It's official: Obama is a Socialist

GingeM · 07-09-2010, 06:10 PM

RML:

Quote:

(Funny hearing that, by the way, from a guy who claims the entire *universe* is arbitrarily-supernatural. It doesn't confer an understanding of historial economic theories, though.)

While I know this will come back to bite me *you know where* I have to say that - of all the "religions"/religions, (take that how you please), the Pagan/Wiccan seems to me to be the most logical...

Awaiting incoming...

Oh... and to edit this... I do not think it is "arbitrarily supernatural". I believe that the ultimate arrogance of the human is that it believes in a supreme being - because that belief effectively says "I'm too stupid to understand why everything works so I'll attribute it to some unseen, unknown creature that floats around everywhere".

Thought about with a single, sensible thought in one's mind that does sound a little silly.

End edit

Last edited by GingeM; 07-09-2010 at 06:15 PM.

**dadipentak** · 07-09-2010, 06:19 PM

This "Obama is a socialist" crap is a classic example of the "big lie" It doesn't have to be true--if you repeat it often enough, people begin to think there's something to it. WMD's in Iraq is another good example.

Socialist my butt--the Wall street fat cats are doing just fine and laughing all the way to their banks

FlashCube · 07-09-2010, 06:27 PM

Originally posted by dadipentak

This "Obama is a socialist" crap is a classic example of the "big lie" It doesn't have to be true--if you repeat it often enough, people begin to think there's something to it. WMD's in Iraq is another good example.

Socialist my butt--the Wall street fat cats are doing just fine and laughing all the way to their banks

Go listen to BHO's books on tape about attending communist seminars to "clear his head." He was also mentored by Frank Davis with the encouragement of his Grandfather. Also explain his affinity for guys like Van Jones and several other of his Czars that have those kinds of philosophies and associations?

The opposite to the Wall Street fat cats doesn't have to be Hugo Chavez. The opposite of Haliburton doesn't have to be Soros. Therein lies the problem of political parties, especially the upper portion such as the DNC and RNC.

wildman · 07-09-2010, 07:39 PM

"Obama is a Socialist"

And your point is?

Ratmagiclady · 07-09-2010, 08:05 PM

Originally posted by GingeM

RML:

While I know this will come back to bite me *you know where* I have to say that - of all the "religions"/religions, (take that how you please), the Pagan/Wiccan seems to me to be the most logical...

Awaiting incoming...

What? I can hardly be insulted by *that,* after all.

Or are we not on the same page here?

That's really kind of part of the point. Whatever you may think of religions, one needn't rely on supernatural 'claims' or invent bogeymen, like 'Socialism' and try to 'banish' them like monsters.

The point is that you ourself superstitiously treat 'Socialism' and 'socialists' like demons and witches and don't know what you're talking about.

When people say 'Obama is a socialist,' it doesn't mean they know either Obama's policies or what socialism actually is. It's just how they literally dress him up in a 'witch-doctor' costume and say 'Bad!'

Has nothing to do with reality.

Quote:

Oh... and to edit this... I do not think it is "arbitrarily supernatural". I believe that the ultimate arrogance of the human is that it believes in a supreme being - because that belief effectively says "I'm too stupid to understand why everything works so I'll attribute it to some unseen, unknown creature that floats around everywhere".

Thought about with a single, sensible thought in one's mind that does sound a little silly.

End edit

Well, take it from a 'Witch.' The world's magical enough without going out of your way to ignore reason and sense and causality.

That includes economic policies and historical figures. Lady ain't threatened by science or reality as some people count their God to be. Or, shall we say, certain 'Invisible Hands of The Market?....

Call me a Witch, but I think you're the superstitious one: you seem to think not-getting-ripped-off on health insurance will turn Obama into Hitler cause of something about the evil magic word 'Socialist.'

FlashCube · 07-09-2010, 08:14 PM

I prefer the Joker costume . . .

