New Performance car prices !!

robtcorl · 05-07-2018, 09:48 AM - **2 Likes**

Home prices are much higher these days too, not only from inflation, but also larger sizes, and the added amenities.
In 1956 Chuck Berry had a list of options he wanted on his new Cadillac.
(note to Ford loving Mark Jerling, probably best to pass on this one)

Youtu.be

Ratmagiclady · 05-08-2018, 02:52 PM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by ThorSanchez

There are millions of them out there, many very cheap. They're called "used cars".

But just remember, because of the deletion of all the modern features the rate of deaths per mile driven in 1970 was something like three or four times higher than today. Relatively minor accidents you'd walk away from in 2018 would result in you being ejected from the car or impaled on the steering column 50 years ago.

I often think of getting an old Mini or other cool vintage car to restore for my kids when they turn 16. Then I think I'd rather that they live to see 20.

Well, on this, the automotive fatality (and even accident) rate plummeted in the late 70's, not actually so much at all cause of 'big bumpers' standards or 55mph national speed limits (or slower cars cause of primitive emission controls) but actually primarily because of *radial tires becoming nearly omnipresent* plus often-improved *brakes.* (plus shoulder belts to the extent those were actually used then.)

Vintage cars may not have crash ratings worth too much in comparison to modern cars, but a vintage car with upgrades to brakes and tires/suspension isn't inherently some kind of death trap these days if you take advantage of how easy it is to retrofit things to be much better.

Quote:

All of them? That's a slight exaggeration, but the performance of even basic cars today will crush the dreams of oldtimers. It's literally true that a 2018 Chrysler Pacifica minvan's 0-60 time (7.5 seconds) is as fast or faster than a 1975-82 Corvette. My 2014 Audi S4 is quicker to 60 mph than a 1980s Ferrari Testarossa that every boy had a poster of on their bedroom wall.

Well, those Vettes, like almost everything else built in America in those times, suffered from low compression and primitive emissions controls throwing a wet blanket on everything, so that's not surprising.

As Mustang GT350's, as opposed necessarily to regular GT's, well, the former's actually pretty capable of throwing down on the track with much more expensive vehicles, so that's more the market it's going for.

**ChrisPlatt** · 05-08-2018, 05:48 PM

Originally posted by gaweidert

For the last 17 years of my working career I covered most of New York state as a field service engineer.
I did not have NYC in my territory. Lots of driving. about 30,000 miles a year for work.

For 16 years I drove 3 V6 Astro vans more than 20,000 miles a year performing computer field service
for my company's largest customer at 20+ sites (2000+ desks) within the five boroughs of New York City.

After I got laid off (post 9/11) with no job prospects in IT and out of unemployment insurance
I trained for my CDL and had to do that for living for a couple years. I've had enough of driving.

Fortunately the job I've had for USPS since 2006 is in one location, indoors, with heat A/C and restrooms.
Not only that it's the shortest commute I've ever had in my working life, 20 minutes each way.

Chris

**Ex Finn.** · 05-30-2018, 08:42 PM

My local Jeep-Chrysler dealer has a Track-Hawk on the lot, if I did not have the alimony payments...
2018 Jeep Grand Cherokee - Performance Luxury SUV

**RobA_Oz** · 05-30-2018, 10:38 PM

I think a fair number of people have missed the point here. All those tricked-up extras that are bolted onto basic vehicles (not to mention the “prestige” brands created off them) provide a sense of superiority to the owner that allows manufacturers to charge as much as they think the market will bear. Prices would be lower if all they did was add the same margin to the real cost of the extras as they do to the base units.

You can thank Lee Iacocca for that, when he tore the body off a Falcon and made it into a two-door with sporting pretensions, though at least the premium over the donor car was small enough to allow well-heeled US parents to buy one for their kids to go to college in.

MarkJerling · 05-31-2018, 12:00 AM

As much as I like cars, I spend more on bicycles these days.

lesmore49 · 05-31-2018, 07:27 AM

Originally posted by MarkJerling

As much as I like cars, I spend more on bicycles these days.

With five and a half months of winter...a lot of it severe...periods of -30 to -35C ...snow and ice that comes...and stays... late October...early November till late March..early April...bicycles don't work well for most people here...as year round transportation.

The Canadian prairies are vast areas...with really not much in terms of passenger trains. Transportation that works best for most people here are vehicles.

