[GeneV]

First off there was allready a thread started on this issue.
Second Romney's comment was in regard to the SOS's initial statement which she is ammending with stronger language as I write this

My understanding was that Romney's statement was based upon an unauthorized statement by the embassy staff made 5 hours before the attack. Could you link to what you are talking about?

[ihasa]

Merged with the existing thread.

[seacapt]

My understanding was that Romney's statement was based upon an unauthorized statement by the embassy staff made 5 hours before the attack. Could you link to what you are talking about?

She said - Secretary of State Hillary Clinton also issued a statement saying, "Some have sought to justify this vicious behavior as a response to inflammatory material posted on the Internet. The United States deplores any intentional effort to denigrate the religious beliefs of others. But let me be clear: There is never any justification for violent acts of this kind."

He said-"I'm outraged by the attacks on American diplomatic missions in Libya and Egypt and by the death of an American consulate worker in Benghazi," Romney said in a statement.

"It's disgraceful that the Obama administration's first response was not to condemn attacks on our diplomatic missions, but to sympathize with those who waged the attacks," he said

But there does seem to be some political scrambling going on. Damn shame .

[boriscleto]

Daily Kos: President Obama to deliver statement on Egypt, Libya attacks

7:36 AM PT: In case you missed it, Mitt Romney just concluded a press conference in which he blistered the president for, essentially, taking the side of the people who attacked America. He accused the president of apologizing for the United States even as the U.S. was under attack—a truly absurd claim backed up by no evidence whatsoever.

Romney leaving the podium after speaking about the killings in Benghazi

7:42 AM PT: Here's the president.

7:44 AM PT: "The United States condemns, in the strongest terms, this outrageous and shocking attack," the president said. "And make no mistake, we will work with the Libyan government to track down" the killers.

7:45 AM PT: "The world must stand together in rejecting these brutal attacks," the president says. Obama says religious intolerance is wrong, but says there is no justification for this sort of violence. Now he's honoring Chris Stevens and his colleagues. "The loss of these four Americans is fresh, but our memories of them linger on."

7:46 AM PT: See, Mitt? This is what it looks like when you have a president who can walk and chew gum at the same time.

7:47 AM PT: "Today we mourn four more Americans who represent the very best of the United States of America. We will not waver" in pursuit of justice "and make no mistake, justice will be done."

7:49 AM PT: President Obama has concluded his remarks. What a contrast his remarks were with Mitt Romney's.

[Parallax]

Somebody remind me just why it is we're giving billions of dollars in aid to these countries.

[les3547]

Is murder , invasionof US soil and destruction of US property a new Arab Spring team sport?

Are you as concerned about the 11,000 civilians directly killed by US forces in Iraq, or the thousands of civilians killed and/or displaced by US troops in Afghanistan? How about our role in the overthrow of the democratically elected government of Iran, orchestrated by the intelligence agencies of the United Kingdom and the United States that saw the transition from a constitutional monarch to an authoritarian? Don't forget how we then supported Sadam Hussein against Iran for years. Of course, there's the little matter of our support for Israel for decades at the expense of people who had, and have, every right to be there. And then there's those charming Americans who make movies with no other purpose in mind but to insult and upset. The protesters and murderers' stupidity over religion not notwithstanding, the hatred we see in these situations has been a long time brewing.

[GeneV]

She said - Secretary of State Hillary Clinton also issued a statement saying, "Some have sought to justify this vicious behavior as a response to inflammatory material posted on the Internet. The United States deplores any intentional effort to denigrate the religious beliefs of others. But let me be clear: There is never any justification for violent acts of this kind."

He said-"I'm outraged by the attacks on American diplomatic missions in Libya and Egypt and by the death of an American consulate worker in Benghazi," Romney said in a statement.

"It's disgraceful that the Obama administration's first response was not to condemn attacks on our diplomatic missions, but to sympathize with those who waged the attacks," he said

But there does seem to be some political scrambling going on. Damn shame .

I'm still not clear when Clinton issued her initial statement in relation to when Romney issued that statement. According to the State Dept. site, Clinton's statement quoted there was issued about 12 hours ago. Romney's first statement calling the response "disgraceful" was also last night.

If he thinks that statement is in any way an apology, he is way off the rails to the point of derangement. However, the earlier statements from the embassy under attack (which were not authorized by the State Dept.) were designed to try to quell the anger of the crowd.

John McCain was complimentary of the Clinton statement.

---

Last edited by GeneV; 09-12-2012 at 09:11 AM.

[boriscleto]

Here's a man who's deeply disturbed by the events of yesterday...

