[Buffy]

Is it me or do the people in this forum have a better handle on how to market Pentax than Pentax itself does?

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Last edited by Buffy; 03-20-2013 at 12:44 PM.

[Tesla]

Is it me or do the people in this forum have a better handle on how to market Pentax than Pentax itself does?

...

[Transit]

Is it me or do the people in this forum have a better handle on how to market Pentax than Pentax itself does?

Without a shadow of a doubt

[VTerlakyPhoto]

SlickYamaha, I don't think this is getting "political", but the shear number of unsatisfied people should give a hint that this contest was somewhat mismanaged, and a lot comes down to the fact that some rules were not properly communicated, and the inconsistency with which the rules were then followed.

1: I see a lot of people mentioning that one or more of their designs were not included in the voting. It was indeed mentioned in the contest thread that you can submit as many designs as you want, but only one will be selected by the staff for voting purposes, so technically you (you being you and the rest of the PF staff involved in this) are in the right. However, this rule was not mentioned in the first announcement post where the rules were outlined point by point. As you probably know being a forum admin, when it comes to these contests a lot of people only read the rules in the first post and don't try to read though pages of comments to see if other rules are mentioned or not. In that sense, yes, you (again, plural you) are technically in the right, but I think it is very understandable that this would cause strife later on.

2: There also seem to be people who submitted something and none of their designs are in the voting thread. I think here again you are in the right, it was stated clearly in the first announcement post that designs will be vetted before the voting thread. On the other hand, I also see it from their perspective. When you get an email saying something along the lines of "great, your submission is received, thank you so much for the design", then it is very easily misunderstood as meaning that everything is A-OK and the design will be in the voting thread. It is thus a little misleading - especially for non-native English speakers. I think this is mainly a communication issue that could've been solved very easily by sending the outright rejected submissions an email saying so and in a short sentence explaining why. Again, much strife could've been prevented this way.

3: The inconsistency with which rules were mentioned and then followed. As I said before, some rules or other pertinent information were only mentioned well into the comment thread, essentially buried in comments. This is clearly something that will only cause issues later on.

Now on to two issues that I mentioned earlier in this thread but haven't gotten a reply, but I think are relevant in this discussion.

1: This relates to the inconsistency with which rules were followed. While the "vetting" rule was followed to the tee, the rule that the official Pentax brand logo was not to be used seems to have gone to the wayside. It was explicitly and clearly stated in the announcement thread that this logo/font was not to be used, yet designs using this logo/font have been included in the voting thread. You say earlier in this thread that it's OK, because the logo/font can simply be changed for the final shirt. This is unfair for three reasons. First, there were many people I'm sure that changed and/or adjusted their designs, potentially spending a significant amount of time on this, to avoid using that font. Others clearly spent no time doing this, submitted something against the rules and still got through. Second, the font is an essential part of any design. Your claim that it can be simply and quickly by changed after voting is done is correct from a logistics point of view (most likely it is two clicks to change a font type), but I would argue that this significantly changes the final design going to print, and in the end the shirt will look different than what people voted for. Third, having the actual Pentax brand on a design skews the vote. It is well known in advertising that brand recognition is key, and in this case it's the same. People will be affected on an emotional level by seeing the Pentax brand, giving those designs an unfair advantage.

2: The issue with colour schemes. Every individual is supposed to have only one design in the voting thread, yet there are several submissions in the voting thread that are essentially two separate designs because they are different colour schemes of the same basic design (see #s 14, 45, 57, 84, 87, 88, 97). From what I could gather only one actual design will make it through to printing, so which one are we voting for?! For example (not to pick on any in particular, but) #14 there is a design with a white camera and black PF logo, and a black camera with white PF logo. The issue I see is that the former will NOT work on a white shirt, and the latter will NOT work on a black shirt. The others that I mentioned above have similar problems, where different colour schemes don't work on all shirt colours. This is an issue because in the rules it was stated that there will be black, white and (probably) red shirts available, which implies that all designs should work on all three shirt colours. So have things changed, and only one shirt colour is going to be used after all, or will these designs simply not work then? And which of the colour variations are we actually voting for?

