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01-02-2013, 08:39 AM - 2 Likes   #1
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Converting K-01 to IR-only camera.

So I bought a second K-01. One thought about it is to rebuilt it to an IR-only camera with a 720nm filter infront of the sensor.

I asked Pentax Germany and they can do that for a resonable price when I provide the filter.

The questions I'm with are:
  • Where to purchase the filter?
  • Is 720nm the right choice?
  • Any thoughts about this project?
  • They don't know if the AF will work proparly after the rebuild, but know that there are no options for re-adjusting the AF-system. So anyone knows if the filter is part of the CDAF system or that I can expect that it works proparly?
  • Will the liveview work normal with such a system? A filter infront off the lens makes it black, but how different is this with a liveview only camera and the filter built into the camera infront off the sensor?

A nice amount off questions, and looking for some knowledge.

01-02-2013, 10:27 AM   #2
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I hope you find a way to do this Ron, cool idea and you seem to be on to something!
01-02-2013, 10:30 AM   #3
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Will cover more of this one in the near future perhaps.

The main item to remember is not to get a plastic filter, but a glass one. The next option to consider; whether one would like to remain color IR, or B&W IR.

I've seen a number of IR cameras that range from about 590 to about 830. That range would typically be based on what one happens to photograph.

Yet unfortunately I've never been able to closely study the results of a Pentax camera/sensor. One major consideration; that the company dong so will most likely have to permenantly disable the SR as it will either: cause a version of an electronic malfunction or even damage the SR or the sensor - once modified.

Then there's the cost... I've seen non fullframes cost above 1k. Most fullframes cost above 2k. Some of the truly high end's could easily cost 3-4k++.

There is someone in the Charleston area that does have a Mamiya with two digital 80mp backs; one of which is IR. I'll see if I can manage to get ahold of that person
01-02-2013, 11:02 AM   #4
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I found one other company doing things and asked them a question too. It is very near to my home, like just over a one hour drive:

Optic Makario

So wich one would you prefer, since I have to make a choice if it works between:
Wir bieten sie in vier Color – Infrarotvarianten an: 550 nm, 630 nm, 670 nm und 700 nm und einer reinen Infrarot – Variante: 830 nm

01-02-2013, 02:59 PM   #5
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QuoteOriginally posted by RonHendriks1966 Quote
Will the liveview work normal with such a system? A filter infront off the lens makes it black, but how different is this with a liveview only camera and the filter built into the camera infront off the sensor?
I've tested my 720 filter on my K-01 and the liveview amped up enough for me to compose and focus, but it's still very dim and you may want a hood. The images in this thread were focused via live view on a bright sunny day and werent too dificult. I tried the R72 again over the holidays on an overcast day and could barely see what I was doing, but the focus peaking stood out and let me know where the plane of focus was.
I also noticed that the resolution of the images was quite poor, even though it was an A50/1.7, which I assume is due to using the red channel only, so 1/3 of the resolution, but I may be wrong.
01-02-2013, 03:43 PM   #6
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QuoteOriginally posted by sunglint Quote
I've tested my 720 filter on my K-01 and the liveview amped up enough for me to compose and focus, but it's still very dim and you may want a hood. The images in this thread were focused via live view on a bright sunny day and werent too dificult. I tried the R72 again over the holidays on an overcast day and could barely see what I was doing, but the focus peaking stood out and let me know where the plane of focus was.
I also noticed that the resolution of the images was quite poor, even though it was an A50/1.7, which I assume is due to using the red channel only, so 1/3 of the resolution, but I may be wrong.
I saw the thread. You are using a filter infront off the lens. I talking about putting a filter infront off the sensor. Totaly different story on handling the camera and making images.
01-02-2013, 04:58 PM   #7
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Wouldn't it be easier to buy an old k-mount SLR and just use an infrared film?
Really interesting project, though. Too bad they don't make a red K-01. Now you'll mix the IR one with the regular one and end up with a bunch of IR shots of a football match!
01-02-2013, 05:42 PM   #8
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Well I got my yellow brick and the second one is just plain black. It was leftover stock on a very good price for me. I already had the idea for some time. I bought a Samsung cloon for that purpose in 2010 but then I realized that it was expensive to convert and I didn't want to spent that much money on an old peace of electronics. This new K-01 could serve me well for the coming 5 years and bringing excellent IQ. Only thing hasitating for me is ending up with a manual focus camera.

01-03-2013, 01:44 PM   #9
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What lens will you be using? If the AF won't work you can still use a good manual lens with distance scales. And peaking might still work.
01-03-2013, 01:59 PM   #10
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I have done some IR mods to bridge cameras, the procedure for modding a K-01 it's very different because of the shutter mechanism, but I have the following observations/suggestions:

1) If the AF is contrast detect, which the K-01 is, it's going to work fine (given enough light and contrast).
2) The AE is also going to work fine, compensation might need to be applied according to taste. In fact, all automatic functions will work fine.
3) I would recommend doing a full spectrum conversion to gain the most versatility out of the mod, then you can add screw on filters of whatever wavelength you want, or a hot mirror if you want to photograph visible spectrum only.
4) After the mod gets done (either a 720, full spectrum or whatever wavelength you choose), your exposure parameters will be relatively "normal" when outdoors (meaning fractions of seconds and not seconds). All the 3 channels will be receiving IR signal (you'll get some weird colors) and the noise will increase (both can be fixed with PP, if needed).
01-03-2013, 02:14 PM   #11
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QuoteOriginally posted by RonHendriks1966 Quote
Well I got my yellow brick and the second one is just plain black. It was leftover stock on a very good price for me.
Ron, may I ask where? Not that I plan on getting one, but I thought that the European prices are almost unchanged while in the US it is being sold for peanuts.
01-03-2013, 03:33 PM   #12
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Clear glass to start experimenting with infrared

Ron,

I think the K-01 is great for conversion.

