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04-22-2013, 07:27 AM   #61
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QuoteOriginally posted by mrNewt Quote
I won't repeat it again ... you obviously ignore what I am saying ... and unless I am blind, I'm pretty sure of what I am saying. Tried it with 2 lenses already and there is no point to keep on observing and see if magically eventually it will change. It just doesn't for me ...

Could be settings, could be anything ... no idea why. It just stays wide open.

Even with a manual lens on, the screen still adjust for lighting conditions without any troubles - and obviously there is no way for the camera to step down. The conclusion from this ... for my case at least ... is that screen adjusts lightning without the need to step down - guess depends on settings.
I'm not ignoring what you're saying - I'm saying you're wrong. When I get home tonight, I'll take a couple of shots showing what I'm talking about. I can use my Q to shoot the 40 lens open while pointed at a dark subject and closed down when pointed at a bright subject. You just don't want to be convinced that this is real so I don't expect you to believe even if I post the photos.

04-22-2013, 07:37 AM   #62
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QuoteOriginally posted by Rob22315 Quote
I'm not ignoring what you're saying - I'm saying you're wrong. When I get home tonight, I'll take a couple of shots showing what I'm talking about. I can use my Q to shoot the 40 lens open while pointed at a dark subject and closed down when pointed at a bright subject. You just don't want to be convinced that this is real so I don't expect you to believe even if I post the photos.
LOL ... so I am wrong in what I am seeing . Interesting ...

Please show me where I have said that for others (I guess depending on settings) they won't get different results or that I am NOT convinced that others or you get a different result?
I'm only explaining MY findings ... how could I be wrong on what I have seen is beyond me ... ...

In the end, my conclusion was that the camera doesn't need to step down in order to compensate for the light on the screen - and this is perfectly demonstrated when you use a manual lens.
Now I am not arguing that it might actually do it with auto lenses in different mods or settings ...

But sure, to put an end to this ... you are right, I am wrong ... let's move on please.
04-22-2013, 07:46 AM   #63
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QuoteOriginally posted by Sagitta Quote
I've used it with my clunky old budget zooms to great effect, so if a costly birding-capable lens is failing with it I'm not sure what to say except something sounds off with either the camera or your technique with using it.

The abovementioned old clunky zoom - a Sears 70-210mm. Any failings here were with that and not the camera. Focus peaking was on the edge of the light pole (not the birds).
Differing expectations? In my definition, sharp means pixel sharp, i.e. still sharp at 100% crop. The child portrait is appealing, but it's soft all over, even the left eye. The foil in the still life is sharp. There's nothing in the bird photo that I would call sharp.

You raise a good point though, I need to do more testing. I have an A*300mm f/4 and a K20D. I'll test these together and in conjunction with the DA*300 and K-01, this time with AF magnification, to see if I can figure out what's going on.
04-22-2013, 09:48 AM   #64
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QuoteOriginally posted by mrNewt Quote
LOL ... so I am wrong in what I am seeing . Interesting ...

Please show me where I have said that for others (I guess depending on settings) they won't get different results or that I am NOT convinced that others or you get a different result?
I'm only explaining MY findings ... how could I be wrong on what I have seen is beyond me ... ...

In the end, my conclusion was that the camera doesn't need to step down in order to compensate for the light on the screen - and this is perfectly demonstrated when you use a manual lens.
Now I am not arguing that it might actually do it with auto lenses in different mods or settings ...

But sure, to put an end to this ... you are right, I am wrong ... let's move on please.
You can move on, that's your choice. I will ignore your request because this behavior is important to understand if there's a chance (or not) that we'll get the liveview histogram to accurately reflect the screen or the scene. If the camera adjusts the aperture then the histogram can't be trusted. On my automatic lenses, it does. I've observed this on both the 40XS and the 35-10/f3.5. I'll drop a manual lens on the camera and see what it does - I doubt the aperture adjusts. This would also explain why your observations are different then mine - I'm using A (and later) lenses, you're using M lenses.

If you're correct that the M lens behavior doesn't create an issue for the screen, then we need to storm castle Pentax like angry villagers and get them to give us an accurate histogram on all lenses.

04-22-2013, 10:14 AM   #65
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All of my K mount slrs, the istds, & the Olympus M43 allow live metering in manual mode with Pentax K and -M lenses.
The K-01 is the only one that does not, and just relies on a momentary setting by the green button. The live histogram in M mode on the K-01 seems to be just of screen brightness.
However with -A lenses or higher the live metering on the K-01 in manual mode is very good.
What is the situation with the K-30?
04-22-2013, 10:35 AM   #66
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QuoteOriginally posted by mrNewt Quote
In the end, my conclusion was that the camera doesn't need to step down in order to compensate for the light on the screen - and this is perfectly demonstrated when you use a manual lens.
.
I am sure you are seeing what you are seeing. I am wondering which firmware version you have, and if you have tried when the camera is in different modes.

