[Parallax]

I just got back from a short vacation to California. It's been a while since I've flown, so I have a question. Does anyone know just when it was that airlines totally and completely quit making any effort at being on time, or providing any customer service?
Last week: Airline 1 from Pierre to Denver, no checked luggage (this will be significant later), no problems.
Airline 2 from Denver to Sacramento: Plane left the gate 20 minutes late and arrived in Sacramento 20 minutes late. The pilot apologized for the flight being late due to the unusually high head winds from the storm that the West Coast was experiencing. I guess he didn't figure anyone would notice that the arrival time was late, almost to the minute, by the same time the departure was late.
Yesterday: My wife. my son, and I all got through security (relatively quick and painless) and arrived at the boarding gate at about 2:30; 30+ minutes before departure time. At what should have been boarding time the they announced that the flight would be arriving in 15 minutes (this is the same flight that we came in late on the week before) and the new departure time was now 3:45 instead of 3:12. 20 minutes after announcing that it would land in 15, they said the plane would be in in 5. 15 minutes after that it landed. This all made me wonder whether the pilot (or co-pilot) that was giving the information to the ground didn't have a watch and/or didn't know where they were at any given time. It then took them 20 minutes to get the passengers off.
Okay, we took off 1 hour late. The pilot said he'd put the coal to it and we would have a flight time of 1:45 instead of the scheduled 2:15. We landed 2 hours and 10 minutes later. He managed to make up a whopping 5 minutes. My son had missed his connection to Sioux Falls. (my wife and I still had a half hour to make ours to Pierre) We got on our flight, a Beach turbo prop, (these planes are really fun to fly in; besides having more leg room and more comfortable seats than the Airbus 319 from the other leg of the flight.). Each passenger gets a window seat and an isle seat because there's only one seat on each side of the isle. Here's where the carry-on luggage, you know, the stuff you carry with you instead of checking so you know it will arrive with you, comes in. On planes this size you don't actually carry it on, you check it plane-side, they put it in the hold, and you pick it up plane-side when you get off. 9 passengers got on the flight; 6 of us going to Pierre, and the other 3 getting off at the only other stop, Chadron, NE. The plane left on time, nice 1 hour flight to Chadron; 3 passengers got off. The ground person unfortunately couldn't, or didn't feel the need to read the destination tags; nor did he think it was odd that three passengers got off, but he took 4 bags off. My wife's "carry on" (you know, the stuff you carry with you instead of checking so you know it will arrive when you do?); is still in Chadron.
We got home and called my son. He was still, 3 hours after landing, in the Denver airport. He and the other passengers who missed connections went to Airline 2's service counter and were told that they would get them on a flight the next day, but as far as accommodations, meals, etc. for the evening, they were on their own. No meal vouchers, no lodging vouchers, nothing. It was essentially "We screwed up, thanks for flying with us, now go away."
Just heard from him a few minutes ago. He survived the night in Denver, and will be on a flight to his home in a few hours.
At this point I'm fairly certain who the bigger enemy of passenger friendly air travel is; it's not the much maligned TSA, it's the airlines themselves. I am absolutely certain however, that if in the future there is someplace I want to go that I can't get to by driving, by boat, or on foot; I'm not going!

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Last edited by Parallax; 12-06-2012 at 09:40 AM.

[GeneV]

Jim, I couldn't agree more. I keep wondering when busses got more comfortable than planes. We flew to Florida for thanksgiving and paid extra for "premium" seats. I could barely squeezed my legs in. What was that charge for? Then there is the charge for luggage. The bright spot coming back is that it was only a relatively small amount more to upgrade to first class. Now that was service

[MRRiley]

My wife and I have actually started taking the train when possible...

[gaweidert]

I now hate flying with a passion. Basically US based airlines operate as well as any third world airline out there. Too crowded, never on time. Not one ounce of customer service available. I have to fly from Buffalo, NY to Las Vegas next week and if I had the time I would rather drive. I will be more comfortable and probably only arrive a few hours later. I'd rather drive across the Rockies in winter than fly across them.


As somebody who has been flying since the mid 80's, it just sucks what the rent a a CEO crowd has dome to flying. As much as I hate to admit it, it was a lot more pleasant experience and much more customer orientated when the airlines were government regulated. Opening flying to the masses with below cost airfares etc ahs not helped he industry one iota. More people flying hasn't led to more profitable airlines. Ask TWA, Pan Am, Eastern............ etc.

