Anyone tired of the mosque "news"

jeffkrol · 08-23-2010, 02:56 PM

Wonderful op-ed on the whole subject...
What a world..........
http://www.nytimes.com/2010/08/22/opinion/22rich.html

Quote:

Murdoch’s News Corporation, the hypocrisy is, if anything, thicker. A recent Wall Street Journal editorial darkly cited unspecified “reports” that Park51 has “money coming from Saudi charities or Gulf princes that also fund Wahabi madrassas.” As Jon Stewart observed, this brand of innuendo could also be applied to News Corp., whose second largest shareholder after the Murdoch family is a member of the Saudi royal family. Perhaps last week’s revelation that News Corp. has poured $1 million into G.O.P. campaign coffers was a fiendishly clever smokescreen to deflect anyone from following the far greater sum of Saudi money (a $3 billion stake) that has flowed into Murdoch enterprises, or the News Corp. money (at least $70 million) recently invested in a Saudi media company.

Quote:

Poor General Petraeus. Over the last week he has been ubiquitous in the major newspapers and on television as he pursues a publicity tour to pitch the war he’s inherited. But have you heard any buzz about what he had to say? Any debate? Any anything? No one was listening and no one cared. Everyone was too busy yelling about the mosque.

It’s poignant, really. Even as America’s most venerable soldier returned from the front to valiantly assume the role of Willy Loman, the product he was selling was being discredited and discontinued by his own self-proclaimed allies at home.

AND from the right..........

Quote:

Libertarian Congressman Ron Paul is breaking with many of his fellow Republicans - among them his son Rand - to support the creation of the planned Islamic cultural center near the former site of the World Trade Center that has come to be known as the "ground zero mosque."

In a statement decrying "demagogy" around the issue, the former Republican presidential candidate wrote late last week that "the debate should have provided the conservative defenders of property rights with a perfect example of how the right to own property also protects the 1st Amendment rights of assembly and religion by supporting the building of the mosque."

"Instead, we hear lip service given to the property rights position while demanding that the need to be 'sensitive' requires an all-out assault on the building of a mosque, several blocks from 'ground zero,'" Paul continues.

He goes on to argue that "the neo-conservatives who demand continual war in the Middle East and Central Asia...never miss a chance to use hatred toward Muslims to rally support for the ill conceived preventative wars."

Adds Paul: "It is repeatedly said that 64% of the people, after listening to the political demagogues, don't want the mosque to be built. What would we do if 75% of the people insist that no more Catholic churches be built in New York City? The point being is that majorities can become oppressors of minority rights as well as individual dictators."

http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-503544_162-20014453-503544.html

Last edited by jeffkrol; 08-23-2010 at 03:36 PM.

Hali · 08-23-2010, 07:10 PM

Charlie Brooker | 'Ground Zero mosque'? The reality is less provocative | Comment is free | The Guardian

JeffJS · 08-23-2010, 07:29 PM - **1 Like**

Were any of the people, other than the hijaker terrorists (let's call them what they were), Muslim? If so, they should be included in any memorial built. Period.

Every time one of these hot topic issues comes up, I have to wonder, what is REALLY going on and why don't they want us to know about it? By 'They', I mean Both sides of our government.

jeffkrol · 08-23-2010, 08:16 PM

Seems I was "channeling" a couple of old Daily Shows........
August 19, 2010 - Jennifer Aniston - The Daily Show With Jon Stewart - Full Episode Video | Comedy Central
August 19, 2010 - Jennifer Aniston - The Daily Show With Jon Stewart - Full Episode Video | Comedy Central

troglodyte · 08-24-2010, 01:03 AM - **1 Like**

Jeffkrol,
I agree with those who say build the mosque elsewhere. But, that includes all religious buildings with a radius from the height of the lost towers. It's not Islam that brought them down, all religions did. I see no difference in any religion.