Ratmagiclady · 07-09-2010, 08:26 PM

Originally posted by FlashCube

I prefer the Joker costume . . .

Wear what you want. Just call me Barbara. Had to hang up the batsuit and I'm sitting behind a computer all night.

Actually, I shouldn't even make light of that: the guy's in office a month, and next to the 'witch doctor' costume, you paint him up in 'white face' and say he's a psycho monster in clown face for saying people should get the coverage they paid for from insurance corporations? Read Jung, much?

I guess that's being a 'Witch' these days, though: you need half a degree in transpersonal psych before you even rate the ducking stool. It's just not like the old days, you know?

Last edited by Ratmagiclady; 07-09-2010 at 08:43 PM.

deadwolfbones · 07-09-2010, 08:49 PM

FlashCube, do you think everyone who has read the Communist Manifesto is a communist?

FlashCube · 07-09-2010, 08:52 PM

Originally posted by Ratmagiclady

Wear what you want. Just call me Barbara. Had to hang up the batsuit and I'm sitting behind a computer all night.

Actually, I shouldn't even make light of that: the guy's in office a month, and next to the 'witch doctor' costume, you paint him up in 'white face' and say he's a psycho monster in clown face for saying people should get the coverage they paid for from insurance corporations? Read Jung, much?

I guess that's being a 'Witch' these days, though: you need half a degree in transpersonal psych before you even rate the ducking stool. It's just not like the old days, you know?

It wasn't me that painted him up like The Joker, but a kid from Chicago. After all, the POTUS is a D.C. character. As far as the insurance stuff, its a lot more complicated than that. The problem is, the government is less efficient at screwing people over or more efficient at screwing them over depending on how you look at it. Either way, whoever did the math had a broken abacus. Replacing Corporate Raiders with a Goon Squad isn't the idea of change that many had. Wait till the mandates, dictates and rationing starts.

jeffkrol · 07-09-2010, 09:01 PM

Originally posted by FlashCube

It wasn't me that painted him up like The Joker, but a kid from Chicago. After all, the POTUS is a D.C. character. As far as the insurance stuff, its a lot more complicated than that. The problem is, the government is less efficient at screwing people over or more efficient at screwing them over depending on how you look at it. Either way, whoever did the math had a broken abacus. Replacing Corporate Raiders with a Goon Squad isn't the idea of change that many had. Wait till the mandates, dictates and rationing starts.

They already have.. it's called Pre-existing conditions and pre-certification as to "medical necessity" from your own ins. company or "out of network"......pick em.

FlashCube · 07-09-2010, 09:02 PM

Originally posted by deadwolfbones

FlashCube, do you think everyone who has read the Communist Manifesto is a communist?

No. However, based on listening to his books on tapes and the fact that his first mentor was Frank Davis and marched with the likes of Farakhan, Jeremiah Wright, hand hand picks guys like Van Jones changes the argument. Even his senior thesis from Columbia seems to be missing from the mix.

I don't follow a political party like what ever they say is golden. The DNC and RNC can be very dangerous if they get control of all 3 branches of government and a pandering 4th estate. Furthermore, I'm for a free society and don't want the Moral Majority in my business anymore than I want the New Black Panzies in it. I considered the unPatriot Act very dangerous to the Constitution under Bush and I consider the tools he left behind even more dangerous in the wrong hands.

---------- Post added 07-09-10 at 09:11 PM ----------

Originally posted by jeffkrol

They already have.. it's called Pre-existing conditions and pre-certification as to "medical necessity" from your own ins. company or "out of network"......pick em.

How do you know what plan I currently have? Do you work for the CIA or an unspecified alphabet agency? However, I'm not happy about the cost of it given my portion and my employers portion. I currently have a PPO so I can pick and choose at the moment. I can even go out of network at an extra cost. I'm also curious to see how that's going to change in the future. The insurance companies aren't the only problem. Its the cost of treatment in general.