[tim60]

I travel quite a lot. My pet peeves are:
1. I would rather pay up-front to the travel agent all the necessary charges: baggage, airport trolley use etc etc. This is much more convenient than needing to find small amounts of cash for this and that or having hidden extras that multiply the work paperwork related to the trip. (For example, arrinvign in Rome the only way to get the use of a trolley was to have aEUR2 coin - where does a traveller fromt heother side of the world get that - much better to increase the fare by EUR2 and have the airport charge the airline the extra EUR2 and assume everyone uses a trolley.
2. Pilots who seem unable to call ahead and say they are coming so a gate is ready when they get there, or even to look at the terminal and tell the controllers when the pilot sees a gate that maybe the controllers are unable to see from their tower. This is normal in USA. Did happen yesterday at AKL, where there had been a tornado earlier in the day, we waited an hour - would have been faster to get out where we waited and walk, and the exercise would not have hurt. Also, at Adelaide, the airbridge did not work, but it was too hard to use an adjacent gate, which was not in use, and presumably working.
3. Other passengers who take oversize carry-on, that then does not fit properly so that the overhead lockers fill much quicker than they are meant to, because wheelie bags go lengthwise instead of crosswise because they were too big.
4. Little differences between airlines or flight sectors in permitted baggage, such as piece weight or size. In Toronto when flying to Indianapolis I was told it was a domestic flight, so my international acceptable bags, as part of my three continents international journey all booked in the same ticket document, were not acceptable. I had to pay extra. At least I got my own back - I insisted on paying in Canadian cash (local currency at the Toronto airport, and legal tender there, and on getting a receipt becasue my boss loved receipts, or at least would only pay reimbursement for travel expenses.
5. Poor signs in airports, which make it hard to know where to go. Generally East Asia is best - Singaproe, Taipei, Narita. The worst are in English speaking places.
6. The American way of treating the airport like a country bus stop, and just as unappealing. In East Asia air travellers are treated as specail just because they travel by air. And most of the things that make you feel good actually cost NOTHING, like the staff being pleasant to you.
7. The total lack of the concept of 'transit passenger' in USA. Everywhere else an international traveller not actually intending to stay n the country never goes through immigration and never handles their bags. They check through and stay on the international side (they go tthrough security again). This saves a lot of time, and makes it impossible to become an illegal immigrant! But it makes the travel experience faster and more convenient. Of course, this relies on the airport having an international terminal building rather than a set of airline terminal buildings.

[Timd]

Well living in a third world country and flying a lot I have had very few problems. Most flights are on time, luggage there and staff friendly. Perhaps third world is not so bad after all.

[cyclone3d]

It has been like this for years now. Not really surprised at all.

"Lost" luggage, late take off and arrival is nothing new.

If the trip is only going to take 3-4 hours more than driving, it is not even worth it to fly when you take into aco all the time you are going to be at the airport before and after takeoff.

It also depends what airline you fly with. Some are better than others about actually having decent service. I wouldn't say that any of them have "good" service anymore.

[monochrome]

Just today I politely declined an opportunity to speak at a conference in La Jolla, CA (including the stay and a round of golf at the fabled Torrey Pines course) because the air travel from St. Louis to San Diego is only available as a 1-stop flight taking 7 1/2 hours total (and 4 1/4 air hours). I simply cannot abide the idea of an entire wasted day of hell in the air just to speak and play a round of golf, then another (weekend) wasted day of hell in the air. The above times, of course, assume no delays of any kind covering 4 takes off and arrivals.

Once upon a time this flight was nonstop and took 3 1/2 hours. And the seat ahead was 3" further away.

[Blue]

It has been a steep decline since 9/11. I think they hide behind that and TSA as an excuse to treat everyone like they don't care.

[Parallax]

I think they hide behind that and TSA as an excuse to treat everyone like they don't care.

Actually, TSA all along the way was no problem at all. Polite though, understandably, somewhat disengaged. One of them actually laughed and joked as he swabbed for explosives the 2lb Columbus Dry Salame I had in my bag. (it does resemble a tube of ANFO a bit. )

[LFLee]

I feel the same as OP. Airlines just make all sort of shameless excuses for late, canceled flights, so that they don't have to compensate you. At the same time they charge for everything from luggage to printing boarding pass. Not to mention TSA. One day these ill practices will irritate enough people to demand a change.

[Racer X 69]

As a boy I flew from Virginia to California on a commercial airline. Jet engined planes were just appearing in the business, so the first leg was on a Lockheed Tristar with radial engines. That plane took us from Norfolk to Kennedy in New York where we boarded a Boeing 707. That plane took us non stop to LAX, where we got on a Douglas DC3 for the final leg to Bakersfield.

