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12-16-2010, 09:09 AM   #1
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Are "we" sick of "this"

Too funny...............needs a thread of it's own.........
QuoteQuote:
“We shouldn’t be jamming a major arms control treaty up against Christmas; it’s sacrilegious and disrespectful," he told POLITICO. "What's going on here is just wrong. This is the most sacred holiday for Christians. They did the same thing last year - they kept everybody here until [Christmas Eve] to force something down everybody's throat. I think Americans are sick of this.
Jim DeMint: Votes 'sacrilegious' - Manu Raju - POLITICO.com
Addendum:
http://voices.washingtonpost.com/postpartisan/2010/12/reid_kyl_and_the_ridiculous_wa.html
QuoteQuote:
"And don't tell me about Christmas," Biden told NBC News's Andrea Mitchell in an exclusive interview at the United Nations yesterday."There's 10 days between now and Christmas. I hope I don't get in the way of your Christmas shopping, but this is the nation's business....[N]ational security is at stake. Act! Act!"

Yes, act! -- on START; on repeal of don't ask don't tell, and on anything else on the legislative plate. Working people couldn't possibly take off before Christmas (if they are among the lucky ones who can) without completing all of their work. Neither should Congress.


12-16-2010, 10:16 AM   #2
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I have mixed feelings about that. One the one hand, it is supposed to be a full time job, and the job should come first. OTOH, the fewer days they are in session, the fewer days they have to screw things up.
12-16-2010, 10:31 AM   #3
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"sacrilegious and disrespectful"

Oh please...this has no more to do with Christmas than it would Halloween.

Last edited by larryinlc; 12-16-2010 at 01:36 PM. Reason: spelling error
12-16-2010, 11:05 AM   #4
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QuoteOriginally posted by larryinlc Quote
"sacrilegious and disrespectful"

Oh please...this has no more do do with Christmas than it would Halloween.
Amen!

This guy is a lazy bum who wants a big long vacation (paid vacation!). Do your job Mr. Slacker! Being that Christmas falls on my day off this year, I don't get a day off this year and most other people won't either. So join the rest of the country on Dec. 24 and go to work.

12-16-2010, 11:15 AM   #5
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Now I feel sacrilegious and disrespectful for even posting on a forum this close to Christmas. Baby Jesus hates me for sure.
12-16-2010, 11:27 AM   #6
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QuoteOriginally posted by Parallax Quote
I have mixed feelings about that. One the one hand, it is supposed to be a full time job, and the job should come first. OTOH, the fewer days they are in session, the fewer days they have to screw things up.
Actually just the opposite. It was designed to be a part time job. And they're doing the same thing as last year. Ramming bad legislation down our maw before the break. And before they are out of office. What can we do to them now? Nothing. They won't be back, most anyway. And they know the crap they want to pass won't happen next year. Proves however that this congress didn't get the message about what the voter wants. They deserve to be out.
12-16-2010, 12:42 PM   #7
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Nothing says peace on earth like a nuclear arsenal. If we got rid of nukes and russia got rid of their nukes, there wouldn't be any NORAD and no one would be able to track Santa.
12-16-2010, 01:17 PM   #8
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QuoteOriginally posted by mikemike Quote
Nothing says peace on earth like a nuclear arsenal. If we got rid of nukes and russia got rid of their nukes, there wouldn't be any NORAD and no one would be able to track Santa.


12-16-2010, 02:40 PM   #9
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Guess you fail to realize the shortcomings of START and also what is going on in the world with nukes. When it was just US and USSR didn't matter. Each country knew the other wouldn't "push the button". Look at what's out there now. This treaty isn't good for the US.
12-16-2010, 02:53 PM   #10
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QuoteOriginally posted by JavaJoe Quote
Guess you fail to realize the shortcomings of START and also what is going on in the world with nukes. When it was just US and USSR didn't matter. Each country knew the other wouldn't "push the button". Look at what's out there now. This treaty isn't good for the US.
No credible expert anywhere thinks it's a good idea to have more money going to barely keeping more nukes from ending up in the wind, requiring us to have even more nukes to 'deter' still more nukes, *especially* without a Cold War or any illusion that the overkill is needed even worst-case scenario.

All this is about is the GOP trying to prevent an Obama success at what everyone wants, then trying to call it their 'War on Christmas.'

