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12-17-2010, 08:00 AM   #16
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QuoteOriginally posted by Ira Quote

Of course, many Canadians wouldn't want to do that because it would affect their cheap vacations.
Cheap vacations = Florida.

12-17-2010, 09:48 AM   #17
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We could stop importing any oil from VZ and many other countries if Obama would just let us drill our own. China and Russia are doing it why can't we? And think of the jobs benefit.
12-17-2010, 10:16 AM   #18
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QuoteOriginally posted by JavaJoe Quote
We could stop importing any oil from VZ and many other countries if Obama would just let us drill our own. China and Russia are doing it why can't we? And think of the jobs benefit.
Cause it's untrue. Even the deregulated offshore drilling the GOP *wants* is a fraction of a percentage of the oil demand: it may be very profitable for a few, but it sure wouldn't stop us being an oil importer.
12-17-2010, 12:27 PM   #19
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QuoteOriginally posted by Wheatfield Quote
Neither of the above thank you. I like it where I am.


Woops, Ira. The American government has been less than stellar about being truthful over the past while, actually starting a war that killed 100s of thousands by lying about stuff.
Is the war in Iraq a political bone or is it the result of a criminal, rogue government?
If you were trying to make a point, you failed miserably.

12-17-2010, 12:32 PM   #20
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QuoteOriginally posted by Wheatfield Quote
Cheap vacations = Florida.
It's only cheap for Canadians who never heard of the concept of tipping.

As a matter of fact, Hollywood, Florida...a favorite of Canadians and close to where I live...played with the idea of instituting a citywide mandatory gratuity at restaurants because the Canadians were so damn cheap that the servers couldn't make a living. And we're not talking about 6% versus 10%.

We're talking about zero %.

As the U.S. has to support your defense, I guess you expect us to support your hamburgers as well.
12-17-2010, 12:56 PM   #21
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QuoteOriginally posted by Ratmagiclady Quote
Cause it's untrue. Even the deregulated offshore drilling the GOP *wants* is a fraction of a percentage of the oil demand: it may be very profitable for a few, but it sure wouldn't stop us being an oil importer.
I've changed my opinion on this:

We should drill here if safety can be 99% guaranteed, and the American people are guaranteed a price advantage for doing so.
12-17-2010, 01:07 PM   #22
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QuoteOriginally posted by Ira Quote
It's only cheap for Canadians who never heard of the concept of tipping.

As a matter of fact, Hollywood, Florida...a favorite of Canadians and close to where I live...played with the idea of instituting a citywide mandatory gratuity at restaurants because the Canadians were so damn cheap that the servers couldn't make a living. And we're not talking about 6% versus 10%.

We're talking about zero %.

As the U.S. has to support your defense, I guess you expect us to support your hamburgers as well.
Actually who's complaining more......... the waiters/waitresses or the businesses........
QuoteQuote:
Thanks for asking! On January 1, 2009 the Florida minimum wage increase from $6.79 to $7.21 per hour. Also effective on that date, the minimum wage for tipped workers in Florida is $4.19 per hour. Most food servers qualify as tipped employees.

Keep in mind that tipped employees must average $7.21 per hour over the payroll period, counting tips and wages. If they do not, the employer must pay the difference in wages.

http://www.humanresourceblog.com/2009/01/08/waitress-florida-wage/

12-17-2010, 02:26 PM   #23
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QuoteOriginally posted by jeffkrol Quote
Actually who's complaining more......... the waiters/waitresses or the businesses........

Waitress Florida wage Human Resource Blog

Restaurants down here pay servers and bartenders 2 to 4 bucks an hour. And not only don't servers report all of their tips, the owners FIRE servers every 10 months to keep the cycle going. So, even with what you're saying, the most they can legally hope for is $7.21 an hour.

WOW!!! BIG BUCKS!!!!

Get it? None of this means anything!

Bartenders can make 60 to 70G easy in a lousy place, and in the good ones, God knows how much they can make. And that's where the ATF and Florida counties point them out to the IRS.

But as far as minimum wage salaries go, they don't follow it because it's meaningless. I have never heard of a restaurant owner having to compensate an employee for earning under $7.21 an hour. Hell, WalMart and McDonalds pay better than that to start.

Of course, in those restaurants that cater to Canadians, servers are lucky to clear 9 grand a year.

Cheap, cheap, CHEAP! Which is why they have no problem supporting a brutal dictatorship in Cuba, just to save a few bucks on their vacation. It's incredible arrogance.

And they come to the U.S. during the cold months to vacation and use our superior health care system, which they don't deserve.

Last edited by Ira; 12-17-2010 at 02:35 PM.
12-17-2010, 02:54 PM   #24
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I studied the overthrow of Chavez in 2002 by conservative opposition elements for international relations grad study, especially the US role, or more concrete, it's reaction. This involved a lot of wider research on US policy towards Venezuela, and media reaction to issues in Venezuela.