There was a snack on the first plane and the stewardesses gave my sister and I wings, kind of like the pilot wears. We got lunch and dinner on the 707, and another snack on the DC3.

There were no hassles with security, and our luggage was there when we deplaned in Bakersfield.

I have flown commercial a few times as an adult and have watched as the quality of service has steadily declined. The last time I had a reasonably positive flying experience was in the early 1990's. I took a business trip from Seattle to Boston. We showed up at SeaTac and checked in. The person at the counter directed us to the jetway and gate. We got to the gate and checked in, and the person there told us when the plane would be boarding. We supposedly had plenty of time, and went to a cafe for breakfast. When we got back to the gate there was a plane there, but no one around. I walked down to the next gate and asked about our flight and the clerk pointed to a different gate where a plane had just been pushed away and was rolling toward the runway.

So back to the ticket counter. Turns out the person who checked us in wrote the wrong gate number on our boarding passes. After some scrambling about they had us on the next flight out in first class (the original flight was coach), gave us a bunch of free drink coupons, and vouchers for dinner at some fancy restaurant in Boston.

And we also got lunch and dinner on the plane.

*sigh*

Those days are long gone.

Since 9/11/2001 I have refused to travel via commercial airline. The BS with the TSA is only part of the reason. The airlines have turned to treating travelers like cattle. After the indignity of the security process, passengers are herded into shiny metal tubes and forced to sit crammed together like sardines. Then the plane is pushed back only to sit and wait on the tarmac for hours because airports are more congested than urban freeways.

A jet can get me from one coast to the other in less than a day, and driving will take about 4 days, 2 if I share driving with a friend. But the hassle of security, and the apathy or even outright rude indifference of the airline staff are not worth it.

And the scenery is better, even presents great photographic opportunities!

[Mallee Boy]

We have travelled a fair bit in the last 10 years, both domestically in Australia and Internationally.

The OP can rest assurred things are not that much different in the US to Australia when it comes to airlines. At the end of the day it is basically bus travel, albeit quicker and it flies.

Whenever possible we use Virgin, they at least try and be happy about being at work and you can get a conversation and a smile/laugh out of them. Virgin's Premium Economy is worth every cent on long haul.

The Flying Marsupial is a very different story...what was once a great airline is now staffed by grumpy old people who spend more time huddled in corners talking about union matters than paying attention to their customers....dare approach one of these huddles seeking service and you are promptly shredded and sent packing.

I share the pet peeve of the carry on luggage, I look on in wonder as some people try & stuff this into overhead lockers. The funniest experience I encountered with this was on a flight from Lax to Las with North West/Delta. As we boarded and made our way to our seats at the rear, the hostie was pleading (politely, calmly) with everyone to make sure that their carry on actually fitted in the locker because if she could not close the door it would be thrown (actual word used) out the back door (where someone may or may not catch it....again, actual words) and put in the hold and you could collect it (& pay) at the destination. This was repeated several times and was (to me at least) abundantly clear. However in a matter of minutes bags were hanging out of lockers at all angles.
Hostess then said that she was now coming down the aisle and repeated her statement....now this girl was a large, black girl and she looked very capable of throwing not only the bag, but its owner out the back door!....in a tone of voice that got everyones attention...it was beautiful....and people were scrambling out of seats to properly fit their carry on. I was doing the best I could not to burst out laughing at the whole scene.

Whoever that girl was, I have nothing but the highest admiration for her.

[rawr]

I share the pet peeve of the carry on luggage, I look on in wonder as some people try & stuff this into overhead lockers.

Indeed. I remember looking on in disbelief once on an Air France flight from Bangkok to Paris many years ago to see a guy bring a surfboard onto the plane as carry-on, and try to stuff it into the overhead locker. Cabin staff acted like it was an everyday occurence. But then again it was Air France. Anything goes with them. I stopped flying with Air France when I looked out of the window of a 747 of theirs on one trip, and saw a huge patch of open corrosion on one of the jet engine mounts.

[RoxnDox]

I feel your pain, but some airlines are better than others... I will never fly another United trip, but I've had mostly good service/times/etc on Alaska. Including a good shot to & from Hawaii in First Class (the upgrade was reasonable, and worth it...). Seems that things get worse as your airports get smaller, at least that's the trend I have observed over the last 20 yrs. With exceptions, of course.

Jim