You are operating under the assumption the a government bureau can do this better and more cost effective than the current flukked up system. Once the bureaus have medical info on people, they will be able to implement how much treatment, when and if people get it. I would like to see the insurance companies replaced for health care, but not WITH the Fed. Gov.

causey · 07-09-2010, 11:52 PM

Listening Gregorian chants to clear my head doesn't make me Pope Gregory. It seems you could use a definition: "Socialism: Any of various theories or systems of social organization in which the means of producing and distributing goods is owned collectively or by a centralized government that often plans and controls the economy." (Thefreedictionary).

Originally posted by FlashCube

Go listen to BHO's books on tape about attending communist seminars to "clear his head." He was also mentored by Frank Davis with the encouragement of his Grandfather. Also explain his affinity for guys like Van Jones and several other of his Czars that have those kinds of philosophies and associations?

The opposite to the Wall Street fat cats doesn't have to be Hugo Chavez. The opposite of Haliburton doesn't have to be Soros. Therein lies the problem of political parties, especially the upper portion such as the DNC and RNC.

wildman · 07-10-2010, 03:00 AM

Originally posted by causey

"Socialism: Any of various theories or systems of social organization in which the means of producing and distributing goods is owned collectively or by a centralized government that often plans and controls the economy." (Thefreedictionary).

This is where I find the right most disingenuous. They are not really against socialism they are against any economy that is short of absolute laissez-faire capitalism.

Any suggestion of a mixed economy, no matter how moderate and reasonable it's policies, is not acceptable to them. Any suggestion that there may, sometimes, be outstanding public interests that trump private commercial interest is anathema to them.

They go on and on about conservative "principles" when in fact it's often just thoughtless dogma based on no empirical evidence.

They really ought to cheer up a bit though. Things will almost certainly get worse.

Nesster · 07-10-2010, 04:46 AM

Originally posted by wildman

This is where I find the right most disingenuous. They are not really against socialism they are against any economy that is short of absolute laissez-faire capitalism.

Any suggestion of a mixed economy, no matter how moderate and reasonable it's policies, is not acceptable to them. Any suggestion that there may, sometimes, be outstanding public interests that trump private commercial interest is anathema to them.

They go on and on about conservative "principles" when in fact it's often just thoughtless dogma based on no empirical evidence.

They really ought to cheer up a bit though. Things will almost certainly get worse.

Essentially, you are right, though of course 'their' "philosophy" is situational: when it is to their advantage (or that of the US Chamber of Commerce's), Government handouts and protections are just fine.

But then, what do you expect from people who cleared their heads by watching The Flintstones... (that's a joke)

----- or maybe not, I'm constantly stunned at the level of made up stuff passed on as TRUTH about the President and Commander in Chief of our country. Call him names, but don't go pretending there's something more to it, I mean, us liberals are into the 'theory' of evolution, but even we didn't literally believe Bush was actually a monkey -----

On that term paper:
http://firstread.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2008/07/24/4423357-obamas-missing-thesis

Note that the Obama paper was not a PhD dissertation or a Masters thesis, but rather an undergraduate term paper. No college retains undergrad term papers, though they do retain the first two types. Obama's paper was an undergraduate term paper, hence not important enough for anyone to hold onto. How many of your undergrad papers did you keep, especially if they were pre-computer era and thus manually typed?

Also, perhaps these right wingers never have been to college, never really looked at what a quality college major entails. At Columbia Obama majored in political science with an international relations focus. As such, he would have had to study socialism and communism in order to understand how our enemies (and allies) thought and operated. I would expect anyone who professes to be an expert in political philosophy to have studied all the major 20th century political movements and philosophies.

