Supreme Court Upholds Obamacare

Snydly · 06-29-2012, 11:15 AM

Originally posted by GeneV

I see you edited the post since I read it last. I'm just curious, but do you ascribe to all of the absolute statements of the current GOP? Back when I was a Republican, it seemed like both sides agreed that our system was a compromise, but one side leaned more toward protecting a certain set of interests and the other side leaned more toward protecting another set of interests. We worked together and got some decent solutions. Somewhere along the way, it seems like the GOP has taken rhetoric from Ronald Reagan (which is not even the way he governed), and deemed it the absolute, immutable truth of a Biblical nature. That is where I parted ways.

That's my point. You said it better. I'm just saying my wife, friends and family (most of them anyway) still do this. The current republicans are not doing this. Their goal is as McCain and I believe the Senate Minority leader said, their job is to remove President Obama from office and give him no cooperation. I'd say they're doing just that. The real crime is we're letting them, and the Democrats aren't screaming this loud enough.

"The single most important thing we want to achieve is for President Obama to be a one-term president," Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell told National Journal's Major Garrett in October.

Fox News' Bret Baier asked McConnell Sunday if that was still his major objective.

"Well, that is true," McConnell replied. "That's my single most important political goal, along with every active Republican in the country."

That is where the current republican loyalties lie, not with the people of America.

Snydly · 06-29-2012, 11:48 AM - **1 Like**

All of this doesn't matter anyway. When was the last time you heard someone say, "I was wrong". Growing up I would occasionally hear that but not lately. Very few people have the courage anymore to do that, certainly not our 'politicians'. People aren't going to vote for an incumbent they didn't vote for the first time because they would have to admit (at least to themselves) they were wrong. God forbid, they are all WAY too smart to have ever made a mistake

mikemike · 06-29-2012, 01:15 PM

Quote:

Despite the court ruling, there is still a chance that Republicans in Congress can repeal much of the law next year even if they don't have a filibuster-proof majority in the Senate. Because Chief Justice John Roberts ruled that the mandate to purchase health insurance—one of the key provisions of the law—was a tax, Republicans can use a procedure called "budget reconciliation" to pass a repeal bill that requires only a simple majority to pass. But this scenario relies on the Republicans' ability to win the White House, keep the majority in the House and gain enough seats in the Senate.

Louisiana Gov. Bobby Jindal refuses to implement Obamacare despite Supreme Court ruling | The Ticket - Yahoo! News

This is an interesting wrinkle to the ruling and continued efforts to repeal it.

Round 3, Fight!!!

jeffkrol · 06-29-2012, 01:31 PM

Originally posted by mikemike

Louisiana Gov. Bobby Jindal refuses to implement Obamacare despite Supreme Court ruling | The Ticket - Yahoo! News

This is an interesting wrinkle to the ruling and continued efforts to repeal it.

Round 3, Fight!!!

First-Person Impacts: How Obamacare Ruling Affects Americans - Yahoo! News

MAYBE you should fight the realization that the Fed doesn't have to tax.............

Conservs.. always poking at windmills..

you too have an idiot for a governor........

Over 10 years of wars where NOT ONE PENNY has been paid taught you nothing????

You too have an idiot for a governor..................

More crock and bull..........

Quote:

“Governor Romney recognizes the value of having insurance plans that cover family members until they turn 26, and fortunately the market is now making those plans available regardless of Obamacare’s requirements,” Mr. Chen said.

Mr. Romney’s aides said that if he is elected, one thing he would not do is repeat Mr. Obama’s effort to change health policy in a single sweeping bill. Instead, Mr. Romney will proceed step by step with smaller measures. Conservative Republicans in Congress also see no need to rush ahead with legislation.

“Every provision of Obamacare must be repealed, not selective parts of it,” said Representative Steve King, Republican of Iowa. “Obamacare must be ripped out completely, lock, stock and barrel, root and branch — no vestige left behind, not a DNA particle of Obamacare retained.”

It hasn't been long enough huh.........

