[seacapt]

So little Chelsea is getting married. Future hubby is the son of two corrupt politicians . Willy C. put grand kids on his "bucket list" . It all sounds like the beginning of a 1970's horror flick about the end of the world but what's really scarey is this from the NBC affiliate in Binghamton NY:

RHINEBECK, N.Y. (AP) - For the curious looking to snap a picture or wander the upstate New York grounds where the daughter of a former president and a sitting secretary of state is expected to get married, police have some advice: Cut it out or face arrest.

State troopers working with the U.S. Secret Service say they've gotten more calls than usual related to the posh Astor Estate in Rhinebeck, where July 31.

On Wednesday they arrested two Norwegian journalists and charged them with trespassing as they snapped photos at the gate.

State police Major Michael A. Kopy says officers will be diligent about keeping the estate secure.


(Copyright 2010 by The Associated Press. All Rights Reserved

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Last edited by seacapt; 07-26-2010 at 09:51 AM.

[deadwolfbones]

Trespassing is a crime, is it not?

[seacapt]

Trespassing is a crime, is it not?

Is standing outside of a gate and taking pictures trespassing?

[shooz]

Ask the Secret Service.
What's with the inflamatory title?
I've never know Chelsie to be a publicity seeker.

[MRRiley]

Trespassing is a crime, is it not?

The question is... were the 2 Norwegian's trespassing? If they were standing on a public street or sidewalk taking photos of the gate, they were not trespassing. Private individuals cannot generally restrict photos of their property from outside of that property. Public officials similarly cannot generally restrict access to public property on behalf of or at the behest of private property owners.

And, as I said in another thread on this issue, it should be a simple photo-forensic exercise to determine whether the photographers were on public or private property when they were arrested.

And finally, even if they were on private property, there is always the long standing condition that generally preceeds a trespassing charge... that is... being notified either in writing (a No Trespassing sign)or verbally that they were trespassing and then refused a command to leave. While this is not strictly required once you are clearly on private property (say you climbed the fence) it is generally a requirement when the line between public and private property is unclear or the least bit vague.

Mike

p.s. Shooz is right about the thread title too. We have no idea if Chelsea is a "bridezilla" or not, but regardless, since her daddy isn't the Prez any more, and she is over 16, her SS protection is gone. Any SS protection activities surrounding this incident are purely because of her daddy (lifetime SS protection) and mommy (current Sec State gets SS protection)

[Ira]

This whole thread is about what the mods are trying to eliminate:

Obnoxious insulting of certain people because of political views or support.

The subject of the Norwegians' arrest has been well covered here. The baiting about Chelsea, her fiancee, and Dad have nothing to do with politics.

Thread should be deleted, because it's worthless to the goals of this forum.

[seacapt]

More than a few publications and websites have referred to Chelsea as "bridezilla " and "The First Bridzilla".
The journalists/photographers were arrested last week, way before the festivities. Ferncliff is somewhat of a public / tourist attraction and rents some of it's facillities to those who can afford it. The estate also has historic and architectural importance. I completely understand the need for security at this function but this arrest does bring up questions of infringement on constitutional rights. What if you or I had been there with a camera?

---------- Post added 07-26-10 at 02:20 PM ----------

This whole thread is about what the mods are trying to eliminate:

Obnoxious insulting of certain people because of political views or support.

The subject of the Norwegians' arrest has been well covered here. The baiting about Chelsea, her fiancee, and Dad have nothing to do with politics.

Thread should be deleted, because it's worthless to the goals of this forum.

Ira, I most assuredly did not insult any member of this forum. BTW Ferncliffe is a White design you might consider a trip up to Palm Beach to visit and photograph WhiteHall which was designed by 2 of White's apprentices it's a lovely way to spend an afternoon.

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Last edited by seacapt; 07-26-2010 at 01:56 PM.

[GeneV]

It would all depend upon where they were standing. If they were standing on private property with no public easement and there is a posted sign, then they are trespassing. If they are standing across the street, then not.

I run into this fairly often with businesses I represent. The first amendment only applies to the government. You don't have to let the press on to your property. However, anyone can stand on the sidewalk or other public right of way, and it is fair game.

What is a bridezilla, anyway? I've never watched the show.

[Parallax]

This whole thread is about what the mods are trying to eliminate:

Obnoxious insulting of certain people because of political views or support.

............

That's not quite right, Ira. We're trying to keep forum members from insulting each other, each other's core beliefs, etc, and to generally tone down the hostility toward each other. Public figures are fair game! (within reason)

---------- Post added 07-26-10 at 02:18 PM ----------

.....................

What is a bridezilla, anyway?

Think Leona Helmsley in a white dress.

[GeneV]

[/COLOR]Think Leona Helmsley in a white dress.

Do I have to?

[wildman]

"corrupt politicians"

corrupt+politicians

isn't that redundant?

[jeffkrol]

That's not quite right, Ira. We're trying to keep forum members from insulting each other, each other's core beliefs, etc, and to generally tone down the hostility toward each other. Public figures are fair game!

Not to get too technical but the closed thread referred to a "generic" group and not to a specific individual or his/her beliefs...

I hope the dumb redneck KKKonservatives win big in November so the whole planet could see how clueless they are ..AGAIN.

but I will agree that it is not in the spirit of the new and improved section and I doubt that my opinion on it is in the majority...
As to the current "blessing from the mods" I hope it sticks because I would surely miss calling Newt a evil doppelganger of a Keebler Elf.......
or, in a more serious note.. Palin as the "mama grizzly" of the Antichrist.......
Sorry, I'm done on this topic. .....I promise......... it's part of my new platform...

[gokenin]

Not to get too technical but the closed thread referred to a "generic" group and not to a specific individual or his/her beliefs...
but I will agree that it is not in the spirit of the new and improved section and I doubt that my opinion on it is in the majority...
As to the current "blessing from the mods" I hope it sticks because I would surely miss calling Newt a evil doppelganger of a Keebler Elf.......
or, in a more serious note.. Palin as the "mama grizzly" of the Antichrist.......
Sorry, I'm done on this topic. .....I promise......... it's part of my new platform...

Oh please can you just see the fun you would have in the 2012 election of the two of them went head to head I can see your headline now

"Can the Kebbler Elf take down the Mama Grizzly" film at 11

[seacapt]

The question is... were the 2 Norwegian's trespassing?

And, as I said in another thread on this issue, it should be a simple photo-forensic exercise to determine whether the photographers were on public or private property when they were arrested.

)

Has anybody seen anything that specificly puts them on the property? I couldn't find much.

---------- Post added 07-26-10 at 05:31 PM ----------

.
What's with the inflamatory title?
.

Controversy makes for lively conversation!

[GeneV]

It's really the same brief article run over and over in a hundred papers with very little information. There is not a whole lot of substance to talk about here.