Quite frankly, the Bush administration's reaction to the coup was disgusting, if you're a fan of democracy. The US media approach was also woeful from an independent perspective. Check this out for reactions from US outlets. US media information on Chavez is quite bizarre sometimes, and often looks more like a smear campaign that good journalism - facts are ignored or skewed, and tenuous or false claims are made - always against Chavez.

Not that this means you have to be a fan of Chavez, but I would urge you to read up on it from independent or monitoring sources.

Also check out The War on Democracy, a John Pilger film. You don't have to agree with the conclusions, but he does unearth a lot of facts.
12-17-2010, 03:01 PM   #25
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Some things don't change, e.g. US attitude towards Latin America
12-17-2010, 03:15 PM   #26
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QuoteOriginally posted by Ira Quote
Restaurants down here pay servers and bartenders 2 to 4 bucks an hour.
Bartenders can make 60 to 70G easy in a lousy place, and in the good ones, God knows how much they can make. And that's where the ATF and Florida counties point them out to the IRS.

But as far as minimum wage salaries go, they don't follow it because it's meaningless. I have never heard of a restaurant owner having to compensate an employee for earning under $7.21 an hour.
So they break 2 laws and report others for breaking the law.. NICE.....
12-18-2010, 04:04 PM   #27
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QuoteOriginally posted by CWyatt Quote
I studied the overthrow of Chavez in 2002 by conservative opposition elements for international relations grad study, especially the US role, or more concrete, it's reaction. This involved a lot of wider research on US policy towards Venezuela, and media reaction to issues in Venezuela.

Quite frankly, the Bush administration's reaction to the coup was disgusting, if you're a fan of democracy. The US media approach was also woeful from an independent perspective. Check this out for reactions from US outlets. US media information on Chavez is quite bizarre sometimes, and often looks more like a smear campaign that good journalism - facts are ignored or skewed, and tenuous or false claims are made - always against Chavez.

Not that this means you have to be a fan of Chavez, but I would urge you to read up on it from independent or monitoring sources.

Also check out The War on Democracy, a John Pilger film. You don't have to agree with the conclusions, but he does unearth a lot of facts.
Did you bother doing any research about when Chavez tried to overthrow Carlos Andres Peres?

There is nothing "bizarre" about the media coverage of Chavez. It is all factual.

I don't need you or anyone to encourage me to read up on it from "independent monitoring sources," because exactly what do you think the devilsexcrement.com, veneconomy.com, or Bloomberg News are?

In other words, what do you mean by independent:

La Granma?

But let's take this one step and one issue at a time, like the enabling law just enacted, which is totally unconstitutional.

Would you care to discuss/debate this with me here, slowly and rationally and calmly? So I have the opportunity to expose the guy for the scumbag that he is? And expose his supporters for the idiots they are?

Nothing personal against you. Personal attacks aren't allowed here.

But when people voice their support for the next Hitler or Stalin, it's an American's right to cut these a-holes at the balls.
12-18-2010, 04:15 PM   #28
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I'm not going to say I'm an expert on Venezuelan politics and Chavez, but yes I did 'bother doing any research' on a lot of Venezuelan subjects, including Chavez's failed coup. As part of a history degree I've studied a decent amount of Venezuelan history, and as part of an international relations degree have done at lot of work on Venezuelan politics and foreign relations since around the mid 1980's.

The media coverage of Chavez has been, actually, categorically not all factual. There is no doubt about this. There's a lot of yellow journalism going on.

Also, it's typical of a weak position to use exaggeration to achieve effect. i.e. - although I've noted a well-known independant news monitoring source, you note 'Granma' (not 'La Granma') from Cuba. And Chavez is 'the next Hitler or Stalin'.

And what is this bizarre 'American's right'?? It should be the right of people everywhere to voice their political opinion. I don't care if you're from the U.S. or Tokelau. Also, being American does not give you some special right to intervene in other peoples' political choices.

I'm not a huge Chavez supporter. I think a lot of what he has done is very good. But I also consider myself very libertarian socially.

RE the enabling law, I need to read about this from more sources and see the facts of it, not as interpreted by media outlets which have a history of incorrect or misleading coverage in these issues.

Last edited by CWyatt; 12-18-2010 at 04:34 PM.
12-18-2010, 05:00 PM   #29
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QuoteOriginally posted by CWyatt Quote

The media coverage of Chavez has been, actually, categorically not all factual. There is no doubt about this. There's a lot of yellow journalism going on.
So:

Exactly what about the world media coverage of Chavez hasn't been factual? It shouldn't be too difficult for you to point out specific examples, correct?

As I posted, let's talk facts here. Not bullshit.

Can you please point to ANY reporting which you consider yellow journalism?

My God--this is going to be FUN!

But my guess is that you won't, because you can't.

As soon as someone starts blaming the media, you know they're full of crap.

By the way:

How come Leopoldo Lopez was barred from running for further office?
12-18-2010, 05:08 PM   #30
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See my first post, did you read it? Contained a link to an article quoting exactly what what you've just claimed doesn't exist.
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