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/06/30/us/politics/parsing-a-romney-alternative-t...ewanted=2&_r=1

Last edited by jeffkrol; 06-29-2012 at 02:01 PM.

GeneV · 06-29-2012, 02:23 PM

Just the questions on this board (which probably includes people that pay more attention than the general population) tells me the government needs to do some serious public education on this law.

stevewig · 06-29-2012, 02:45 PM

Originally posted by GeneV

Just the questions on this board (which probably includes people that pay more attention than the general population) tells me the government needs to do some serious public education on this law.

Couldn't agree more!

Currently the "spin" doctors are attempting to bribe supporters (and hatred) with their misinformation and propaganda - doing their level best to get the people to vote against their own best interest as usual.
Now, for example, its a "..tax increase on the middle class.. which Obama promised never to do...".

cardinal43 · 06-29-2012, 02:51 PM

Originally posted by mikemike

Louisiana Gov. Bobby Jindal refuses to implement Obamacare despite Supreme Court ruling | The Ticket - Yahoo! News

This is an interesting wrinkle to the ruling and continued efforts to repeal it.

Round 3, Fight!!!

Gotta tell you, winning the White House, the Senate, and keeping the House is a really tall order. Don't hold your breath.

GeneV · 06-29-2012, 02:52 PM

Originally posted by stevewig

Couldn't agree more!

Currently the "spin" doctors are attempting to bribe supporters (and hatred) with their misinformation and propaganda - doing their level best to get the people to vote against their own best interest as usual.
Now, for example, its a "..tax increase on the middle class.. which Obama promised never to do...".

True. Sadly, that distortion being spread will probably have legs, too.

ElJamoquio · 06-29-2012, 02:53 PM - **1 Like**

Best analysis I've seen on the vote:

ElectoralVote

normhead · 06-29-2012, 02:59 PM

Thew thing is, if you're dumb enough.. and something sounds good to you, it will sound good to other dumb people... and if there's enough dumb people they'll vote you out of office. The really sad thing is, most Republicans think the only thing they have to do is insult Obama. Then they win by default. If they spend enough time insulting Obama, no one will notice what a bunch of crackpots they are. It seems to work.

SteveM · 06-29-2012, 03:01 PM

People really aren't this dumb are they?

Anti-ObamaCare Americans threaten to move to Canada

Quote:

They're so mad, in fact, that they're theatening to move to Canada to escape socialized medicine. "I'm moving to Canada. Obviously the United States doesn't know what they are doing anymore. This used to be a great country... Pretty sad," said one user, @kclovesya, on Twitter. Another user, @MoBaby69, agreed: "This is insane. I'm moving to Canada #Obamacare."

.

Parallax · 06-29-2012, 03:10 PM

Originally posted by stevewig

Now, for example, its a "..tax increase on the middle class.. which Obama promised never to do...".

Well, the Supreme Court declared it a tax. They said the provision was constitutionally allowed due to the fact that it was a tax (as opposed to a fine, penalty, etc)
Any spin involved on that point is going to be from the administration trying convince people that what was declared a tax by SCOTUS is actually just a free will donation.

normhead · 06-29-2012, 03:18 PM

OH god , anti-Obama care people moving to Canada. We have health care supported by a tax, and then sur-tax on top of the first tax. We have restrictive gun legislation. The only way you get a license for a hand gun in Canada is if you can prove before a judge that the mafia has a hit out on you. We have over 7 % unemployment... you might not get a job. YOu can't shoot someone just because they are on your property or broke in to your house. You have to call the police and let them deal with it. Poor people for the most part have rights. There are no communities you can move to to get out of paying welfare for poor people. In Canada if a bunch of rich people move to a remote area, we incorporate it into a town 5 miles away so you still have to pay welfare costs for poor people.

I have to talk to those people, if they don't like Obama care they won't like Canada... and most Canadians won't like them. Get me their phone numbers. We need to talk. Oh and, not liking Obama care, doesn't get you points on your immigration test. Sad but true, being a dork won't get you into Canada.