[gokenin]

How about our role in the overthrow of the democratically elected government of Iran, orchestrated by the intelligence agencies of the United Kingdom and the United States that saw the transition from a constitutional monarch to an authoritarian? Don't forget how we then supported Sadam Hussein against Iran for years. Of course, there's the little matter of our support for Israel for decades at the expense of people who had, and have, every right to be there. And then there's those charming Americans who make The protesters and murderers' stupidity over religion not notwithstanding, the hatred we see in these situations has been a long time brewing.

So let me throw out the little after 9/11 comment there at the start of your timeline and are you then saying that every terrorist event from
1979
Nov. 4, Tehran, Iran: Iranian radical students seized the U.S. embassy, taking 66 hostages. 14 were later released. The remaining 52 were freed after 444 days on the day of President Reagan's inauguration.
1982–1991
Lebanon: Thirty US and other Western hostages kidnapped in Lebanon by Hezbollah. Some were killed, some died in captivity, and some were eventually released. Terry Anderson was held for 2,454 days.
1983
April 18, Beirut, Lebanon: U.S. embassy destroyed in suicide car-bomb attack; 63 dead, including 17 Americans. The Islamic Jihad claimed responsibility.
Oct. 23, Beirut, Lebanon: Shiite suicide bombers exploded truck near U.S. military barracks at Beirut airport, killing 241 marines. Minutes later a second bomb killed 58 French paratroopers in their barracks in West Beirut.
Dec. 12, Kuwait City, Kuwait: Shiite truck bombers attacked the U.S. embassy and other targets, killing 5 and injuring 80.
1984
Sept. 20, east Beirut, Lebanon: truck bomb exploded outside the U.S. embassy annex, killing 24, including 2 U.S. military.
Dec. 3, Beirut, Lebanon: Kuwait Airways Flight 221, from Kuwait to Pakistan, hijacked and diverted to Tehran. 2 Americans killed.
1985
April 12, Madrid, Spain: Bombing at restaurant frequented by U.S. soldiers, killed 18 Spaniards and injured 82.
June 14, Beirut, Lebanon: TWA Flight 847 en route from Athens to Rome hijacked to Beirut by Hezbollah terrorists and held for 17 days. A U.S. Navy diver executed.
Oct. 7, Mediterranean Sea: gunmen attack Italian cruise ship, Achille Lauro. One U.S. tourist killed. Hijacking linked to Libya.
Dec. 18, Rome, Italy, and Vienna, Austria: airports in Rome and Vienna were bombed, killing 20 people, 5 of whom were Americans. Bombing linked to Libya.
1986
April 2, Athens, Greece:A bomb exploded aboard TWA flight 840 en route from Rome to Athens, killing 4 Americans and injuring 9.
April 5, West Berlin, Germany: Libyans bombed a disco frequented by U.S. servicemen, killing 2 and injuring hundreds.
1988
Dec. 21, Lockerbie, Scotland: N.Y.-bound Pan-Am Boeing 747 exploded in flight from a terrorist bomb and crashed into Scottish village, killing all 259 aboard and 11 on the ground. Passengers included 35 Syracuse University students and many U.S. military personnel. Libya formally admitted responsibility 15 years later (Aug. 2003) and offered $2.7 billion compensation to victims' families.
1993
Feb. 26, New York City: bomb exploded in basement garage of World Trade Center, killing 6 and injuring at least 1,040 others. In 1995, militant Islamist Sheik Omar Abdel Rahman and 9 others were convicted of conspiracy charges, and in 1998, Ramzi Yousef, believed to have been the mastermind, was convicted of the bombing. Al-Qaeda involvement is suspected.
1995
Nov. 13, Riyadh, Saudi Arabia: car bomb exploded at U.S. military headquarters, killing 5 U.S. military servicemen.
1996
June 25, Dhahran, Saudi Arabia: truck bomb exploded outside Khobar Towers military complex, killing 19 American servicemen and injuring hundreds of others. 13 Saudis and a Lebanese, all alleged members of Islamic militant group Hezbollah, were indicted on charges relating to the attack in June 2001.
1998
Aug. 7, Nairobi, Kenya, and Dar es Salaam, Tanzania: truck bombs exploded almost simultaneously near 2 U.S. embassies, killing 224 (213 in Kenya and 11 in Tanzania) and injuring about 4,500. 4 men connected with al-Qaeda 2 of whom had received training at al-Qaeda camps inside Afghanistan, were convicted of the killings in May 2001 and later sentenced to life in prison. A federal grand jury had indicted 22 men in connection with the attacks, including Saudi dissident Osama bin Laden, who remained at large.
2000
Oct. 12, Aden, Yemen: U.S. Navy destroyer USS Cole heavily damaged when a small boat loaded with explosives blew up alongside it. 17 sailors killed. Linked to Osama bin Laden, or members of al-Qaeda terrorist network.
2001
Sept. 11, New York City, Arlington, Va., and Shanksville, Pa.: hijackers crashed 2 commercial jets into twin towers of World Trade Center; 2 more hijacked jets were crashed into the Pentagon and a field in rural Pa. Total dead and missing numbered 2,9921: 2,749 in New York City, 184 at the Pentagon, 40 in Pa., and 19 hijackers. Islamic al-Qaeda terrorist group blamed. (See September 11, 2001: Timeline of Terrorism.)
2002
