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03-21-2013, 07:17 PM   #31
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QuoteOriginally posted by EchoOscar Quote
In case you are referring to this particular online community, I believe you may be exaggerating the true power and impact of this forum on the global sales of Pentax cameras, at least a 'little' bit.
I refer to the concentration here, and as cross-members at DPReview, of unusually influential opinion leaders in the photographic community. The truly influential product reviewers in the online and print media are sensitive to the tone of comments here. And don't forget the (probable) number of product testers who, though bound by NDA's, might still post here and who may speak amongst themselves, off the record, in advance of release..

Members of this Forum may in fact have significantly more influence than we will ever know.


Last edited by monochrome; 03-22-2013 at 07:29 AM.
03-22-2013, 02:48 AM   #32
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QuoteOriginally posted by Na Horuk Quote
I like the K-01's design, mirrorless and all. But I wouldn't mind Pentax also making a mini DSLR, a tier lower than the K-30. I think the K-01 should be a line separate from DSLRs, its own special species of cameras. I also really like the K-x design, it could probably be made a little smaller.
They still have the Kr right?
03-22-2013, 06:46 AM   #33
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QuoteOriginally posted by THoog Quote
And that's exactly the sort of wonderful nonsense I've come to expect from my beloved Pentax. But I had in mind something... bigger...

HOW TO RIDE KURATAS - Suidobashi heavy industry - YouTube
God I want one of these!
03-22-2013, 07:31 AM   #34
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QuoteOriginally posted by Anvh Quote
They still have the Kr right?
Huh? I don't know of any retailer that has it in stock anymore. IMHO they need something below the K-30, smaller, lighter and less expensive (i.e. without WR). And "cuter" than the K-r, which couldn't quite compete with mirrorless "cuteness" like K-x could.

03-22-2013, 07:54 AM   #35
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QuoteOriginally posted by gazonk Quote
Huh? I don't know of any retailer that has it in stock anymore. IMHO they need something below the K-30, smaller, lighter and less expensive (i.e. without WR). And "cuter" than the K-r, which couldn't quite compete with mirrorless "cuteness" like K-x could.
Believe it or not, Wal-Mart online still has new K-r kits for US$549 (green, brown, gold, blue, yellow, and purple bodies only - none of which were sold in the US when it was in production).

I think Pentax could fit the 16MP sensor into a K-x body easily. The trick would be squeezing the AF points into the OVF without the K-r's angular prism/flash housing, which spoiled the K-m/K-x's cute looks. If they left off the AA battery support, they could out-small the SL1, tho' I have mixed feelings about that - I like being able to use AAs, and the SL1 battery is a wimpy 360 shots.
03-22-2013, 08:22 AM   #36
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I thought it was still in production but that isnt the case i see.

Simpler version of the K30, without 100% viewfinder, WR and simpler (less) controls should do the trick nicely.
03-23-2013, 04:32 PM   #37
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QuoteOriginally posted by monochrome Quote
I refer to the concentration here, and as cross-members at DPReview, of unusually influential opinion leaders in the photographic community. The truly influential product reviewers in the online and print media are sensitive to the tone of comments here. And don't forget the (probable) number of product testers who, though bound by NDA's, might still post here and who may speak amongst themselves, off the record, in advance of release..

Members of this Forum may in fact have significantly more influence than we will ever know.
Again, this is not really anything unique or new. A number of 'eccentric' products within different industries have stirred quite a bit of controversy and even explicit noise in the circles for ages but, only a few of them have actually flopped. Some products have been much more successful and persistent, despite all the negative noise, online and off. Some are still running strong after a decade of being "misunderstood" by the press and the mainstream audience alike. So I still don't think you can blame the community alone for the demise of K-01. Besides, even some of the flops end up having a small but passionate bunch of followers, eventually, anyway, and so did K-01.