MarkJerling · 05-31-2018, 02:48 PM

Originally posted by lesmore49

With five and a half months of winter...a lot of it severe...periods of -30 to -35C ...snow and ice that comes...and stays... late October...early November till late March..early April...bicycles don't work well for most people here...as year round transportation.

The Canadian prairies are vast areas...with really not much in terms of passenger trains. Transportation that works best for most people here are vehicles.

Who said anything about transportation?

I shall refer you to the rules:
Rule #25 // The bikes on top of your car should be worth more than the car.
Velominati ? The Rules

lesmore49 · 05-31-2018, 04:49 PM

Originally posted by MarkJerling

Who said anything about transportation?

I shall refer you to the rules:
Rule #25 // The bikes on top of your car should be worth more than the car.
Velominati ? The Rules

Even if you just have bicycles or motorcycles for that matter, for fun, fun, fun and not transportation...you're restricted here. I ride motorcycles, not as often as I used to...but when our winter comes...not even my '67 Matchless 750 (G15 CS) Scrambler with Dunlop knobbies can make it around here.

MarkJerling · 05-31-2018, 04:56 PM

Originally posted by lesmore49

Even if you just have bicycles or motorcycles for that matter, for fun, fun, fun and not transportation...you're restricted here. I ride motorcycles, not as often as I used to...but when our winter comes...not even my '67 Matchless 750 (G15 CS) Scrambler with Dunlop knobbies can make it around here.

"Climate Change" may help!

MarkJerling · 05-31-2018, 04:57 PM

Originally posted by robtcorl

Home prices are much higher these days too, not only from inflation, but also larger sizes, and the added amenities.
In 1956 Chuck Berry had a list of options he wanted on his new Cadillac.
(note to Ford loving Mark Jerling, probably best to pass on this one)

Chuck Berry - No Money Down - YouTube

I would not mind a '56 or '57 Cadillac!

The Squirrel Mafia · 05-31-2018, 05:23 PM

Originally posted by lesmore49

One a Ford Focus RS, 2.3 turbo 4 cylinder, 6 speed standard, etc. There it was...asking price was $ 60,000 +.

That is pretty steep. They are pretty awesome little cars, though. I'd lose my license in about 4.6 seconds. Hahaha!

lesmore49 · 05-31-2018, 07:14 PM

Originally posted by MarkJerling

"Climate Change" may help!

I wish it would, I'm tired of long, cold winters.

I recall riding my motorcycles back in the '60's when I was 16, 17, etc. and the same winter conditions still exist. One incident when I was 16 (1965) and trying out my Czechoslovakian made CZ 125 cc down the winter lane full of ice and snow...I think I made it about 20 feet on the CZ, before I landed in a snowbank.

---------- Post added 05-31-18 at 09:14 PM ----------

Originally posted by The Squirrel Mafia

That is pretty steep. They are pretty awesome little cars, though. I'd lose my license in about 4.6 seconds. Hahaha!

...It wouldn't take long,

MarkJerling · 05-31-2018, 07:44 PM

Originally posted by lesmore49

I wish it would, I'm tired of long, cold winters.

I recall riding my motorcycles back in the '60's when I was 16, 17, etc. and the same winter conditions still exist. One incident when I was 16 (1965) and trying out my Czechoslovakian made CZ 125 cc down the winter lane full of ice and snow...I think I made it about 20 feet on the CZ, before I landed in a snowbank.

---------- Post added 05-31-18 at 09:14 PM ----------

...It wouldn't take long,

I remember I was quite amused to see electric leads wrapped around wing mirrors in Canada. Had to ask a local what that was for: "Block heater" came the reply! Or driving between walls of snow higher than a truck. It sure gets cold there by you.

lesmore49 · 05-31-2018, 08:55 PM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by MarkJerling

I remember I was quite amused to see electric leads wrapped around wing mirrors in Canada. Had to ask a local what that was for: "Block heater" came the reply! Or driving between walls of snow higher than a truck. It sure gets cold there by you.

It does. We take a perverse pride in our long, cold winters. The city I live in (Winnipeg) is known in Canada as 'Winterpeg' .