As a final note I would like to say this. You essentially said earlier in this thread that all this strife is uncalled for because it's "just" a t-shirt contest, and that we should essentially bow down and be grateful to the organizers no matter what, because they made a lens available to the winner. You also said that maybe in the future these contests should essentially not have winnings because it's too much "politics". Having been a forum mod myself I understand your frustration in light of these "ungrateful" forum users, but frankly, this is very bad logic. The issue is indeed partly that the prize for the contest is not insignificant - for most people this is a HUGE prize to be won. As such, I think the organizers of such a give-away can anticipate fierce competition and high emotions among the contestants. After putting in all the effort to make designs, it then is very flippant to essentially say to the contestants "just suck it up, be grateful for this little t-shirt contest". No, when the stakes are this high (especially because the stakes are this high), I think we can expect a high level of professionalism on the organizers' part. This would include clear rules that are then followed consistently, and professional communication all the way through. All this, of course, does NOT take away anything from how happy the contestants are that the contest is held in the first place, and how grateful we are for the prize on offer, but on the flip side all we ask for is that the contest is held in a professional manner. Yes, this is a little more work for the organizers, but when the stakes are high, I think the organizers also have to put a little more into it, otherwise you will eventually alienate your contestants - and in the end maybe even lose PF members.

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Last edited by VTerlakyPhoto; 03-20-2013 at 01:46 PM.

[crewl1]

My votes are in.
I'm unsubscribing now, will check back on April 1 for the results and order info.

SlickYamaha thanks for doing this and putting up with all the b&c.

[Adam]

Is it me or do the people in this forum have a better handle on how to market Pentax than Pentax itself does?

+1

[Adam]

I've been reading a lot of negative comments regarding contest rules and selection process, etc. This really bugs me because we try hard to make these competitions fun and and easy to enter, and I know that the organizer of this particular contest certainly didn't want to be unfair to anyone.

While I understand that people whose submissions don't appear in the poll may be frustrated, it was in fact originally stated that all submissions would be subject to approval. Thus, not all submissions made the cut to be shown in this (second) stage of the selection process as there was an unexpectedly-high number of submissions overall. Furthermore, because the winning design will used for shirts meant to represent PentaxForums.com, the site staff will have the final say in who wins the competition. The winner of the competition may or may not be the same as the winner of this poll. I apologize that this wasn't made clear earlier. To make up for it, we will be making a number of honorable mentions as there are lots of great designs here, and the authors of those designs will be receiving free account upgrades on the forum!

Adam
PentaxForums.com Webmaster (Site Usage Guide | Site Help | My Photography)



PentaxForums.com server and development costs are user-supported. You can help cover these costs by donating or purchasing one of our Pentax eBooks. Or, buy your photo gear from our affiliates, Adorama, B&H Photo, KEH, or Topaz Labs, and get FREE Marketplace access - click here to see how! Trusted Pentax retailers:

[Docrwm]

I've been reading a lot of negative comments regarding contest rules and selection process, etc. This really bugs me because we try hard to make these competitions fun and and easy to enter, and I know that the organizer of this particular contest certainly didn't want to be unfair to anyone.

While I understand that people whose submissions don't appear in the poll may be frustrated, it was in fact originally stated that all submissions would be subject to approval. Thus, not all submissions made the cut to be shown in this (second) stage of the selection process as there was an unexpectedly-high number of submissions overall. Furthermore, because the winning design will used for shirts meant to represent PentaxForums.com, the site staff will have the final say in who wins the competition. The winner of the competition may or may not be the same as the winner of this poll. I apologize that this wasn't made clear earlier. To make up for it, we will be making a number of honorable mentions as there are lots of great designs here, and the authors of those designs will be receiving free account upgrades on the forum!

Very gracious of you.

There are some designs that even if they are not adopted here I'd love to have a shirt with them........there are so many good designs.

[Franky2step]

What a bunch of talented people we have on this forum.Fantastic variety of designs, any of which I would proudly wear!