---------- Post added 08-24-10 at 12:07 AM ----------

As long as differences in religion exist which would cause death, then nobody gets to play. I say send the message no religion should ever do that shit again. That message should mean banning all religions there, yes even atheist organizations too.

GeneV · 08-24-2010, 05:55 AM

I'm tired of it. I'm tired of the term "Ground Zero Mosque," when neither part of that term is accurate. Though it probably came from a good place, I don't think an Islamic center was a particularly good idea, but it is not some huge insult either. Do we prohibit any Christian church from being located within __ blocks of the Oklahoma federal building, because a nut job who blew it up was obsessed the "Christian Identity" movement of William Pierce's Turner Diaries, especially if the church was founded to debunk the legitimacy of the "Christian Identiy" philosophy?

JohnInIndy · 08-24-2010, 12:30 PM - **1 Like**

It's not a mosque. It's a cultural center. It's not ground zero. It's where the Towers collapsed.

Parallax · 08-24-2010, 12:59 PM

Originally posted by JohnInIndy

It's not a mosque. It's a cultural center. ..............

I wonder if people of all religions will be welcomed there, or just the followers of The Religion of Peace.

GeneV · 08-24-2010, 02:28 PM

Originally posted by JohnInIndy

It's not a mosque. It's a cultural center. It's not ground zero. It's where the Towers collapsed.

Your first pair of sentences is correct. PARK51 .

The last sentence is simply false. The location is two blocks from where the towers collapsed, and the site of the collapse is not even visible from the project.

FWIW, it also is not the only mosque in lower Manhattan.

jeffkrol · 08-24-2010, 06:50 PM

Of course then there's this to keep it interesting:
Jonah Goldberg: Caring about Muslims is a hate crime against Real Americans - War Room - Salon.com

GeneV · 08-24-2010, 07:01 PM

Originally posted by jeffkrol

Of course then there's this to keep it interesting:
Jonah Goldberg: Caring about Muslims is a hate crime against Real Americans - War Room - Salon.com

Oh my. He and Ann Coulter should get a room.

Hali · 08-24-2010, 07:03 PM

Originally posted by Parallax

I wonder if people of all religions will be welcomed there, or just the followers of The Religion of Peace.

Well I guess that because the whole reason for it is to improve inter faith relations that yes, people of all religions would be allowed in.

This stupid 'news' story just shows the insane level of Islamophobia in the world today.

What happened to freedom of religion?

stevewig · 08-25-2010, 04:56 AM

Originally posted by Hali

Well I guess that because the whole reason for it is to improve inter faith relations that yes, people of all religions would be allowed in.

This stupid 'news' story just shows the insane level of Islamophobia in the world today.

What happened to freedom of religion?

Very good comment!

The "media" and entertainment industry has successfully brainwashed a whole generation (which cannot think for itself), it would appear, into equating Islam with jihad, suicide bombers and Al-qaeda.

I suspect that it is now too late to promote rational thinking and behaviour on this question.

Parallax · 08-25-2010, 05:12 AM

Originally posted by Hali

What happened to freedom of religion?

Good question. We were sent a pretty clear message/reminder on 9/11/01 that there is a large group of people in the world that think only one religion and culture has the right to exist.

GeneV · 08-25-2010, 05:31 AM

Originally posted by Parallax

Good question. We were sent a pretty clear message/reminder on 9/11/01 that there is a large group of people in the world that think only one religion and culture has the right to exist.

Though the religion of that large group of people may actually differ from one another.