ElJamoquio · 06-29-2012, 03:19 PM

The Supreme Court declared it both a tax (in the final decision) and not a tax (in deciding to hear the case).

I recommend the analysis I posted a link to, above.

ElJamoquio · 06-29-2012, 03:21 PM

Originally posted by normhead

OH god , anti-Obama care people moving to Canada. We have health care supported by a tax, and then sur-tax on top of the first tax. We have restrictive gun legislation. The only way you get a license for a hand gun in Canada is if you can prove before a judge that the mafia has a hit out on you. We have over 7 % unemployment... you might not get a job. YOu can't shoot someone just because they are on your property or broke in to your house. You have to call the police and let them deal with it. Poor people for the most part have rights. There are no communities you can move to to get out of paying welfare for poor people. In Canada if a bunch of rich people move to a remote area, we incorporate it into a town 5 miles away so you still have to pay welfare costs for poor people.

I have to talk to those people, if they don't like Obama care they won't like Canada... and most Canadians won't like them. Get me their phone numbers. We need to talk. Oh and, not liking Obama care, doesn't get you points on your immigration test. Sad but true, being a dork won't get you into Canada.

Huh? What rights do poor people NOT have in the US that rich people have?

And you know that welfare/medicaid/etc., is largely governed by states rather than localities, right?

Similar Threads
Thread	Thread Starter	Forum	Replies	Last Post
A peculiar (?) supreme court decision (Armour v. City of Indianapolis)	jolepp	General Talk	5	06-15-2012 10:58 PM
Mississippi high court upholds Barbour pardons	stevewig	General Talk	2	03-10-2012 10:56 AM
ObamaCare reaches the Supreme Court	stevewig	General Talk	168	01-18-2012 03:41 PM
Westboro Baptist Fanatics win in Supreme Court	Nesster	General Talk	28	04-04-2011 12:37 PM
Night Supreme Court	tootall	Post Your Photos!	11	08-02-2010 07:42 PM

06-29-2012, 11:15 AM	#106
Snydly Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Florida Photos: Albums Posts: 242	Originally posted by GeneV I see you edited the post since I read it last. I'm just curious, but do you ascribe to all of the absolute statements of the current GOP? Back when I was a Republican, it seemed like both sides agreed that our system was a compromise, but one side leaned more toward protecting a certain set of interests and the other side leaned more toward protecting another set of interests. We worked together and got some decent solutions. Somewhere along the way, it seems like the GOP has taken rhetoric from Ronald Reagan (which is not even the way he governed), and deemed it the absolute, immutable truth of a Biblical nature. That is where I parted ways. That's my point. You said it better. I'm just saying my wife, friends and family (most of them anyway) still do this. The current republicans are not doing this. Their goal is as McCain and I believe the Senate Minority leader said, their job is to remove President Obama from office and give him no cooperation. I'd say they're doing just that. The real crime is we're letting them, and the Democrats aren't screaming this loud enough. "The single most important thing we want to achieve is for President Obama to be a one-term president," Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell told National Journal's Major Garrett in October. Fox News' Bret Baier asked McConnell Sunday if that was still his major objective. "Well, that is true," McConnell replied. "That's my single most important political goal, along with every active Republican in the country." That is where the current republican loyalties lie, not with the people of America.

06-29-2012, 11:48 AM - 1 Like	#107
Snydly Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Florida Photos: Albums Posts: 242	All of this doesn't matter anyway. When was the last time you heard someone say, "I was wrong". Growing up I would occasionally hear that but not lately. Very few people have the courage anymore to do that, certainly not our 'politicians'. People aren't going to vote for an incumbent they didn't vote for the first time because they would have to admit (at least to themselves) they were wrong. God forbid, they are all WAY too smart to have ever made a mistake

06-29-2012, 01:15 PM	#108
mikemike Inactive Account Join Date: Apr 2010 Location: New Orleans Photos: Gallery Posts: 3,053	Quote: Despite the court ruling, there is still a chance that Republicans in Congress can repeal much of the law next year even if they don't have a filibuster-proof majority in the Senate. Because Chief Justice John Roberts ruled that the mandate to purchase health insurance—one of the key provisions of the law—was a tax, Republicans can use a procedure called "budget reconciliation" to pass a repeal bill that requires only a simple majority to pass. But this scenario relies on the Republicans' ability to win the White House, keep the majority in the House and gain enough seats in the Senate. Louisiana Gov. Bobby Jindal refuses to implement Obamacare despite Supreme Court ruling \| The Ticket - Yahoo! News This is an interesting wrinkle to the ruling and continued efforts to repeal it. Round 3, Fight!!!

