[stevewig]

I understand that the recent Bin Laden success was partially due to intelligence gathered during the "enhanced questioning" (torture) that was performed during the Bush/Cheney era.

Does this now mean that this type of questioning is legit and back in the bag of tricks that is and should be available?

[ihasa]

Do we actually know that this is the case? Do we have a source other than Cheney who by his own admission, has been 'out of the loop' for some time.

[deadwolfbones]

Actually, Rummy says otherwise...

ThinkProgress Rumsfeld: Bin Laden Info From Gitmo Detainees Was Not Obtained Through ‘Harsh Treatment’ Or ‘Waterboarding’

There was a Department of Defense guy on Fox News this morning blowing minds. He said that all of the usable info we got from these guys was likely from "a civilized conversation over a few Happy Meals." The anchor lady was all like "Yeah, but the waterboarding broke their spirit, right?" and he said "Well, not really. Being nice and humane and gaining their trust over some fries and a Coke turned out to be more effective in the end."

[deadwolfbones]

Which of course reminds me of:

You Tube

You Tube

[BigDave]

Ah hahhh! You nanny state operatives should find this appalling! Torture by MickeyD's! How DISGUSTING! What's next, going further with Boston Market??? How repugnant!

[shooz]

Personally I prefer a whopper or a coney dog.

What's a nanny state operative?
Nanny McFee?

[BigDave]

Nanny state, those in government or elsewhere that think we cannot take care of ourselves or our families without them. Like when SF outlaws toys in Happy Meals because I guess they feel parents cannot decide what is good for their kids.

And it just came to me, since someone mentioned happy meals, what toy did the guy get with his? Maybe that pushed him over the edge!

Regards,

[shooz]

Oh, gosh.
You missed the part where kids were chocking on them or getting lead poisoning.
By banning them, it frees up the courts to pursue more important things like limiting the publics right for class action suits.
Saves mickyDs money.
What's so wrong with that?
Are you getting soft?

[ihasa]

Actually, Rummy says otherwise...

ThinkProgress Rumsfeld: Bin Laden Info From Gitmo Detainees Was Not Obtained Through ‘Harsh Treatment’ Or ‘Waterboarding’

There was a Department of Defense guy on Fox News this morning blowing minds. He said that all of the usable info we got from these guys was likely from "a civilized conversation over a few Happy Meals." The anchor lady was all like "Yeah, but the waterboarding broke their spirit, right?" and he said "Well, not really. Being nice and humane and gaining their trust over some fries and a Coke turned out to be more effective in the end."

Wow. It just gets better and better!

[stevewig]

Do we actually know that this is the case? Do we have a source other than Cheney who by his own admission, has been 'out of the loop' for some time.

My personal answer - who knows, probably we'll never know but read this report as an example:

Rep. King: Waterboarded Khalid Sheikh Mohammed Gave Up Osama Bin Laden's Courier CBS New York

[ihasa]

We'll not know unless all the files are made public (one for julian assange?) But in the meantime there'll be a lot of people wanting to justify torture. It's too early yet.

[Nesster]

This is a prime example of how our moral compass gets spun by some neobarbaric sadists with a large psychopathic patch where actual human feeling should be.

The point is, torture is and remains repugnant and not something a democratic government ought to engage in. It is also illegal, and contrary to international law and rules of war.

The point is, nobody has shown credible evidence that torture produces the claimed results, and thus, given the above point about its repugnance and criminality, it is not a necessary option.

[Coeurdechene]

The point is, nobody has shown credible evidence that torture produces the claimed results, and thus, given the above point about its repugnance and criminality, it is not a necessary option.

And even if it did bring results it still is repugnant.
The french beheaded and dismounted the FLN in Algeria..it was effective and it was torture that lead them to the disarticulation of the cellules...it still was repugnant and it turned the argelian population into a really hostile one and widely in favour of the FLN (wich only had marginal support before).
I find it all to be extremely hypocrite when international law is only enforced against the vanquished and when all those terrorists were armed and formed by USA when it was usefull to it's geopolitical strategy.
The white torture techniques are being devellopped and used on a daily basis and it's very alarming that there isn't a strong rejection and condamnation of it.