June 14, Karachi, Pakistan: bomb explodes outside American consulate in Karachi, Pakistan, killing 12. Linked to al-Qaeda.
2003 1
May 12, Riyadh, Saudi Arabia: suicide bombers kill 34, including 8 Americans, at housing compounds for Westerners. Al-Qaeda suspected.
2004
May 29–31, Riyadh, Saudi Arabia: terrorists attack the offices of a Saudi oil company in Khobar, Saudi Arabia, take foreign oil workers hostage in a nearby residential compound, leaving 22 people dead including one American.
June 11–19, Riyadh, Saudi Arabia: terrorists kidnap and execute Paul Johnson Jr., an American, in Riyadh, Saudi Arabia. 2 other Americans and BBC cameraman killed by gun attacks.
Dec. 6, Jeddah, Saudi Arabia: terrorists storm the U.S. consulate, killing 5 consulate employees. 4 terrorists were killed by Saudi security.
2005
Nov. 9, Amman, Jordan: suicide bombers hit 3 American hotels, Radisson, Grand Hyatt, and Days Inn, in Amman, Jordan, killing 57. Al-Qaeda claimed responsibility.
2006
Sept. 13, Damascus, Syria: an attack by four gunman on the American embassy is foiled.
2007
Jan. 12, Athens, Greece: the U.S. embassy is fired on by an anti-tank missile causing damage but no injuries.
Dec. 11, Algeria: more than 60 people are killed, including 11 United Nations staff members, when Al Qaeda terrorists detonate two car bombs near Algeria's Constitutional Council and the United Nations offices.
2008
May 26, Iraq: a suicide bomber on a motorcycle kills six U.S. soldiers and wounds 18 others in Tarmiya.
June 24, Iraq: a suicide bomber kills at least 20 people, including three U.S. Marines, at a meeting between sheiks and Americans in Karmah, a town west of Baghdad.
June 12, Afghanistan: four American servicemen are killed when a roadside bomb explodes near a U.S. military vehicle in Farah Province.
July 13, Afghanistan: nine U.S.soldiers and at least 15 NATO troops die when Taliban militants boldly attack an American base in Kunar Province, which borders Pakistan. It's the most deadly against U.S. troops in three years.
Aug. 18 and 19, Afghanistan: as many as 15 suicide bombers backed by about 30 militants attack a U.S. military base, Camp Salerno, in Bamiyan. Fighting between U.S. troops and members of the Taliban rages overnight. No U.S. troops are killed.
Sept. 16, Yemen: a car bomb and a rocket strike the U.S. embassy in Yemen as staff arrived to work, killing 16 people, including 4 civilians. At least 25 suspected al-Qaeda militants are arrested for the attack.
Nov. 26, India: in a series of attacks on several of Mumbai's landmarks and commercial hubs that are popular with Americans and other foreign tourists, including at least two five-star hotels, a hospital, a train station, and a cinema. About 300 people are wounded and nearly 190 people die, including at least 5 Americans.
2009
Feb. 9, Iraq: a suicide bomber kills four American soldiers and their Iraqi translator near a police checkpoint.
April 10, Iraq: a suicide attack kills five American soldiers and two Iraqi policemen.
June 1, Little Rock, Arkansas: Abdulhakim Muhammed, a Muslim convert from Memphis, Tennessee, is charged with shooting two soldiers outside a military recruiting center. One is killed and the other is wounded. In a January 2010 letter to the judge hearing his case, Muhammed asked to change his plea from not guilty to guilty, claimed ties to al-Qaeda, and called the shooting a jihadi attack "to fight those who wage war on Islam and Muslims."
Dec. 25: A Nigerian man on a flight from Amsterdam to Detroit attempted to ignite an explosive device hidden in his underwear. The explosive device that failed to detonate was a mixture of powder and liquid that did not alert security personnel in the airport. The alleged bomber, Umar Farouk Abdulmutallab, told officials later that he was directed by the terrorist group Al Qaeda. The suspect was already on the government's watch list when he attempted the bombing; his father, a respected Nigerian banker, had told the U.S. government that he was worried about his son's increased extremism.
Dec. 30, Iraq: a suicide bomber kills eight Americans civilians, seven of them CIA agents, at a base in Afghanistan. It's the deadliest attack on the agency since 9/11. The attacker is reportedly a double agent from Jordan who was acting on behalf of al-Qaeda.
2010
May 1, New York City: a car bomb is discovered in Times Square, New York City after smoke is seen coming from a vehicle. The bomb was ignited, but failed to detonate and was disarmed before it could cause any harm. Times Square was evacuated as a safety precaution. Faisal Shahzad pleads guilty to placing the bomb as well as 10 terrorism and weapons charges.
Oct. 29: two packages are found on separate cargo planes. Each package contains a bomb consisting of 300 to 400 grams (11-14 oz) of plastic explosives and a detonating mechanism. The bombs are discovered as a result of intelligence received from Saudi Arabia's security chief. The packages, bound from Yemen to the United States, are discovered at en route stop-overs, one in England and one in Dubai in the United Arab Emirates.
Read more: Terrorist Attacks in the U.S. or Against Americans — Infoplease.com Terrorist Attacks in the U.S. or Against Americans — Infoplease.com

