your camera settings.

12-18-2012, 03:20 PM   #5
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You're missing the point

You're missing the point guys: i'm saying i do that with a Canon EOS 500D 18-55 and get better results than with my K-01 40mm XS! both on Auto WB & it's not about the exposure

not only that, but the results are weird; sometimes as if there's a thin sheet of blue overcast on the photo

Like cyclone3d said; i do have floerescent lighting in the ceiling and that maybe it; some shadow/dark/blacks correction in Lightroom seemed to fix it a bit
12-18-2012, 04:26 PM   #6
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It may just be a combo of fluorescent lights and paper. You still hVe to compensate for the flash power. In LR, have you tried AUTO instead of As Shot?
12-18-2012, 09:20 PM   #7
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QuoteOriginally posted by Franky2step Quote
It may just be a combo of fluorescent lights and paper. You still hVe to compensate for the flash power. In LR, have you tried AUTO instead of As Shot?
Yea i tried; not as good as when i adjust the "Black" (shadows in Picasa) manually
12-19-2012, 08:22 AM   #8
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Ok, how are you bouncing the built-in flash? Mine shoots straight forward only.

12-19-2012, 08:40 AM - 1 Like   #9
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Okay, so what's happening is this:

On the Pentax, in both Program and auto mode, the camera attempts to expose for the background lighting even when the flash is up. The shutter speed will be relatively low, letting in as much light as possible. That f2.8 aperture will let in a LOT more ambient light than the 18-55 on the Canon. The Canon will also select a shorter shutter speed and lower ISO because its auto modes handle flash more like a P&S: Use the flash for the full exposure. If I'm not mistaken, the Canon will automatically pop up the flash in Auto mode if it thinks you need it. Pentax will avoid using the flash unless you manually turn it on. The Canon lens is also much slower and lets in a lot less of the dim ambient light, so you have an image that's completely exposed by your flash.

Because you're mixing florescent ambient light and pure white flash light with the Pentax, as well as using a lower shutter speed and larger aperture, you're running into problems. The white card and flash bouncing isn't the issue, at least not directly. There are two ways to handle this. First is to shoot in Tv (Shutter Priority) mode, and choose a 1/180 shutter speed, a smaller aperture, and ISO 200. Then you'll have the object completely exposed by the flash. The other option is to gel your flash, turn off the WB override in the camera, and set the WB to florescent. (With a florescent gel on the flash, of course).

Hope this helps.

Charles.
12-19-2012, 05:00 PM   #10
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QuoteOriginally posted by chiane Quote
Ok, how are you bouncing the built-in flash? Mine shoots straight forward only.
Piece of paper (or any reflecting surface; preferable twice as your palm so no spills occur), ~45 deg. upward infront of the flash bulb; basically, you're reflecting the flash's light to the ceiling

EDIT: I used to use a plastic with aluminum foil but I like to use a double folded paper so that a little light gets diffused & falls directly while the other is reflected (and the subject is well lit)

how much is diffused & falls directly vs how much is reflected depends on the thickness of paper used

Last edited by dstructor; 12-19-2012 at 05:10 PM.
12-19-2012, 05:03 PM   #11
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QuoteOriginally posted by ChopperCharles Quote
Okay, so what's happening is this:

On the Pentax, in both Program and auto mode, the camera attempts to expose for the background lighting even when the flash is up. The shutter speed will be relatively low, letting in as much light as possible. That f2.8 aperture will let in a LOT more ambient light than the 18-55 on the Canon. The Canon will also select a shorter shutter speed and lower ISO because its auto modes handle flash more like a P&S: Use the flash for the full exposure. If I'm not mistaken, the Canon will automatically pop up the flash in Auto mode if it thinks you need it. Pentax will avoid using the flash unless you manually turn it on. The Canon lens is also much slower and lets in a lot less of the dim ambient light, so you have an image that's completely exposed by your flash.

Because you're mixing florescent ambient light and pure white flash light with the Pentax, as well as using a lower shutter speed and larger aperture, you're running into problems. The white card and flash bouncing isn't the issue, at least not directly. There are two ways to handle this. First is to shoot in Tv (Shutter Priority) mode, and choose a 1/180 shutter speed, a smaller aperture, and ISO 200. Then you'll have the object completely exposed by the flash. The other option is to gel your flash, turn off the WB override in the camera, and set the WB to florescent. (With a florescent gel on the flash, of course).

Hope this helps.

Charles.
Really insightful and being greedy for more insights i'll tell you this

Settings on the Canon: M-mode, f5.6-7.1, shutter: 1/60-1/40, iso 400, WB: Auto
Settings on Pentax: M-mode, f8, shutter 1/40-1/20, iso 400 WB:auto
(P.S: "-" indicating range where my selection lies, it's not on auto)
03-30-2013, 11:52 AM   #12
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Hey!
Back after a LONG time but figured it out after I tried it with other "normal" lenses, unlike the 40mm XS

The effect was FLARE!
because of how thin the lens is and the housing the flash comes out of doesn't act like a gobo/screen between the lens & the flash (like in dSLR's built in flash), when I diffused it with a piece of paper, without a hood, it would flare; giving the effect as if there's a thin transparent blue layer over the entire image (with degraded quality, of course)

This is with the 40mm DA XS lens

Trying it with other zoom lenses; perfect!
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