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05-08-2018, 02:52 PM - 1 Like	#17
Ratmagiclady Veteran Member Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: GA Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 13,563	Originally posted by ThorSanchez There are millions of them out there, many very cheap. They're called "used cars". But just remember, because of the deletion of all the modern features the rate of deaths per mile driven in 1970 was something like three or four times higher than today. Relatively minor accidents you'd walk away from in 2018 would result in you being ejected from the car or impaled on the steering column 50 years ago. I often think of getting an old Mini or other cool vintage car to restore for my kids when they turn 16. Then I think I'd rather that they live to see 20. Well, on this, the automotive fatality (and even accident) rate plummeted in the late 70's, not actually so much at all cause of 'big bumpers' standards or 55mph national speed limits (or slower cars cause of primitive emission controls) but actually primarily because of radial tires becoming nearly omnipresent plus often-improved brakes. (plus shoulder belts to the extent those were actually used then.) Vintage cars may not have crash ratings worth too much in comparison to modern cars, but a vintage car with upgrades to brakes and tires/suspension isn't inherently some kind of death trap these days if you take advantage of how easy it is to retrofit things to be much better. Quote: All of them? That's a slight exaggeration, but the performance of even basic cars today will crush the dreams of oldtimers. It's literally true that a 2018 Chrysler Pacifica minvan's 0-60 time (7.5 seconds) is as fast or faster than a 1975-82 Corvette. My 2014 Audi S4 is quicker to 60 mph than a 1980s Ferrari Testarossa that every boy had a poster of on their bedroom wall. Well, those Vettes, like almost everything else built in America in those times, suffered from low compression and primitive emissions controls throwing a wet blanket on everything, so that's not surprising. As Mustang GT350's, as opposed necessarily to regular GT's, well, the former's actually pretty capable of throwing down on the track with much more expensive vehicles, so that's more the market it's going for.

05-08-2018, 05:48 PM	#18
ChrisPlatt Site Supporter Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Rockaway Beach NYC Posts: 7,692	Originally posted by gaweidert For the last 17 years of my working career I covered most of New York state as a field service engineer. I did not have NYC in my territory. Lots of driving. about 30,000 miles a year for work. For 16 years I drove 3 V6 Astro vans more than 20,000 miles a year performing computer field service for my company's largest customer at 20+ sites (2000+ desks) within the five boroughs of New York City. After I got laid off (post 9/11) with no job prospects in IT and out of unemployment insurance I trained for my CDL and had to do that for living for a couple years. I've had enough of driving. Fortunately the job I've had for USPS since 2006 is in one location, indoors, with heat A/C and restrooms. Not only that it's the shortest commute I've ever had in my working life, 20 minutes each way. Chris

05-30-2018, 08:42 PM	#19
Ex Finn. Site Supporter Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Southern Maryland. Espoo. Kouvola. Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 7,975	My local Jeep-Chrysler dealer has a Track-Hawk on the lot, if I did not have the alimony payments... 2018 Jeep Grand Cherokee - Performance Luxury SUV

05-30-2018, 10:38 PM	#20
RobA_Oz Site Supporter Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Tasmania, Australia Photos: Gallery Posts: 8,195	I think a fair number of people have missed the point here. All those tricked-up extras that are bolted onto basic vehicles (not to mention the “prestige” brands created off them) provide a sense of superiority to the owner that allows manufacturers to charge as much as they think the market will bear. Prices would be lower if all they did was add the same margin to the real cost of the extras as they do to the base units. You can thank Lee Iacocca for that, when he tore the body off a Falcon and made it into a two-door with sporting pretensions, though at least the premium over the donor car was small enough to allow well-heeled US parents to buy one for their kids to go to college in.

05-31-2018, 12:00 AM	#21
MarkJerling Moderator Site Supporter Join Date: May 2012 Location: Wairarapa, New Zealand Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 20,403	As much as I like cars, I spend more on bicycles these days.

05-31-2018, 07:27 AM	#22
lesmore49 Pentaxian Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Western Canada Posts: 12,337 Original Poster	Originally posted by MarkJerling As much as I like cars, I spend more on bicycles these days. With five and a half months of winter...a lot of it severe...periods of -30 to -35C ...snow and ice that comes...and stays... late October...early November till late March..early April...bicycles don't work well for most people here...as year round transportation. The Canadian prairies are vast areas...with really not much in terms of passenger trains. Transportation that works best for most people here are vehicles.

