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07-25-2012, 11:53 PM   #31
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QuoteOriginally posted by Philoslothical Quote
This is sadly one more bit of ignorance about Canada. We both call the same substance bacon. What you guys call "Canadian Bacon" doesn't exist in Canada. It's purely an American invention, for the American market, and is basically a kind of ham. As a Canadian with no desire to visit the U.S., I have only seen the stuff in pictures, and read about it. Canadian bacon is not Canadian.
OK so I know two things about Canada.

Next you'll be telling me Canadian beer is watered down for sale down here....

07-25-2012, 11:57 PM   #32
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QuoteOriginally posted by KungPOW Quote
As for becoming the 51st state...

Why do Americans assume we would want to?
I think it is lingering resentment from the thumping the USA got from Canada during the war of 1812... and thinking that wouldn't everybody want to be part of the greatest nation on earth. You too could be free of socialized medicine! Increase your gun violence! Get the chance to vote for Michele Bachmann!
07-26-2012, 04:43 AM   #33
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QuoteOriginally posted by Wired Quote
I think you mean Calgarians. Or maybe the people who live in Fort McMurray.

Oh heck....your right. Us Alberta folk a Hicks. We love our country western, our pickup trucks, and our Budweiser. I'm moving to BC so I can own drive my VW and be less "PROGRESSIVE CONSERVATIVE " which is a hypocritical name for a party.....


Sent from my SGH-I727R using Tapatalk 2

LMAO and we all think were the center of the universe in Ontario, you are right though
I meant calgarians, evil bastards they are

BTW Country is pretty popular in the alternative music scene out here (not that shania twain/nashville stuff, real country)
07-26-2012, 04:51 AM   #34
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QuoteOriginally posted by Nesster Quote
I think it is lingering resentment from the thumping the USA got from Canada during the war of 1812... and thinking that wouldn't everybody want to be part of the greatest nation on earth. You too could be free of socialized medicine! Increase your gun violence! Get the chance to vote for Michele Bachmann!
Manifest destiny in action huh

I'll fight to the death beating you back with my hockey stick and lacrosse stick before i ever see that happen
(sorry until you mentioned Michelle Bachman you may have had us interested, then i though Sarah Palin and that sealed it. I'm stocking up on hockey sticks and lacrosse sticks for the pending battle )

07-26-2012, 04:56 AM   #35
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QuoteOriginally posted by KungPOW Quote
. . .

As for becoming the 51st state...

Why do Americans assume we would want to?
We don't. I was just explaining that states aren't created by war and/or force.
07-26-2012, 05:03 AM   #36
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QuoteOriginally posted by Nesster Quote
I think it is lingering resentment from the thumping the USA got from Canada during the war of 1812... and thinking that wouldn't everybody want to be part of the greatest nation on earth. You too could be free of socialized medicine! Increase your gun violence! Get the chance to vote for Michele Bachmann!
Go back and read the my post regarding 1812. Canada was part of the UK. It isn't about battles, it is about winning the War. Sam Smith in MD and Andy Jackson in N.O., and Col. Armstead at Ft. McHenry. If we had lost to the war to the British, we would no longer be speaking English. We would be calling fries chips and wood faggot, calling, auto hoods bonnets, and calling things bluh'y ell (bloody hell).
07-26-2012, 05:58 AM   #37
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QuoteOriginally posted by Blue Quote
Go back and read the my post regarding 1812. Canada was part of the UK.
Spoken like a true American. Canadians however see it differently, at least according to wikipedia (and everything online is true, right?)

War of 1812 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

QuoteQuote:
Canada also emerged from the war with a heightened sense of national feeling and solidarity, having repelled multiple American invasions. Battles such as the Battle of Queenston Heights and the Battle of Crysler's Farm became iconic for English-speaking Canadians. In Canada, especially Ontario, memory of the war retains national significance, as the invasions were largely perceived by Canadians as an annexation attempt by America seeking to expand US territory. In Canada, numerous ceremonies are scheduled in 2012 to commemorate a Canadian victory.