Furthermore, there's the concept of CRITICAL THINKING. This means you study to understand various arguments - and that understanding them is different than accepting them as valid. Every philosophy has its shortcomings. Many Fox watchers don't seem to have this critical thinking thing down - rumor and innuendo and fact is all mixed together based on preconceived political attitude. There is very little gray area, very little critical examination of what's being fed from the boob toob and other opinionated blather outlet. Whether this blather is right wing or left wing, someone who does critical thinking validates the statements, looks at the facts and tries to separate fact from fiction. Traditional press would do this. Somehow, modern right wing populists have left this behind as unnecessary for understanding the world.

GingeM · 07-10-2010, 06:14 AM

Quote:

This "Obama is a socialist" crap is a classic example of the "big lie" It doesn't have to be true--if you repeat it often enough, people begin to think there's something to it. WMD's in Iraq is another good example.

Nationalized Health Care... Check

Taking control of the banking system... Check

Taking control of the mortgage industry... Check

Taking control of the car companies... Check

Taking control of the energy industries... Check

And on and on... Those are the acts of a Socialist. He doesn't have to be obvious about it like Chavez, he's doing it the "stealthy" way. If I sneak up behind you and stab you I'm a murderer. If I walk up to your face and stab you I'm a murderer. It matters not how I do it only that I did it and that's Obama for you.

Wildman

Quote:

Any suggestion of a mixed economy, no matter how moderate and reasonable it's policies, is not acceptable to them.

There's a very good reason for we of the "right bent" finding this stuff unacceptable. We don't trust you of the "Left bent" to not use the little things as the stepping stones to your eventual goals. Silly example but let's look at the seat belt law, (not whether it is right or wrong but rather it's implementation). We were promised up and down that it would only be a secondary offense yet, within 5 years it was a primary offense. That's why it's unacceptable - because you can no longer be trusted to be "fair".

07-09-2010, 09:02 PM	#26
FlashCube Inactive Account Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: In Transition Posts: 173	Originally posted by deadwolfbones FlashCube, do you think everyone who has read the Communist Manifesto is a communist? No. However, based on listening to his books on tapes and the fact that his first mentor was Frank Davis and marched with the likes of Farakhan, Jeremiah Wright, hand hand picks guys like Van Jones changes the argument. Even his senior thesis from Columbia seems to be missing from the mix. I don't follow a political party like what ever they say is golden. The DNC and RNC can be very dangerous if they get control of all 3 branches of government and a pandering 4th estate. Furthermore, I'm for a free society and don't want the Moral Majority in my business anymore than I want the New Black Panzies in it. I considered the unPatriot Act very dangerous to the Constitution under Bush and I consider the tools he left behind even more dangerous in the wrong hands. ---------- Post added 07-09-10 at 09:11 PM ---------- Originally posted by jeffkrol They already have.. it's called Pre-existing conditions and pre-certification as to "medical necessity" from *your own ins.* company or "out of network"......pick em. How do you know what plan I currently have? Do you work for the CIA or an unspecified alphabet agency? However, I'm not happy about the cost of it given my portion and my employers portion. I currently have a PPO so I can pick and choose at the moment. I can even go out of network at an extra cost. I'm also curious to see how that's going to change in the future. The insurance companies aren't the only problem. Its the cost of treatment in general. You are operating under the assumption the a government bureau can do this better and more cost effective than the current flukked up system. Once the bureaus have medical info on people, they will be able to implement how much treatment, when and if people get it. I would like to see the insurance companies replaced for health care, but not WITH the Fed. Gov. Last edited by FlashCube; 07-09-2010 at 09:16 PM.