08-23-2010, 02:56 PM	#1
jeffkrol Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Wisconsin USA Photos: Gallery Posts: 8,434	Anyone tired of the mosque "news" Wonderful op-ed on the whole subject... What a world.......... http://www.nytimes.com/2010/08/22/opinion/22rich.html Quote: Murdoch’s News Corporation, the hypocrisy is, if anything, thicker. A recent Wall Street Journal editorial darkly cited unspecified “reports” that Park51 has “money coming from Saudi charities or Gulf princes that also fund Wahabi madrassas.” As Jon Stewart observed, this brand of innuendo could also be applied to News Corp., whose second largest shareholder after the Murdoch family is a member of the Saudi royal family. Perhaps last week’s revelation that News Corp. has poured $1 million into G.O.P. campaign coffers was a fiendishly clever smokescreen to deflect anyone from following the far greater sum of Saudi money (a $3 billion stake) that has flowed into Murdoch enterprises, or the News Corp. money (at least $70 million) recently invested in a Saudi media company. Quote: Poor General Petraeus. Over the last week he has been ubiquitous in the major newspapers and on television as he pursues a publicity tour to pitch the war he’s inherited. But have you heard any buzz about what he had to say? Any debate? Any anything? No one was listening and no one cared. Everyone was too busy yelling about the mosque. It’s poignant, really. Even as America’s most venerable soldier returned from the front to valiantly assume the role of Willy Loman, the product he was selling was being discredited and discontinued by his own self-proclaimed allies at home. AND from the right.......... Quote: Libertarian Congressman Ron Paul is breaking with many of his fellow Republicans - among them his son Rand - to support the creation of the planned Islamic cultural center near the former site of the World Trade Center that has come to be known as the "ground zero mosque." In a statement decrying "demagogy" around the issue, the former Republican presidential candidate wrote late last week that "the debate should have provided the conservative defenders of property rights with a perfect example of how the right to own property also protects the 1st Amendment rights of assembly and religion by supporting the building of the mosque." "Instead, we hear lip service given to the property rights position while demanding that the need to be 'sensitive' requires an all-out assault on the building of a mosque, several blocks from 'ground zero,'" Paul continues. He goes on to argue that "the neo-conservatives who demand continual war in the Middle East and Central Asia...never miss a chance to use hatred toward Muslims to rally support for the ill conceived preventative wars." Adds Paul: "It is repeatedly said that 64% of the people, after listening to the political demagogues, don't want the mosque to be built. What would we do if 75% of the people insist that no more Catholic churches be built in New York City? The point being is that majorities can become oppressors of minority rights as well as individual dictators." http://www.cbsnews.com/8301-503544_162-20014453-503544.html Last edited by jeffkrol; 08-23-2010 at 03:36 PM.

08-24-2010, 02:28 PM	#9
GeneV Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Albuquerque NM Photos: Albums Posts: 9,830	Originally posted by JohnInIndy It's not a mosque. It's a cultural center. It's not ground zero. It's where the Towers collapsed. Your first pair of sentences is correct. PARK51 . The last sentence is simply false. The location is two blocks from where the towers collapsed, and the site of the collapse is not even visible from the project. FWIW, it also is not the only mosque in lower Manhattan. Last edited by GeneV; 08-24-2010 at 06:26 PM.

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08-23-2010, 07:10 PM	#2
Hali Junior Member Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: United Kingdom Posts: 48	Charlie Brooker \| 'Ground Zero mosque'? The reality is less provocative \| Comment is free \| The Guardian

08-23-2010, 07:29 PM - 1 Like	#3
JeffJS Inactive Account Join Date: Aug 2008 Location: Michigan, USA Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 7,484	Were any of the people, other than the hijaker terrorists (let's call them what they were), Muslim? If so, they should be included in any memorial built. Period. Every time one of these hot topic issues comes up, I have to wonder, what is REALLY going on and why don't they want us to know about it? By 'They', I mean Both sides of our government.