07-26-2012, 06:19 AM   #38
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QuoteOriginally posted by Nesster Quote
Spoken like a true American. Canadians however see it differently, at least according to wikipedia (and everything online is true, right?)

War of 1812 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
America has always denied losing that war, it's the way they teach it to you in school, the rest of us are taught differently

I do agree though it was not Canada at the time. Canada didn't exist until 1867 as a country.
07-26-2012, 06:20 AM   #39
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QuoteOriginally posted by Nesster Quote
Spoken like a true American. Canadians however see it differently, at least according to wikipedia (and everything online is true, right?)

War of 1812 - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

The only problem with that theory is that the War of 1812 was started by the British due to there aggressive kidnapping of seaman and international interference of trade etc. Earlier in the War, the British were using the Canadians in part as a proxy to fight the war because they were tied down fighting Napoleon. Once that was over, they concentrated on the U.S. Lord Edward Packenham's force was key for the Iron Duke to win Battle of Fuentes de Onoro and Battle of Toulouse. Jackson's hillbilly militia and handful of pirates wiped out Lord Packenham at N.O. That put the U.S. in control of the bargaining at Ghent. The southern militia from MD, TN, AL etc. were never concerned with Canada. It was the Yankee militia that had problems up there. The British had intended to reclaim the colonies and that was a last chance. However, we did scrap with the Brits later in the Northwest.

Last edited by Blue; 07-26-2012 at 01:51 PM.
07-26-2012, 06:35 AM   #40
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From a canadian perspective it was the invasion of lower and upper canada that started it (or should i say the mostly failed invasion)
in 1812 you were in fact battling us and not the Brits who were tied up in Europe
the cause you bring up is more about the war with France and trade restrictions.
Canadians largely believe part of the reason you came north was the mistaken beleif it would be a piece of cake to take us over (madison doctrines and this quote from jefferson
QuoteQuote:
But the Americans thought that the possibility of local support suggested an easy conquest, as former President Thomas Jefferson believed: "The acquisition of Canada this year, as far as the neighborhood of Quebec, will be a mere matter of marching, and will give us the experience for the attack on Halifax, the next and final expulsion of England from the A
Apparently you were wrong
The reason it is viewed that you lost in Canada (and by many historians) is the failure to achieve the goal of seizing Canada, and failure to stop impressment which ended when the war with the french ended (so nothing to do with this little side war that has virtually no significance in Britain)
The significance for Canada is huge, the fact that we repelled a larger more powerful neighbour and successfully defended the country had a big impact on us eventually becoming the nation we are.
The real losers were the native people who as usual got crewed over afterwards (even though they were a big support to the Canadian side)


Reality
07-26-2012, 06:44 AM   #41
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QuoteOriginally posted by eddie1960 Quote
From a canadian perspective it was the invasion of lower and upper canada that started it (or should i say the mostly failed invasion)
in 1812 you were in fact battling us and not the Brits who were tied up in Europe
the cause you bring up is more about the war with France and trade restrictions.
Canadians largely believe part of the reason you came north was the mistaken beleif it would be a piece of cake to take us over (madison doctrines and this quote from jefferson

Apparently you were wrong
The reason it is viewed that you lost in Canada (and by many historians) is the failure to achieve the goal of seizing Canada, and failure to stop impressment which ended when the war with the french ended (so nothing to do with this little side war that has virtually no significance in Britain)
The significance for Canada is huge, the fact that we repelled a larger more powerful neighbour and successfully defended the country had a big impact on us eventually becoming the nation we are.
The real losers were the native people who as usual got crewed over afterwards (even though they were a big support to the Canadian side)


Reality
so what is the bottom line here? "we" wanted to fight Brits while "you guys" thought you were canadians not brits..
Nationalism w/ out a nation???? A GB "state" w/ delusions (well aspirations) of grandeur???
QuoteQuote:
the next and final expulsion of England from the A(mericas)
I'm confused
07-26-2012, 07:04 AM   #42
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QuoteOriginally posted by jeffkrol Quote
so what is the bottom line here? "we" wanted to fight Brits while "you guys" thought you were canadians not brits..
Nationalism w/ out a nation???? A GB "state" w/ delusions (well aspirations) of grandeur???