07-10-2010, 04:46 AM	#29
Nesster Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: NJ USA Photos: Gallery Posts: 13,072	Originally posted by wildman This is where I find the right most disingenuous. They are not really against socialism they are against any economy that is short of absolute laissez-faire capitalism. Any suggestion of a mixed economy, no matter how moderate and reasonable it's policies, is not acceptable to them. Any suggestion that there may, sometimes, be outstanding public interests that trump private commercial interest is anathema to them. They go on and on about conservative "principles" when in fact it's often just thoughtless dogma based on no empirical evidence. They really ought to cheer up a bit though. Things will almost certainly get worse. Essentially, you are right, though of course 'their' "philosophy" is situational: when it is to their advantage (or that of the US Chamber of Commerce's), Government handouts and protections are just fine. But then, what do you expect from people who cleared their heads by watching The Flintstones... (that's a joke) ----- or maybe not, I'm constantly stunned at the level of made up stuff passed on as TRUTH about the President and Commander in Chief of our country. Call him names, but don't go pretending there's something more to it, I mean, us liberals are into the 'theory' of evolution, but even we didn't literally believe Bush was actually a monkey ----- On that term paper: http://firstread.msnbc.msn.com/_news/2008/07/24/4423357-obamas-missing-thesis Note that the Obama paper was not a PhD dissertation or a Masters thesis, but rather an undergraduate term paper. No college retains undergrad term papers, though they do retain the first two types. Obama's paper was an undergraduate term paper, hence not important enough for anyone to hold onto. How many of your undergrad papers did you keep, especially if they were pre-computer era and thus manually typed? Also, perhaps these right wingers never have been to college, never really looked at what a quality college major entails. At Columbia Obama majored in political science with an international relations focus. As such, he would have had to study socialism and communism in order to understand how our enemies (and allies) thought and operated. I would expect anyone who professes to be an expert in political philosophy to have studied all the major 20th century political movements and philosophies. Furthermore, there's the concept of CRITICAL THINKING. This means you study to understand various arguments - and that understanding them is different than accepting them as valid. Every philosophy has its shortcomings. Many Fox watchers don't seem to have this critical thinking thing down - rumor and innuendo and fact is all mixed together based on preconceived political attitude. There is very little gray area, very little critical examination of what's being fed from the boob toob and other opinionated blather outlet. Whether this blather is right wing or left wing, someone who does critical thinking validates the statements, looks at the facts and tries to separate fact from fiction. Traditional press would do this. Somehow, modern right wing populists have left this behind as unnecessary for understanding the world. Last edited by Nesster; 07-10-2010 at 05:14 AM.

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07-09-2010, 06:10 PM	#16
GingeM Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: North of Canada Posts: 612 Original Poster	RML: Quote: (Funny hearing that, by the way, from a guy who claims the entire universe is arbitrarily-supernatural. It doesn't confer an understanding of historial economic theories, though.) While I know this will come back to bite me you know where I have to say that - of all the "religions"/religions, (take that how you please), the Pagan/Wiccan seems to me to be the most logical... Awaiting incoming... Oh... and to edit this... I do not think it is "arbitrarily supernatural". I believe that the ultimate arrogance of the human is that it believes in a supreme being - because that belief effectively says "I'm too stupid to understand why everything works so I'll attribute it to some unseen, unknown creature that floats around everywhere". Thought about with a single, sensible thought in one's mind that does sound a little silly. End edit Last edited by GingeM; 07-09-2010 at 06:15 PM.

07-09-2010, 06:19 PM	#17
dadipentak Site Supporter Join Date: Jul 2008 Location: Baltimore, Maryland Photos: Gallery Posts: 11,590	This "Obama is a socialist" crap is a classic example of the "big lie" It doesn't have to be true--if you repeat it often enough, people begin to think there's something to it. WMD's in Iraq is another good example. Socialist my butt--the Wall street fat cats are doing just fine and laughing all the way to their banks

07-09-2010, 06:27 PM	#18
FlashCube Inactive Account Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: In Transition Posts: 173	Originally posted by dadipentak This "Obama is a socialist" crap is a classic example of the "big lie" It doesn't have to be true--if you repeat it often enough, people begin to think there's something to it. WMD's in Iraq is another good example. Socialist my butt--the Wall street fat cats are doing just fine and laughing all the way to their banks Go listen to BHO's books on tape about attending communist seminars to "clear his head." He was also mentored by Frank Davis with the encouragement of his Grandfather. Also explain his affinity for guys like Van Jones and several other of his Czars that have those kinds of philosophies and associations? The opposite to the Wall Street fat cats doesn't have to be Hugo Chavez. The opposite of Haliburton doesn't have to be Soros. Therein lies the problem of political parties, especially the upper portion such as the DNC and RNC.