08-23-2010, 08:16 PM	#4
jeffkrol Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Wisconsin USA Photos: Gallery Posts: 8,434 Original Poster	Seems I was "channeling" a couple of old Daily Shows........ August 19, 2010 - Jennifer Aniston - The Daily Show With Jon Stewart - Full Episode Video \| Comedy Central August 19, 2010 - Jennifer Aniston - The Daily Show With Jon Stewart - Full Episode Video \| Comedy Central

08-24-2010, 01:03 AM - 1 Like	#5
troglodyte Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2010 Location: Oz Posts: 408	Jeffkrol, I agree with those who say build the mosque elsewhere. But, that includes all religious buildings with a radius from the height of the lost towers. It's not Islam that brought them down, all religions did. I see no difference in any religion. ---------- Post added 08-24-10 at 12:07 AM ---------- As long as differences in religion exist which would cause death, then nobody gets to play. I say send the message no religion should ever do that shit again. That message should mean banning all religions there, yes even atheist organizations too.

08-24-2010, 05:55 AM	#6
GeneV Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Albuquerque NM Photos: Albums Posts: 9,830	I'm tired of it. I'm tired of the term "Ground Zero Mosque," when neither part of that term is accurate. Though it probably came from a good place, I don't think an Islamic center was a particularly good idea, but it is not some huge insult either. Do we prohibit any Christian church from being located within __ blocks of the Oklahoma federal building, because a nut job who blew it up was obsessed the "Christian Identity" movement of William Pierce's Turner Diaries, especially if the church was founded to debunk the legitimacy of the "Christian Identiy" philosophy?

08-24-2010, 12:30 PM - 1 Like	#7
JohnInIndy Veteran Member Join Date: Aug 2010 Posts: 794	It's not a mosque. It's a cultural center. It's not ground zero. It's where the Towers collapsed.

08-24-2010, 12:59 PM	#8
Parallax Senior Moderator Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: South Dakota Photos: Gallery Posts: 19,332	Originally posted by JohnInIndy It's not a mosque. It's a cultural center. .............. I wonder if people of all religions will be welcomed there, or just the followers of The Religion of Peace.

08-24-2010, 06:50 PM	#10
jeffkrol Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Wisconsin USA Photos: Gallery Posts: 8,434 Original Poster	Of course then there's this to keep it interesting: Jonah Goldberg: Caring about Muslims is a hate crime against Real Americans - War Room - Salon.com

08-24-2010, 07:01 PM	#11
GeneV Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Albuquerque NM Photos: Albums Posts: 9,830	Originally posted by jeffkrol Of course then there's this to keep it interesting: Jonah Goldberg: Caring about Muslims is a hate crime against Real Americans - War Room - Salon.com Oh my. He and Ann Coulter should get a room.

08-24-2010, 07:03 PM	#12
Hali Junior Member Join Date: Dec 2009 Location: United Kingdom Posts: 48	Originally posted by Parallax I wonder if people of all religions will be welcomed there, or just the followers of The Religion of Peace. Well I guess that because the whole reason for it is to improve inter faith relations that yes, people of all religions would be allowed in. This stupid 'news' story just shows the insane level of Islamophobia in the world today. What happened to freedom of religion?

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08-25-2010, 04:56 AM	#13
stevewig Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2010 Posts: 773	Originally posted by Hali Well I guess that because the whole reason for it is to improve inter faith relations that yes, people of all religions would be allowed in. This stupid 'news' story just shows the insane level of Islamophobia in the world today. What happened to freedom of religion? Very good comment! The "media" and entertainment industry has successfully brainwashed a whole generation (which cannot think for itself), it would appear, into equating Islam with jihad, suicide bombers and Al-qaeda. I suspect that it is now too late to promote rational thinking and behaviour on this question.

08-25-2010, 05:12 AM	#14
Parallax Senior Moderator Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: South Dakota Photos: Gallery Posts: 19,332	Originally posted by Hali What happened to freedom of religion? Good question. We were sent a pretty clear message/reminder on 9/11/01 that there is a large group of people in the world that think only one religion and culture has the right to exist.

08-25-2010, 05:31 AM	#15
GeneV Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Albuquerque NM Photos: Albums Posts: 9,830	Originally posted by Parallax Good question. We were sent a pretty clear message/reminder on 9/11/01 that there is a large group of people in the world that think only one religion and culture has the right to exist. Though the religion of that large group of people may actually differ from one another.