[Blue]

A mistakes made in investments pales in comparison to warmongering in Iraq that by the time it's all paid for will approach 4 trillion dollars.

Show me where I ever made and argument for going into Iraq or doing a surge in Afghanistan.

Sounds like a conspiracy theory of the lunatic fringe.

It may sound like it but the top GE guy is a BHO adviser. You may want to look around but their is lunatic fringe on all sides and the political and economic spectrum isn't just 2 dimensional like people like to simplify it.

What would you like them to do for the poor that can actually get through congress? The health care bill has barely survived, and it is still in jeopardy. And your logic regarding George Obama would be fallacious even if the situation you describe were true. Try the facts:

That is the thing, he is all about spending other peoples money.

As far as George goes, CNN and NPR are hardly right wing sources.

http://articles.cnn.com/2008-08-22/politics/bts.obama.brother_1_half-brother..._s=PM:POLITICS

http://www.npr.org/templates/story/story.php?storyId=125349639

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Last edited by Blue; 08-25-2012 at 06:20 PM.

[kenafein]

Maybe the Republican party of old would have a chance to set things right, but not the party of whackos, fanatics and corporate lackeys. Teddy Roosevelt himself would be impotent in the face of opposition like Obama has faced. I don't even know what an Obama presidency would be like. He spent two years trying to compromise and the last two at the mercy of a party that would rather watch the whole country burn, than let it end up in the hands of the other guys.

[mikemike]

Government is like hair, it is constantly growing and needs to be maintained sometimes. Virtually no one wants none at all but there are lots of different opinions about what looks good. I think Obama is like a stylist who is going to give you the cut which HE thinks is best for you while Romney is like an old fashioned barber that is going to try his best to give you the haircut YOU ask for. With Obama, we have had one haircut and walked out looking worse than when we entered the shop. With Romney, there is virtually no chance that you will come out worse than you looked without the haircut.

[jeffkrol]

Government is like hair, it is constantly growing and needs to be maintained sometimes. Virtually no one wants none at all but there are lots of different opinions about what looks good. I think Obama is like a stylist who is going to give you the cut which HE thinks is best for you while Romney is like an old fashioned barber that is going to try his best to give you the haircut YOU ask for. With Obama, we have had one haircut and walked out looking worse than when we entered the shop. With Romney, there is virtually no chance that you will come out worse than you looked without the haircut.

I'm sorry but I didn't ask to lower his tax liability to ZERO point something..at the same time raising taxes on the middle class..NO MATTER how you fudge the numbers..
No, the Tax Policy Center didn’t “ignore” those principles. It tried to test them. And the principles failed.

What’s more, they failed for a comically simple reason. “The total value of the available tax expenditures (once tax expenditures for capital income are excluded) going to high-income taxpayers is smaller than the tax cuts that would accrue to high-income taxpayers, high-income taxpayers must necessarily face a lower net tax burden.”

That is to say, the tax cuts Romney is promising the rich are larger than the available storehouse of tax breaks Romney can close to pay for them. As such, if the plan is going to be revenue neutral, as Romney has pledged, it is mathematically impossible for it to do anything but shift the tax burden away from the rich.

Note that Romney’s response to this plan is, quite literally, that the Tax Policy Center refused to believe that he would do this impossible thing. Romney has a lot of economists and policy thinkers around him. If any one of them had come up with a better argument, my guess is that Romney would have used it.

Mitt Romney’s budget is a fantasy, Part II

Business and snake oil.........
And funny again:

The two authors, Paul Peterson and Daniel Nadler, muster a lot of impressive evidence to support their case and suggest that we’re better off simply allowing states to go bankrupt if they are poorly managed. I agree that bailing out poorly managed states presents a terrible moral hazard (note no mention of fiscal hazard since in effect there is none IF they get the money from the Fed)rand should be off the table for Congress and the administration.

But there’s one problem. States, contrary to what Peterson and Nadler write, can’t go bankrupt at all.

But back to the topic:

So let me get this straight. Mitt Romney, who has refused to officially name even one offset for his tax cut, has taken the bulk of the mortgage-interest deduction off the table. In his 10-year deficit-reduction plan, he has refused to name the spending cuts necessary to hit his targets, but he has taken Social Security, Medicare and defense off the table for cuts.

Tell me again why I’m supposed to believe that this presidential candidate who is systematically ruling out cuts to the most popular spending programs and tax breaks is going to be able to make incredibly unpopular spending cuts and tax changes once in office?

As I wrote the other day: Romney’s budget plan is a fantasy, and it will never happen.

So if you want to vote for romney because you "like the guy" fine. To seriously think he has any good answers.???? err NO.

[les3547]

I think Obama is like a stylist who is going to give you the cut which HE thinks is best for you while Romney is like an old fashioned barber that is going to try his best to give you the haircut YOU ask for.

Well, I think immature citizens who can't be concerned about anyone but themselves need an adult leader who will try to do what's best for everyone, and if that means some people are forced to share more than they want to, so be it.