[Akarak]

well i've made a design and submited two tshirts one with black shirt and another one with white shirt, they are the same design, but i've submited them in diferent pics

white.jpg and black.jpg .. i only see the white one on display while other users have multiple design colors in one single image and are on display.. well it's not fair as there's a lot of arguing on what fits best, black or white... and so.. i guess the people that prefer black tshirts won't be voting on me even though i have designed the same shirt in black

but the most important thing...
**this is a giveaway, even though i am sad my black shirt didn't make it, can i really argue?****


so i guess this is my thank you message for the pentax foruns to give me the opportunity to get a lens

awesome forum, perfect comunity

[blisskid]

A great job to all of the artists on these shirts. There were a lot of great choices. I went with 4, 33, and 98 with 18 as an honorable mention. I really do like 4's interpretation of a pentaxforums logo (indeed, I much prefer it to the current one, to be honest), and for the others I liked their minimalist and clean usage of Pentax photographic elements (literally, in the case of 98). I think that makes the shirt much more wearable.

Thanks macTAK for liking my approach! Keep the votes coming ppl & enjoy the positive side of thingsl!

[yucatanPentax]

My frustration is simply that I cannot see all the images. For some time, there's been some issue with being able to view all the image postings on PF. Some come through and others don't. I've tried looking at the exact same link in Firefox (latest edition), Chrome (latest edition) and MSIE (as up-to-date as MS updater makes it). I have a broadband connection, tons of RAM and an i5 processor.

Chrome tells me this:

Google Chrome could not load the webpage because i6.photobucket.com took too long to respond. The website may be down, or you may be experiencing issues with your Internet connection.
blah
blah
blah
Error 118 (net::ERR_CONNECTION_TIMED_OUT): The operation timed out.

or

Google Chrome's connection attempt to img844.imageshack.us was rejected. The website may be down, or your network may not be properly configured.
blah
blah
Error 102 (net::ERR_CONNECTION_REFUSED): The server refused the connection.

I'm at a loss. On every other website, including flicker and Photobucket, I have no issues viewing any images, even very large ones.
I can only see 2 of the 99 t-shirt designs which is sorta disappointing because everyone is raving about how great they all are.

Shifting gears:

I know it is only a t-shirt contest. Having been lucky enough to travel to quite a few places around the world, everyone doesn't have the same opportunities or personal wealth as they do in the USA. Often, I've met people who are very talented folks, who are well-educated or self-educated, who love some particular hobby or talent that they have, but there is simply zero possibility that they'll ever get a chance to step up from their current condition of living and improve their standard of living or level or employment or even see, let alone buy, all the many things which we have available to us in the USA. I've met very talented musicians, writers, artists... who live in thatched huts with dirt floors, on and on. (you get the idea)

So, a little recognition is all they seek, because they've lived all their lives under these conditions and have no hope that things will change. None.

When we say, "It's only a t-shirt contest," I'd just like to mention that perspective is coming from within the USA, arguably the richest nation on earth, to a world-wide audience. That hope of being recognized as a t-shirt contest winner may have meant a lot more to some people in some corners of the globe than to any of us with our 3 flat-screens, two cars - one of which is a Porsche, our 3 bedroom, 2 bath house, etc, etc, etc.

To someone in another nation, recognition in "only a t-shirt contest" may have meant the sole "win" they even had a chance at, ever. Yeah, that could be a bit exaggerated, but maybe not. Maybe not. Perspective is all I'm saying.

I think the entire operation is a fantastic idea and I know it is an enormous amount of work. I cannot even manage the Emails I get from regular contacts, let alone hundreds of submissions in all sorts of graphics files from everywhere in the world. So, kudos to the site, the volunteers and the administrators for going on with the contest process.

And if anyone has any ideas why I suddenly stopped being able to see some images from PF, I'm all ears. Thanks.

[HoBykoYan]

Is it me or do the people in this forum have a better handle on how to market Pentax than Pentax itself does?

Another +1 here...

45, 64, 42 and 20 for me (45 for my 1st choice)

[Transit]

Voting has not closed.
I don't think it's fair some people are reporting their votes !

[SlickYamaha]

The winning shirt is now 70 votes ahead!!