Are acceptable to you because of what the United States and its Allies have done in the past ?

[seacapt]

I'm still not clear when Clinton issued her initial statement and when Romney issued that statement. If he thinks that statement is in any way an apology, he is way off the rails. However, the earlier statements from the embassy under attack (which were not authorized by the State Dept.) were designed to try to quell the anger of the crowd.

John McCain was complimentary of the Clinton statement.

Yes there is some disagreement as to the timeline with several sources now saying that they were issued "about the same time". Personally I don't care who spoke first although one seems to follow the other. What bothers me .. and I know all info is not public yet... is that it appears no defensive measures were taken once protesters / terrorists hit the top of the wall or breached the gate.
Can't find info on the size of the detatchments at those embassies or what specific orders were given.
I do know that in the past when a hostile hit the mid point of the barrier or began firing the rules changed.
Obviously security measures at the time personel were being evacuated were inadaquate.

[gokenin]

Getting some facts before moving your own lips. That is being ready to be President.

Did you same the same thing about OBama when he spoke before knowing the facts a few years ago when he criticized the Cambridge police officer? A comment by the way he later walked back as being said in error because he didn't have all the facts, but again I guess it's ok for him to comment without knowing the facts now isn't it?

[gokenin]

Here's a man who's deeply disturbed by the events of yesterday...

Please provide proof of what the pictures are from how do we know the context? What would stop me from putting a picture of Obama smiling up and saying the same thing. We know you hatred for all things Republican but could we at least provide context with your hatred ?

[GeneV]

Did you same the same thing about OBama when he spoke before knowing the facts a few years ago when he criticized the Cambridge police officer? A comment by the way he later walked back as being said in error because he didn't have all the facts, but again I guess it's ok for him to comment without knowing the facts now isn't it?

No, and that is not the way I remember the facts, if you are talking about the arrest of Prof. Gates. I'm sure we have already had a few threads on this.

Foreign policy is an area where the words of the President have special meaning. It is also an area where politicians have, in the past, been careful about criticizing a sitting president in time of crisis.

[gokenin]

As the article points out, you have an ultra conservative group using religious to stir the pot. It's in your best interest to win over the hearts and minds of those in the community that are not extremists. You don't do that by attacking the mob to then show dead women and children at the hands of the Americans.

As far as the US embassy getting overrun goes, it's this sort of reaction that I worry about when people speak of storming the Embassy of Ecuador to get Assange. Double standards are only justify these types of actions to the ones that perpetrate them. Romney might be spouting whats popular at home, but that doesn't mean it would ultimately better the interests of the US.

Yea because winning the hearts and minds approach has worked so well for governments in the past. As long as the religion itself endorses violence in the name of its prophet there will be no moderation in Islam. Until the day that an important Imam comes out and condemns violence in the name of Islam there will never be moderation in violences use to address perceived or incited offenses against Islam.

[Parallax]

It is also an area where politicians have, in the past, been careful about criticizing a sitting president in time of crisis.

Well, most of them, anyway. Brunhilda Brunhillary wasn't exactly supportive of Dubya after 911.