06-29-2012, 01:31 PM	#109
jeffkrol Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Wisconsin USA Photos: Gallery Posts: 8,434	Originally posted by mikemike Louisiana Gov. Bobby Jindal refuses to implement Obamacare despite Supreme Court ruling \| The Ticket - Yahoo! News This is an interesting wrinkle to the ruling and continued efforts to repeal it. Round 3, Fight!!! First-Person Impacts: How Obamacare Ruling Affects Americans - Yahoo! News MAYBE you should fight the realization that the Fed doesn't have to tax............. Conservs.. always poking at windmills.. you too have an idiot for a governor........ Over 10 years of wars where NOT ONE PENNY has been paid taught you nothing???? You too have an idiot for a governor.................. More crock and bull.......... Quote: “Governor Romney recognizes the value of having insurance plans that cover family members until they turn 26, and fortunately the market is now making those plans available regardless of Obamacare’s requirements,” Mr. Chen said. Mr. Romney’s aides said that if he is elected, one thing he would not do is repeat Mr. Obama’s effort to change health policy in a single sweeping bill. Instead, Mr. Romney will proceed step by step with smaller measures. Conservative Republicans in Congress also see no need to rush ahead with legislation. “Every provision of Obamacare must be repealed, not selective parts of it,” said Representative Steve King, Republican of Iowa. “Obamacare must be ripped out completely, lock, stock and barrel, root and branch — no vestige left behind, not a DNA particle of Obamacare retained.” It hasn't been long enough huh......... http://www.nytimes.com/2012/06/30/us/politics/parsing-a-romney-alternative-t...ewanted=2&_r=1 Last edited by jeffkrol; 06-29-2012 at 02:01 PM.

06-29-2012, 02:23 PM	#110
GeneV Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Albuquerque NM Photos: Albums Posts: 9,830	Just the questions on this board (which probably includes people that pay more attention than the general population) tells me the government needs to do some serious public education on this law.

06-29-2012, 02:45 PM	#111
stevewig Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2010 Posts: 773	Originally posted by GeneV Just the questions on this board (which probably includes people that pay more attention than the general population) tells me the government needs to do some serious public education on this law. Couldn't agree more! Currently the "spin" doctors are attempting to bribe supporters (and hatred) with their misinformation and propaganda - doing their level best to get the people to vote against their own best interest as usual. Now, for example, its a "..tax increase on the middle class.. which Obama promised never to do...".

06-29-2012, 02:51 PM	#112
cardinal43 Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Virginia Photos: Gallery Posts: 2,412	Originally posted by mikemike Louisiana Gov. Bobby Jindal refuses to implement Obamacare despite Supreme Court ruling \| The Ticket - Yahoo! News This is an interesting wrinkle to the ruling and continued efforts to repeal it. Round 3, Fight!!! Gotta tell you, winning the White House, the Senate, and keeping the House is a really tall order. Don't hold your breath.

06-29-2012, 02:52 PM	#113
GeneV Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Albuquerque NM Photos: Albums Posts: 9,830	Originally posted by stevewig Couldn't agree more! Currently the "spin" doctors are attempting to bribe supporters (and hatred) with their misinformation and propaganda - doing their level best to get the people to vote against their own best interest as usual. Now, for example, its a "..tax increase on the middle class.. which Obama promised never to do...". True. Sadly, that distortion being spread will probably have legs, too.