I'm honestly not happy about the demise of the K-01 but, I'm not surprised about it, either. Regardless of the talks in the forum. Surely there's no need to repeat the list of reasons once again. The positive thing is, there are still some stock left, so anyone wanting one can still get one.
03-23-2013, 05:06 PM   #38
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QuoteOriginally posted by EchoOscar Quote
Again, this is not really anything unique or new. A number of 'eccentric' products within different industries have stirred quite a bit of controversy and even explicit noise in the circles for ages but, only a few of them have actually flopped. Some products have been much more successful and persistent, despite all the negative noise, online and off. Some are still running strong after a decade of being "misunderstood" by the press and the mainstream audience alike. So I still don't think you can blame the community alone for the demise of K-01. Besides, even some of the flops end up having a small but passionate bunch of followers, eventually, anyway, and so did K-01.

I'm honestly not happy about the demise of the K-01 but, I'm not surprised about it, either. Regardless of the talks in the forum. Surely there's no need to repeat the list of reasons once again. The positive thing is, there are still some stock left, so anyone wanting one can still get one.
I cannot help but wonder, if there's not a way that Pentax *could* keep a K-01bis somehow around, profitably - even if as a marginal product. I guess the balance would be that it'd have to be (i) not canibalizing the DSLR market, but either (ii) act as a gateway to it (I've got K-mount glass, might as well trade up to.....), or (iii) appeal to a different segment.

I'm just an engineer - which, by definition, implies that I know less than diddely-squat about marketing or economics - so take this with a generous spadeful of salt....but.....if I was to venture a guess, then it is that the way the Q and K-01 appeared and were "marketed" was too identically, shooting (in different ways) for (iii), and neither not really for (ii) in a meaningful way.

I come from the Olympus OM world....a LOT was made of "you do not buy a camera, you buy into a system" - that's why Olympus successfully were able to keep the OM10 around (by all measures, a mediocre camera, but students bought it in piles, then bought up to an OM20 or an OM2, typically, once getting a serious paycheck).

The K-01 is all-but a mediocre camera (have one, really loving it), but was really not in any meaningful way sold as being part of "the system".....K5/K30 (and their predecessors/successors) were. I think that the inability to use the same flashes in the same way (I still haven't wrapped my brain around the P-TTL vs. whatever-it-is), and different grips on the various K-bodies is doing a disservice to "system loyalty" etc.

As such, while I deplore it, I understand why Pentax has decided to let the K-01 be, and concentrate on the K30/K5 as their "big" and Q as their "small" systems.

I cannot but help that what Pentax needs is to think "system" and "medium-to-long-term" rather than "next quarter"....I know I know, I am just an engineer, and the financial world doesn't work with medium-term perspectives.....

03-23-2013, 05:13 PM   #39
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QuoteOriginally posted by EchoOscar Quote
So I still don't think you can blame the community alone for the demise of K-01
Perhaps you are right - and I'm really not arguing - but unless you were lurking then you have no idea how loud, obnoxious and vitriolic the condemnation was from the moment the first photo hit the press and how persistent, even today, some posters here are in their utter condemnation of the k-01 are and their disgust with Pentax for doing it.
03-23-2013, 05:25 PM   #40
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QuoteOriginally posted by tclausen Quote
I think that the inability to use the same flashes in the same way (I still haven't wrapped my brain around the P-TTL vs. whatever-it-is), and different grips on the various K-bodies is doing a disservice to "system loyalty" etc
Part of the reason I've never upgraded from the K10D (elderly, now) is my anger over needing a new grip, different battery, plug-in remote trigger, etc. They also haven't been consistent with button placements and the 4-Way controller functions. Sure, in some ways that's necessary from camera range to camera range, but they could have two or three consistent configurations deliniated by body price and capability market segment. Same with flash function, as you state
QuoteOriginally posted by tclausen Quote
As such, while I deplore it, I understand why Pentax has decided to let the K-01 be, and concentrate on the K30/K5 as their "big" and Q as their "small" systems.
Yes - systems are strategic; products are tactical.
QuoteOriginally posted by tclausen Quote
I cannot but help that what Pentax needs is to think "system" and "medium-to-long-term" rather than "next quarter"....I know I know, I am just an engineer, and the financial world doesn't work with medium-term perspectives.....
It takes corporate courage to watch the investment community abandon your stock for 6 or 8 or 10 quarters while you make a strategic investment. The payoff comes (if it works) when they return - in droves - to your story.