07-09-2010, 07:39 PM	#19
wildman Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Flyover America Posts: 4,469	"Obama is a Socialist" And your point is?

07-09-2010, 08:05 PM	#20
Ratmagiclady Veteran Member Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: GA Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 13,563	Originally posted by GingeM RML: While I know this will come back to bite me you know where I have to say that - of all the "religions"/religions, (take that how you please), the Pagan/Wiccan seems to me to be the most logical... Awaiting incoming... What? I can hardly be insulted by that, after all. Or are we not on the same page here? That's really kind of part of the point. Whatever you may think of religions, one needn't rely on supernatural 'claims' or invent bogeymen, like 'Socialism' and try to 'banish' them like monsters. The point is that you ourself superstitiously treat 'Socialism' and 'socialists' like demons and witches and don't know what you're talking about. When people say 'Obama is a socialist,' it doesn't mean they know either Obama's policies or what socialism actually is. It's just how they literally dress him up in a 'witch-doctor' costume and say 'Bad!' Has nothing to do with reality. Quote: Oh... and to edit this... I do not think it is "arbitrarily supernatural". I believe that the ultimate arrogance of the human is that it believes in a supreme being - because that belief effectively says "I'm too stupid to understand why everything works so I'll attribute it to some unseen, unknown creature that floats around everywhere". Thought about with a single, sensible thought in one's mind that does sound a little silly. End edit Well, take it from a 'Witch.' The world's magical enough without going out of your way to ignore reason and sense and causality. That includes economic policies and historical figures. Lady ain't threatened by science or reality as some people count their God to be. Or, shall we say, certain 'Invisible Hands of The Market?.... Call me a Witch, but I think you're the superstitious one: you seem to think not-getting-ripped-off on health insurance will turn Obama into Hitler cause of something about the evil magic word 'Socialist.'

07-09-2010, 08:14 PM	#21
FlashCube Inactive Account Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: In Transition Posts: 173	I prefer the Joker costume . . .

07-09-2010, 08:26 PM	#22
Ratmagiclady Veteran Member Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: GA Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 13,563	Originally posted by FlashCube I prefer the Joker costume . . . Wear what you want. Just call me Barbara. Had to hang up the batsuit and I'm sitting behind a computer all night. Actually, I shouldn't even make light of that: the guy's in office a month, and next to the 'witch doctor' costume, you paint him up in 'white face' and say he's a psycho monster in clown face for saying people should get the coverage they paid for from insurance corporations? Read Jung, much? I guess that's being a 'Witch' these days, though: you need half a degree in transpersonal psych before you even rate the ducking stool. It's just not like the old days, you know? Last edited by Ratmagiclady; 07-09-2010 at 08:43 PM.

07-09-2010, 08:49 PM	#23
deadwolfbones Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Santa Fe, NM Posts: 7,451	FlashCube, do you think everyone who has read the Communist Manifesto is a communist?

07-09-2010, 08:52 PM	#24
FlashCube Inactive Account Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: In Transition Posts: 173	Originally posted by Ratmagiclady Wear what you want. Just call me Barbara. Had to hang up the batsuit and I'm sitting behind a computer all night. Actually, I shouldn't even make light of that: the guy's in office a month, and next to the 'witch doctor' costume, you paint him up in 'white face' and say he's a psycho monster in clown face for saying people should get the coverage they paid for from insurance corporations? Read Jung, much? I guess that's being a 'Witch' these days, though: you need half a degree in transpersonal psych before you even rate the ducking stool. It's just not like the old days, you know? It wasn't me that painted him up like The Joker, but a kid from Chicago. After all, the POTUS is a D.C. character. As far as the insurance stuff, its a lot more complicated than that. The problem is, the government is less efficient at screwing people over or more efficient at screwing them over depending on how you look at it. Either way, whoever did the math had a broken abacus. Replacing Corporate Raiders with a Goon Squad isn't the idea of change that many had. Wait till the mandates, dictates and rationing starts.