As far as the light compensating on the screen, I do not think that is the purpose or function of the stopping down so that doesn't really have anything to do with it (although maybe it helps in extreme situations). I think the purpose is to protect the sensor since with mirrorless/liveview it is always open -- probably meant for direct sunlight so it doesn't fry it...
04-22-2013, 11:57 AM   #67
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QuoteOriginally posted by vonBaloney Quote
I am sure you are seeing what you are seeing. I am wondering which firmware version you have, and if you have tried when the camera is in different modes.

As far as the light compensating on the screen, I do not think that is the purpose or function of the stopping down so that doesn't really have anything to do with it (although maybe it helps in extreme situations). I think the purpose is to protect the sensor since with mirrorless/liveview it is always open -- probably meant for direct sunlight so it doesn't fry it...
As I have quoted you in a previous post, I have the latest firmware version.

In my tests I've use the Auto mode - no other mode (I've figured there is no other mode where camera is allowed to do pretty much whatever it thinks is right) with AF using the 40mm XS and the DA 18-55 II. Both give me same results.
04-22-2013, 12:33 PM   #68
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I have the k-01 with fw 1.03. This was MF with the Sigma 17-70.

I had a LOT of trouble with FP, for example with this image. When I adjusted the focus, I could see the FP move back and forth on the wood under the petal, but could never get the peaking to show any part of the petal. I think the part I wanted to be sharpest, is not. Is magnification the only thing I could do better next time- I did not use it on this.
IS there a wayto adjust the FP? {and as an aside- is there a way to make the AF box smaller?}

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04-22-2013, 12:48 PM   #69
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QuoteOriginally posted by mrNewt Quote
As I have quoted you in a previous post, I have the latest firmware version.
Right, sorry.

QuoteQuote:
In my tests I've use the Auto mode - no other mode (I've figured there is no other mode where camera is allowed to do pretty much whatever it thinks is right) with AF using the 40mm XS and the DA 18-55 II. Both give me same results.
It is strange. Would be nice to turn it off though...
04-22-2013, 01:12 PM   #70
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QuoteOriginally posted by wombat2go Quote
What is the situation with the K-30?
As far as I can tell the LCD adjusts for the light, but I don't seem to see any change in the blades on either of the two lenses I tested (Sigma 10-20mm f3.5 and FA 28-90mm f3.5-5.6).

I haven't tested it with the DA18-55, but I doubt the results will differ. I may retry it with a really bright subject (like the sun) but dark room to bright window did nada, nor did 'hand over the lens to bright desk lamp'.
04-22-2013, 01:33 PM   #71
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QuoteOriginally posted by Sagitta Quote
As far as I can tell the LCD adjusts for the light, but I don't seem to see any change in the blades on either of the two lenses I tested (Sigma 10-20mm f3.5 and FA 28-90mm f3.5-5.6).

I haven't tested it with the DA18-55, but I doubt the results will differ. I may retry it with a really bright subject (like the sun) but dark room to bright window did nada, nor did 'hand over the lens to bright desk lamp'.
There must a threshold level somewhere -- I wonder if the ISO setting affects it...
04-22-2013, 02:15 PM   #72
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QuoteOriginally posted by PBandJ Quote
{and as an aside- is there a way to make the AF box smaller?}
When you press OK to move the AF box around the screen, you can use the scroll wheel to make it bigger or smaller.
04-22-2013, 03:32 PM   #73
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QuoteOriginally posted by Na Horuk Quote
When you press OK to move the AF box around the screen, you can use the scroll wheel to make it bigger or smaller.
Or just set if for spot focus, use Center Focus & Recompose method. That's the default for all my cameras.
04-22-2013, 03:59 PM   #74
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QuoteOriginally posted by audiobomber Quote
Or just set if for spot focus, use Center Focus & Recompose method. That's the default for all my cameras.
That's what I used to do with p&S, but for some reason, maybe related to AE lock, I can't get comfy with that
04-22-2013, 04:07 PM   #75
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QuoteOriginally posted by audiobomber Quote
Or just set if for spot focus, use Center Focus & Recompose method. That's the default for all my cameras.
With K-01 or other liveview, tracking/continuous focus is a good option because the focus point will remain on the same object as you recompose (as long as you don't move it too quick) which will allow the slight adjustments needed (and time you recompose, you are setting the focal plane behind what you focused on when it was in the center).
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