We must, however, be understanding and tolerant of the corporate changes they have endured over the past several years. An attempted hostile buyout, forced into Hoya's arms, stripped of personnel, products manufacturing facilities and inventory, decimated at the distribution level and then sold again - to a company that almost immediately had its first losing year ever and had to restructure itself.

They haven't been allowed to develop a medium-term or long-term strategy.
03-23-2013, 05:29 PM   #41
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QuoteOriginally posted by klchew Quote
Digital Photography Review

Why couldn't Pentax make the K-01 more like the Canon EOS 100D? You don't need to pay a "Designer" tons of money to design a "brick" which doesn't sell in the numbers needed to continue it. Just imagine, a Pentax K-01 which is easier to hold and with a good viewfinder. Stuff it with the Pentax innards and it would be a great small SLR with access to all the K mount lenses!
I think the K-01 should have been configured more like the Panasonic G1 and it's successors or the Olympus OM-D. Built in EVF with a KAF mount. Shape and style it like the Pentax ME and it would be perfect.
03-23-2013, 05:49 PM   #42
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QuoteOriginally posted by monochrome Quote
Part of the reason I've never upgraded from the K10D (elderly, now) is my anger over needing a new grip, different battery, plug-in remote trigger, etc. They also haven't been consistent with button placements and the 4-Way controller functions. Sure, in some ways that's necessary from camera range to camera range, but they could have two or three consistent configurations deliniated by body price and capability market segment. Same with flash function, as you state.

Yes - systems are strategic; products are tactical. It takes corporate courage to watch the investment community abandon your stock for 6 or 8 or 10 quarters while you make a strategic investment. The payoff comes (if it works) when they return - in droves - to your story.
Love the quote "Systems are strategic; products are tactical".

QuoteOriginally posted by monochrome Quote
We must, however, be understanding and tolerant of the corporate changes they have endured over the past several years. An attempted hostile buyout, forced into Hoya's arms, stripped of personnel, products manufacturing facilities and inventory, decimated at the distribution level and then sold again - to a company that almost immediately had its first losing year ever and had to restructure itself.

They haven't been allowed to develop a medium-term or long-term strategy.
That may be true As I said, I am just an engineer, so I look at what seems to make technical sense. Business/finance-guys do stuff which I am immensely grateful that they do so that I won't have to, because (i) I find it so utterly boring, and (ii) it appears to be akin to black magick....

So, I'll just re-iterate what I think we agree on: it'd be wonderful if Pentax would develop a system camera again
03-23-2013, 05:52 PM   #43
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QuoteOriginally posted by monochrome Quote
Perhaps you are right - and I'm really not arguing - but unless you were lurking then you have no idea how loud, obnoxious and vitriolic the condemnation was from the moment the first photo hit the press and how persistent, even today, some posters here are in their utter condemnation of the k-01 are and their disgust with Pentax for doing it.
Hmm...actually, it's been a while since I've read one of the really entertaining, inflammatory posts by folks never having tried the camera, condemning the K-01.

Most of the recent postings have been really positive, with a few "damn that Pentax didn't get the right price-point from the get-go".....
03-23-2013, 05:56 PM   #44
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QuoteOriginally posted by tclausen Quote
As I said, I am just an engineer
Neither is magic - both take smarts, learning and hard work. Character separates the dedicated from the craven. Unfortunately those with character seem not to land in finance.
03-23-2013, 05:58 PM   #45
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QuoteOriginally posted by tclausen Quote
Hmm...actually, it's been a while since I've read one of the really entertaining, inflammatory posts by folks never having tried the camera, condemning the K-01.

Most of the recent postings have been really positive, with a few "damn that Pentax didn't get the right price-point from the get-go".....
Yes, many including I have recently remarked that the K-01 is developing its own following now. But there are still a few .....
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