If you do not know what "kind of infrared" you would like, then why not have a clear glas put in front of the sensor.
You can than screw any filter (infrared, ultraviolet, combinations etc.) onto your lenses.

With these screw-on filter you can spend just about any amount of money. I have some chinese ones of ebay and some B&W ones.
Thread adapters make a lot of sense :-)

720nm is a good standard, 830nm or 950nm is "very" infrared (no visible light remains)

Here are some that I took with my clear glass K20 and 680nm:

https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/post-your-photos/142058-black-white-infrared-680nm-b-w.html

Cheers from Berlin,

jephi

Last edited by jephi; 01-03-2013 at 03:40 PM.
01-03-2013, 05:01 PM   #13
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QuoteOriginally posted by RonHendriks1966 Quote
So I bought a second K-01. One thought about it is to rebuilt it to an IR-only camera with a 720nm filter infront of the sensor.

I asked Pentax Germany and they can do that for a resonable price when I provide the filter.

The questions I'm with are:
  • Where to purchase the filter?
  • Is 720nm the right choice?
  • Any thoughts about this project?
  • They don't know if the AF will work proparly after the rebuild, but know that there are no options for re-adjusting the AF-system. So anyone knows if the filter is part of the CDAF system or that I can expect that it works proparly?
  • Will the liveview work normal with such a system? A filter infront off the lens makes it black, but how different is this with a liveview only camera and the filter built into the camera infront off the sensor?

A nice amount off questions, and looking for some knowledge.
You don't need to put an IR filter onto the sensor you just need to replace the IR blocking filter present on every digital sensor with a clear optical glass one. The camera will be useless for normal photography which is why every digital sensor has a IR blocking filter fitted in the first place.

After this mod the camera will be as sensitive to IR as it currently is with visible light, shutter speeds will be around what you get now.

Chris
01-03-2013, 05:05 PM   #14
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QuoteOriginally posted by Na Horuk Quote
What lens will you be using? If the AF won't work you can still use a good manual lens with distance scales. And peaking might still work.
I have some lenses to use and FA31mm, DA40mm and DA*55mm are most in my mind. The FA*85mm only when AF functions since I don't switch the fiddle mechanisme on my old lens anymore.

QuoteOriginally posted by HSV Quote
I have done some IR mods to bridge cameras, the procedure for modding a K-01 it's very different because of the shutter mechanism, but I have the following observations/suggestions:

1) If the AF is contrast detect, which the K-01 is, it's going to work fine (given enough light and contrast).
2) The AE is also going to work fine, compensation might need to be applied according to taste. In fact, all automatic functions will work fine.
3) I would recommend doing a full spectrum conversion to gain the most versatility out of the mod, then you can add screw on filters of whatever wavelength you want, or a hot mirror if you want to photograph visible spectrum only.
4) After the mod gets done (either a 720, full spectrum or whatever wavelength you choose), your exposure parameters will be relatively "normal" when outdoors (meaning fractions of seconds and not seconds). All the 3 channels will be receiving IR signal (you'll get some weird colors) and the noise will increase (both can be fixed with PP, if needed).
#1 and #2 would be great and is also what I expect, but no experience found about it yet.
#3 I'm not shure what you mean? A conversion would mean taking out the filters infront off the sensor that are there now and putting a IR filter infront of it (I think on 700nm, wich is available for me)
#4 That's about my goal, having a normal functioning camera, since I have a 720nm filter to put on my lenses, but then you have like 15 seconds timing for the shutter to take a picture.

QuoteOriginally posted by Raffwal Quote
Ron, may I ask where? Not that I plan on getting one, but I thought that the European prices are almost unchanged while in the US it is being sold for peanuts.
Just a nice deal for me personally (I paid $ 248 for body only)

QuoteOriginally posted by jephi Quote
Ron,

I think the K-01 is great for conversion.

If you do not know what "kind of infrared" you would like, then why not have a clear glas put in front of the sensor.
You can than screw any filter (infrared, ultraviolet, combinations etc.) onto your lenses.

With these screw-on filter you can spend just about any amount of money. I have some chinese ones of ebay and some B&W ones.
Thread adapters make a lot of sense :-)

720nm is a good standard, 830nm or 950nm is "very" infrared (no visible light remains)

Here are some that I took with my clear glass K20 and 680nm:

https://www.pentaxforums.com/forums/post-your-photos/142058-black-white-infrared-680nm-b-w.html

Cheers from Berlin,

jephi
Well I don't want the hassle for screw on filters, since my 720nm IR filter is a pain to use.

Last edited by RonHendriks1966; 01-04-2013 at 03:29 AM.
01-03-2013, 05:06 PM   #15
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Hotspot

Does anyone know if the hotspot issue with filters on the lens are just a problem there and not with a converted camera?

This one I made with K-7, DA21mm and 720nm screwon IR filter on the lens and there is the hotspot:
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