[bossa]

Government is like hair, it is constantly growing and needs to be maintained sometimes. Virtually no one wants none at all but there are lots of different opinions about what looks good. I think Obama is like a stylist who is going to give you the cut which HE thinks is best for you while Romney is like an old fashioned barber that is going to try his best to give you the haircut YOU ask for. With Obama, we have had one haircut and walked out looking worse than when we entered the shop. With Romney, there is virtually no chance that you will come out worse than you looked without the haircut.

What a complete load of BS.

[wildman]

Government is like hair, it is constantly growing and needs to be maintained sometimes.

Would you say this is at least as true for international Laissez-faire capitalism as well?

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Last edited by wildman; 08-26-2012 at 04:05 AM.

[kswier]

"Worse" than what?

Than a magical world where the presidents policies would allow the economy to bounce back within two years (sarcasm intended).

In all seriousness, I think that is the benchmark a lot of people use. A lot of people believe that Obama did a bad job because unemployment is still high a few years after the recession hit.

Good question, though

[wildman]

A lot of people believe that Obama did a bad job because unemployment is still high a few years after the recession hit.

Whatever people believe it does not necessarily follow that any other policy would have been any better, if as good, given the reality of what Obama was facing.

People may think unemployment is too high, but again, compared to what? 1933?

[jogiba]

Originally posted by Blue

That is the thing, he is all about spending other peoples money.

What POTUS used their own personal money to pay for wars that they start etc ?

[jeffkrol]

To good for one thread:
Wanted: A Smoking Gun To Prove That Romney Knowingly Profited From Fraud: Report From 20 Paws Ranch | The Moderate Voice

Meanwhile, there probably is a smoking gun in the form of someone who worked for Bain or in Bain, Damon or HCA documents that reveal Romney was well aware that taxpayers were being fleeced. My gun is a pea shooter, so concerned voters should hope that The New York Times, which has aggressively investigated HCA’s dark side in recent weeks, or some other media outlet with a conscience will be looking for that smoking gun after Romney is coronated later this week in Tampa.

When found, that alone would disqualify Mitt Romney to run for president, let alone be president.

[kswier]

Whatever people believe it does not necessarily follow that any other policy would have been any better, if as good, given the reality of what Obama was facing.

People may think unemployment is too high, but again, compared to what? 1933?

I am in total agreement (thus the reason why I mentioned a magical world). However, there are many people who seem to think differently.

[grhazelton]

Maybe the Republican party of old would have a chance to set things right, but not the party of whackos, fanatics and corporate lackeys. Teddy Roosevelt himself would be impotent in the face of opposition like Obama has faced. I don't even know what an Obama presidency would be like. He spent two years trying to compromise and the last two at the mercy of a party that would rather watch the whole country burn, than let it end up in the hands of the other guys.

Hear, hear! While I am generally a Democrat, I'd dearly love to see a Republican party that included folk like Eisenhower, Nelson Rockefeller, Edward Brooke, Gerald Ford, other moderates. Where have they gone? Have they morphed into the right wing of the Democratic party, or have the whack-jobs currently running the GOP frightened them into silence. The current GOP leaders have forgotten Ike's farewell address in which he warned, presciently, of the dangers of the military industrial complex. It is worth a read: Eisenhower's Farewell Address to the Nation My guess is that Eisenhower would view our current military expenditures as a dismal fulfillment of his prophesy. We've "won" the Cold War, and yet we continue to spend an immense part of our treasure on armaments. How many times over need we be able to incinerate potential foes?

It is hard to imagine Eisenhower launching the Iraq war, indeed one of the virtues of the former GOP was its caution. The current GOP seems to feel that caution, even considering potential outcomes, is an indication of cowardice, and indictment of their collective manhood.

And then there is the GOP's continued mindless infatuation with tax cuts as the be-all and end-all for ending all economic woes. Couple this with supply side "economics" and we have a recipe for continued financial misery. We've tried supply side economics and it hasn't worked. Why should anyone imagine that repeating an unsuccessful course of action yet again would yield a different outcome? Doesn't that come close to the definition of madness, or at least wishful thinking? Why would "job creators" ramp up production, hire more workers when there is a stagnant market for their products? How about considering demand side economics? When Henry Ford, hardly a friend of the worker, introduced the Model T he paid his workers what were then unprecedented wages, since then people could buy his cars. Fordism - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia While Ford espoused some pretty vile doctrines he was on target in this instance; he and his factory in many ways brought about the economic model which empowered the middle class, and raised many into the middle class.

Contrast this with the current GOP who seem intent on turning the US into a banana republic, an oligarchy the 1%, a tiny and shrinking middle class, and a majority lower class. If we can extrapolate the histories of all too many Central and South American countries we could be looking at a recipe for genuine class warfare, not the sort used by TeaParty types as a generic answer to any consideration of the increasing income gap in the US.

[jogiba]

The dog whistle for the Republican base.
Romney makes a birther joke in Michigan: ?No one has ever asked to see my birth certificate? | The Ticket - Yahoo! News

[dadipentak]

No one has ever asked to see my birth certificate’

Me, neither--being a privileged white male is pretty awesome but it's not something I'd brag about (especially if I was, you know, running for president or something like that.)