I'm confused
you will never get it from our perspective.

In actual fact no-one likely thought of themselves as canadian per se at the time (though it was lower and upper canada - ie ontario and quebec now)
most were either brits who left the US after the revolution, or american imagrants who left for whatever reason. the british side (or their decendants) were largely the ones fighting off the US coming north, the american imagrants ignored the whole thing, but did not supply American troops with anything either so helped inadvertently. The native indians did a lot of the fighting with support from the british and then were screwed over with land loss (again) at the end of the war.
From the Canadian perspective it was a win because we kicked you out when you came north
From the british perspective you were a side skirmish in a bigger battle and were more an annoyance than anything. Empressing was more about punishing the french than screwing with the US
and in general if any of the participants had a whit of decent diplomacy skills the entire thing could have been avoided
So the American view ends up you won because you stayed free and stopped the brits from taking over and ended empressment (nothing to do with anything you did BTW - and more about the war with the french ending) - Valid from an American standpoint but it was never about taking back the US from the brit side
The Canadian perspective I've stated
The British placed almost no importance on it and it was all about beating the french

and the native end they supported what they believed were Allies on both sides expecting to be treated well, and instead lost evem more lands as settlement moved west (naive bunch)
07-26-2012, 07:23 AM   #43
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QuoteOriginally posted by eddie1960 Quote
you will never get it from our perspective.

In actual fact no-one likely thought of themselves as canadian per se at the time (though it was lower and upper canada - ie ontario and quebec now)
most were either brits who left the US after the revolution, or american imagrants who left for whatever reason. the british side (or their decendants) were largely the ones fighting off the US coming north, the american imagrants ignored the whole thing, but did not supply American troops with anything either so helped inadvertently. The native indians did a lot of the fighting with support from the british and then were screwed over with land loss (again) at the end of the war.
From the Canadian perspective it was a win because we kicked you out when you came north
From the british perspective you were a side skirmish in a bigger battle and were more an annoyance than anything. Empressing was more about punishing the french than screwing with the US
and in general if any of the participants had a whit of decent diplomacy skills the entire thing could have been avoided
So the American view ends up you won because you stayed free and stopped the brits from taking over and ended empressment (nothing to do with anything you did BTW - and more about the war with the french ending) - Valid from an American standpoint but it was never about taking back the US from the brit side
The Canadian perspective I've stated
The British placed almost no importance on it and it was all about beating the french

and the native end they supported what they believed were Allies on both sides expecting to be treated well, and instead lost evem more lands as settlement moved west (naive bunch)
I think I get it OK. not judging anything right or wrong at this point. My only take is there was no "Canada" to fight Only Brits...
There was never a "Canadian" war.... neither against Canadians or for Canadian independence from the british (in 1812ish)...

so I fail to see any "Canadian" skin in the game whatsoever... thus my confusion as to national attitude...Of course your still "beholden" to the queen and the Monty Python "kick a Canadian" sketch is still funny...

none of this assumes America" was in the right BTW... The US "invading" your "house" is another story.. though the house wasn't even built yet..
07-26-2012, 08:19 AM   #44
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QuoteOriginally posted by jeffkrol Quote
so I fail to see any "Canadian" skin in the game whatsoever... thus my confusion as to national attitude...
Shhh... that makes it even worse for the USA - the Canadians beat us even before they were even Canadian.

This also perhaps explains why Canadian football is different.
07-26-2012, 08:36 AM   #45
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QuoteOriginally posted by Nesster Quote
Shhh... that makes it even worse for the USA - the Canadians beat us even before they were even Canadian.

This also perhaps explains why Canadian football is different.
LMAO

As for we weren't "canadian yet" well it was upper and lower canada so in essence we were, but we were the provincial version, as opposed to the nation version

And don't get me started on the queen, I think she should be dumped by us and Britain and Australia and the rest of the commonwealth, but for us she is a figurehead and nothing more. no power at all and her representative is appointed by the government at the federal and provincial levels.Some plebes seem to like her though - and her grandson even more - in fact her grandson is really the saviour of the monarchy because charles sure isn't
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