06-29-2012, 02:53 PM - 1 Like	#114
ElJamoquio Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2011 Posts: 4,873 Original Poster	Best analysis I've seen on the vote: ElectoralVote

06-29-2012, 02:59 PM	#115
normhead Pentaxian Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Near Algonquin Park Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 40,451	Thew thing is, if you're dumb enough.. and something sounds good to you, it will sound good to other dumb people... and if there's enough dumb people they'll vote you out of office. The really sad thing is, most Republicans think the only thing they have to do is insult Obama. Then they win by default. If they spend enough time insulting Obama, no one will notice what a bunch of crackpots they are. It seems to work.

06-29-2012, 03:01 PM	#116
SteveM Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2009 Location: Vancouver Island, BC, Canada Photos: Gallery Posts: 3,294	People really aren't this dumb are they? Anti-ObamaCare Americans threaten to move to Canada Quote: They're so mad, in fact, that they're theatening to move to Canada to escape socialized medicine. "I'm moving to Canada. Obviously the United States doesn't know what they are doing anymore. This used to be a great country... Pretty sad," said one user, @kclovesya, on Twitter. Another user, @MoBaby69, agreed: "This is insane. I'm moving to Canada #Obamacare." .

06-29-2012, 03:10 PM	#117
Parallax Senior Moderator Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: South Dakota Photos: Gallery Posts: 19,333	Originally posted by stevewig Now, for example, its a "..tax increase on the middle class.. which Obama promised never to do...". Well, the Supreme Court declared it a tax. They said the provision was constitutionally allowed due to the fact that it was a tax (as opposed to a fine, penalty, etc) Any spin involved on that point is going to be from the administration trying convince people that what was declared a tax by SCOTUS is actually just a free will donation.

06-29-2012, 03:18 PM	#118
normhead Pentaxian Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: Near Algonquin Park Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 40,451	OH god , anti-Obama care people moving to Canada. We have health care supported by a tax, and then sur-tax on top of the first tax. We have restrictive gun legislation. The only way you get a license for a hand gun in Canada is if you can prove before a judge that the mafia has a hit out on you. We have over 7 % unemployment... you might not get a job. YOu can't shoot someone just because they are on your property or broke in to your house. You have to call the police and let them deal with it. Poor people for the most part have rights. There are no communities you can move to to get out of paying welfare for poor people. In Canada if a bunch of rich people move to a remote area, we incorporate it into a town 5 miles away so you still have to pay welfare costs for poor people. I have to talk to those people, if they don't like Obama care they won't like Canada... and most Canadians won't like them. Get me their phone numbers. We need to talk. Oh and, not liking Obama care, doesn't get you points on your immigration test. Sad but true, being a dork won't get you into Canada.

06-29-2012, 03:19 PM	#119
ElJamoquio Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2011 Posts: 4,873 Original Poster	The Supreme Court declared it both a tax (in the final decision) and not a tax (in deciding to hear the case). I recommend the analysis I posted a link to, above.

06-29-2012, 03:21 PM	#120
ElJamoquio Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2011 Posts: 4,873 Original Poster	Originally posted by normhead OH god , anti-Obama care people moving to Canada. We have health care supported by a tax, and then sur-tax on top of the first tax. We have restrictive gun legislation. The only way you get a license for a hand gun in Canada is if you can prove before a judge that the mafia has a hit out on you. We have over 7 % unemployment... you might not get a job. YOu can't shoot someone just because they are on your property or broke in to your house. You have to call the police and let them deal with it. Poor people for the most part have rights. There are no communities you can move to to get out of paying welfare for poor people. In Canada if a bunch of rich people move to a remote area, we incorporate it into a town 5 miles away so you still have to pay welfare costs for poor people. I have to talk to those people, if they don't like Obama care they won't like Canada... and most Canadians won't like them. Get me their phone numbers. We need to talk. Oh and, not liking Obama care, doesn't get you points on your immigration test. Sad but true, being a dork won't get you into Canada. Huh? What rights do poor people NOT have in the US that rich people have? And you know that welfare/medicaid/etc., is largely governed by states rather than localities, right?