Like a little more 'Peace on Earth' is a bad way to spend that night, anyway, never mind 'sacrilege.' The *nukes* are sacrilege, if anything. Maybe for most Christians, using that holiday as an excuse to spread fear and promote more danger of pointless horror.... *that* ought to be the sacrilege.

This treaty didn't just drop out of the blue: only the stonewalling and filibustering everything and demands for things like the whole health care bill to be read aloud while no one was there made it run up against the holiday vacation he wants.

People trying to *prevent* nuclear holocausts don't get the week off, why should people trying to *promote* them?

There's no strategic interest on anyone's part to have more of those things out there: there's no scenario where more nukes helps. Past a certain very limited point, too much comes down to much care who's a Commie or whose nukes are whose, anyway. The world's too dependent on too much that's too fragile: the only people with interest in more are looking forward to their Apocalypse, and the closest any of them are to having thousands of the things is in the U.S. arsenal, anyway, with maybe some right-wing Russian Orthodox coming in second.

Last edited by Ratmagiclady; 12-16-2010 at 03:05 PM.
12-16-2010, 03:16 PM   #11
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QuoteOriginally posted by JavaJoe Quote
Guess you fail to realize the shortcomings of START and also what is going on in the world with nukes. When it was just US and USSR didn't matter. Each country knew the other wouldn't "push the button". Look at what's out there now. This treaty isn't good for the US.
I don't know what you mean by "what's out there now," but if you are referring to N. Korea, Iran, or Al Queada I don't see any of those as a reason to not implement this. North Korea and Iran are only regional threats for the foreseeable future so their nuke development doesn't directly affect us in such a way that we need thousands of ICBMs on hair trigger notice to deal with them. Non-state terrorists pose a threat that cannot be responded with such a blunt instrument as a mushroom cloud, so I don't see why that would stop us from cutting down on ICBMs either.

Even if this was ratified and implemented (and Obama is actively implementing this unilaterally regardless of ratification) we would still be able to nuke any other nuclear state into the history books with the remaining arsenal.

Ratifying this and implementing it will bring US and Russian arsenals down to a scale where the next round of reductions should be multi-lateral so that they include France, China, England, India, Pakistan, and Israel.
12-17-2010, 08:49 AM   #12
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Note also that the details of the treaty have been known already for..
QuoteQuote:
Senate Majority Leader Harry Reid, D-Nev., is pushing the Senate to move forward on several major pending matters, and in some cases he may be overreaching, but not so in the case of the new START Treaty.

The first Strategic Arms Reduction Treaty was negotiated by President Ronald Reagan and ratified under President George H. W. Bush, so the concept is tried and true.

This new treaty was signed by President Barack Obama and Russian President Dmitry Medvedev in April, subject to ratification. This is not one of those legislative matters that senators, representatives and talk show hosts like to characterize as too long for anyone to read. The treaty is less than 20 pages long and the side notes are about 160 pages.

Any senator who hasn’t taken the time to read it or hasn’t had a trusted staff specialist vet it for him has only himself to blame.

And every member of the Senate should be certain that their colleagues on the Senate Foreign Relations Committee read the treaty, studied the analysis and considered its pros and cons. And those 18 senators voted 14-4 for ratification.
Youngstown News, There’s been ample time to deliberate new START treaty

So that's DeMint spewing the usual obstructionist BS

QuoteQuote:
More important, the treaty would reinstitute an inspection regime that expired more than a year ago. Without inspections it is impossible to follow the legendary advice of President Reagan: Trust but verify.

Ratification of the START treaty is not only an important key to continued diplomatic relations between Russia and the U.S., it sends a message to the rest of the world that these two nuclear super powers are working to reduce their arsenals. That’s important at a time when efforts continue to stop the proliferation of nuclear weapons in other countries.

Ironically, Sen. Jon Kyl, R-Ariz., and Sen. Jim DeMint, R. S.C., have suggested it is unseemly for Reid to be pushing for ratification of the treaty before the Senate leaves for its Christmas recess.

It’s far from unseemly; it’s in perfect keeping with the message of the season, given its strong ties to the phrase peace on Earth.

The omnibus budget bill may have to wait for the next Congress, and any threatened shutdown of the government can be averted by approving a continue budget resolution.

But the Senate should listen to its own foreign relations experts and ratify the treaty without further delay.

There is another consideration here - ie. nuclear proliferation control - that becomes easier with the inspection access. Russia's nukes are one of the places where nations and terrorists potentially can get access. It is in everyone's as well as the US's best interest to be able to help ensure these nukes don't get diverted or stolen.
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