07-09-2010, 09:01 PM	#25
jeffkrol Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Wisconsin USA Photos: Gallery Posts: 8,434	Originally posted by FlashCube It wasn't me that painted him up like The Joker, but a kid from Chicago. After all, the POTUS is a D.C. character. As far as the insurance stuff, its a lot more complicated than that. The problem is, the government is less efficient at screwing people over or more efficient at screwing them over depending on how you look at it. Either way, whoever did the math had a broken abacus. Replacing Corporate Raiders with a Goon Squad isn't the idea of change that many had. Wait till the mandates, dictates and rationing starts. They already have.. it's called Pre-existing conditions and pre-certification as to "medical necessity" from your own ins. company or "out of network"......pick em.

07-09-2010, 11:52 PM	#27
causey Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Arlington, VA Photos: Albums Posts: 3,757	Listening Gregorian chants to clear my head doesn't make me Pope Gregory. It seems you could use a definition: "Socialism: Any of various theories or systems of social organization in which the means of producing and distributing goods is owned collectively or by a centralized government that often plans and controls the economy." (Thefreedictionary). Originally posted by FlashCube Go listen to BHO's books on tape about attending communist seminars to "clear his head." He was also mentored by Frank Davis with the encouragement of his Grandfather. Also explain his affinity for guys like Van Jones and several other of his Czars that have those kinds of philosophies and associations? The opposite to the Wall Street fat cats doesn't have to be Hugo Chavez. The opposite of Haliburton doesn't have to be Soros. Therein lies the problem of political parties, especially the upper portion such as the DNC and RNC.

07-10-2010, 03:00 AM	#28
wildman Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Flyover America Posts: 4,469	Originally posted by causey "Socialism: Any of various theories or systems of social organization in which the means of producing and distributing goods is owned collectively or by a centralized government that often plans and controls the economy." (Thefreedictionary). This is where I find the right most disingenuous. They are not really against socialism they are against any economy that is short of absolute laissez-faire capitalism. Any suggestion of a mixed economy, no matter how moderate and reasonable it's policies, is not acceptable to them. Any suggestion that there may, sometimes, be outstanding public interests that trump private commercial interest is anathema to them. They go on and on about conservative "principles" when in fact it's often just thoughtless dogma based on no empirical evidence. They really ought to cheer up a bit though. Things will almost certainly get worse.

07-10-2010, 06:14 AM	#30
GingeM Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2010 Location: North of Canada Posts: 612 Original Poster	Quote: This "Obama is a socialist" crap is a classic example of the "big lie" It doesn't have to be true--if you repeat it often enough, people begin to think there's something to it. WMD's in Iraq is another good example. Nationalized Health Care... Check Taking control of the banking system... Check Taking control of the mortgage industry... Check Taking control of the car companies... Check Taking control of the energy industries... Check And on and on... Those are the acts of a Socialist. He doesn't have to be obvious about it like Chavez, he's doing it the "stealthy" way. If I sneak up behind you and stab you I'm a murderer. If I walk up to your face and stab you I'm a murderer. It matters not how I do it only that I did it and that's Obama for you. Wildman Quote: Any suggestion of a mixed economy, no matter how moderate and reasonable it's policies, is not acceptable to them. There's a very good reason for we of the "right bent" finding this stuff unacceptable. We don't trust you of the "Left bent" to not use the little things as the stepping stones to your eventual goals. Silly example but let's look at the seat belt law, (not whether it is right or wrong but rather it's implementation). We were promised up and down that it would only be a secondary offense yet, within 5 years it was a primary offense. That's why it's unacceptable - because you can no longer be trusted to be "fair".