05-31-2018, 02:48 PM	#23
MarkJerling Moderator Site Supporter Join Date: May 2012 Location: Wairarapa, New Zealand Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 20,403	Originally posted by lesmore49 With five and a half months of winter...a lot of it severe...periods of -30 to -35C ...snow and ice that comes...and stays... late October...early November till late March..early April...bicycles don't work well for most people here...as year round transportation. The Canadian prairies are vast areas...with really not much in terms of passenger trains. Transportation that works best for most people here are vehicles. Who said anything about transportation? I shall refer you to the rules: Rule #25 // The bikes on top of your car should be worth more than the car. Velominati ? The Rules

05-31-2018, 04:49 PM	#24
lesmore49 Pentaxian Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Western Canada Posts: 12,337 Original Poster	Originally posted by MarkJerling Who said anything about transportation? I shall refer you to the rules: Rule #25 // The bikes on top of your car should be worth more than the car. Velominati ? The Rules Even if you just have bicycles or motorcycles for that matter, for fun, fun, fun and not transportation...you're restricted here. I ride motorcycles, not as often as I used to...but when our winter comes...not even my '67 Matchless 750 (G15 CS) Scrambler with Dunlop knobbies can make it around here.

05-31-2018, 04:56 PM	#25
MarkJerling Moderator Site Supporter Join Date: May 2012 Location: Wairarapa, New Zealand Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 20,403	Originally posted by lesmore49 Even if you just have bicycles or motorcycles for that matter, for fun, fun, fun and not transportation...you're restricted here. I ride motorcycles, not as often as I used to...but when our winter comes...not even my '67 Matchless 750 (G15 CS) Scrambler with Dunlop knobbies can make it around here. "Climate Change" may help!

05-31-2018, 04:57 PM	#26
MarkJerling Moderator Site Supporter Join Date: May 2012 Location: Wairarapa, New Zealand Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 20,403	Originally posted by robtcorl Home prices are much higher these days too, not only from inflation, but also larger sizes, and the added amenities. In 1956 Chuck Berry had a list of options he wanted on his new Cadillac. (note to Ford loving Mark Jerling, probably best to pass on this one) Chuck Berry - No Money Down - YouTube I would not mind a '56 or '57 Cadillac!

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05-31-2018, 05:23 PM	#27
The Squirrel Mafia Pentaxian Join Date: Jan 2015 Posts: 3,053	Originally posted by lesmore49 One a Ford Focus RS, 2.3 turbo 4 cylinder, 6 speed standard, etc. There it was...asking price was $ 60,000 +. That is pretty steep. They are pretty awesome little cars, though. I'd lose my license in about 4.6 seconds. Hahaha!

05-31-2018, 07:14 PM	#28
lesmore49 Pentaxian Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Western Canada Posts: 12,337 Original Poster	Originally posted by MarkJerling "Climate Change" may help! I wish it would, I'm tired of long, cold winters. I recall riding my motorcycles back in the '60's when I was 16, 17, etc. and the same winter conditions still exist. One incident when I was 16 (1965) and trying out my Czechoslovakian made CZ 125 cc down the winter lane full of ice and snow...I think I made it about 20 feet on the CZ, before I landed in a snowbank. ---------- Post added 05-31-18 at 09:14 PM ---------- Originally posted by The Squirrel Mafia That is pretty steep. They are pretty awesome little cars, though. I'd lose my license in about 4.6 seconds. Hahaha! ...It wouldn't take long,

05-31-2018, 07:44 PM	#29
MarkJerling Moderator Site Supporter Join Date: May 2012 Location: Wairarapa, New Zealand Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 20,403	Originally posted by lesmore49 I wish it would, I'm tired of long, cold winters. I recall riding my motorcycles back in the '60's when I was 16, 17, etc. and the same winter conditions still exist. One incident when I was 16 (1965) and trying out my Czechoslovakian made CZ 125 cc down the winter lane full of ice and snow...I think I made it about 20 feet on the CZ, before I landed in a snowbank. ---------- Post added 05-31-18 at 09:14 PM ---------- ...It wouldn't take long, I remember I was quite amused to see electric leads wrapped around wing mirrors in Canada. Had to ask a local what that was for: "Block heater" came the reply! Or driving between walls of snow higher than a truck. It sure gets cold there by you.

05-31-2018, 08:55 PM - 1 Like	#30
lesmore49 Pentaxian Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: Western Canada Posts: 12,337 Original Poster	Originally posted by MarkJerling I remember I was quite amused to see electric leads wrapped around wing mirrors in Canada. Had to ask a local what that was for: "Block heater" came the reply! Or driving between walls of snow higher than a truck. It sure gets cold there by you. It does. We take a perverse pride in our long, cold winters. The city I live in (Winnipeg) is known in Canada as 'Winterpeg' .