[clackers]

Challenging theories is one of the bases of science; dogmatism is best left to religion or, ideally, entirely outside. However, I have yet to find someone capable of disproving the theory of gravity .

But it's exactly as Allen says. Newton's gravity was disproved by Einstein, and it in turn may need to be modified ...

Einstein showed Newton was wrong about gravity. Now scientists are coming for Einstein.

Newton was a pretty dogmatic guy, btw!

[Serkevan]

But it's exactly as Allen says. Newton's gravity was disproved by Einstein, and it in turn may need to be modified ...

Einstein showed Newton was wrong about gravity. Now scientists are coming for Einstein.

Newton was a pretty dogmatic guy, btw!

Correction: Newton's gravity was refined by Einstein with the General Relativity theory, and there will be some more refinement needed (probably not in one round all at once); but there is still a theory of gravity.

In fact, Einstein took Newtonian gravity and took it to its logical conclusion, so that it was possible to apply it to non-point sources or extreme outliers. Gravity still exists, the underlying source of gravity is still mass, and the Newtonian equations still work as a very good approximation for most "rough" calculations. But, of course, we get closer and closer to "truth", with theories that are ever more general, with less exceptions. Isn't it all so beautiful?

---------- Post added 04-06-20 at 12:15 AM ----------

Self discipline and quiet, good-humoured resolve. How very British

Speaking of British leaders, Johnson was admitted to the hospital: Coronavirus: Prime Minister Boris Johnson admitted to hospital for COVID-19 tests | Breaking News News | Sky News
Purportedly for some tests, but he's had symptoms for over a week now and that's not generally a good sign.

[RobA_Oz]

But it's exactly as Allen says. Newton's gravity was disproved by Einstein, and it in turn may need to be modified ...

Einstein showed Newton was wrong about gravity. Now scientists are coming for Einstein.

Newton was a pretty dogmatic guy, btw!

Newton's theories have proven sufficiently accurate for most terrestrial work, to date, but Einstein provided a more refined view that accounted for the missing planet Vulcan, among other things. Really, it's not scientific to say Newton was wrong: he simply didn't account for a few situations involving gravity.

This of course, is the way science works: hypothesis becomes theory on the basis of reliable repeatability, and theory becomes refined rather than overturned, mostly, by closer and wider consideration.

Even the law, which is often regarded by the laity (and some "law-makers") as black and white, is subject to refinement as cases cause reconsideration.

[Dartmoor Dave]

The scientific method is the best way we've got of being sure that we actually do know the things that we think we know. And the reason why it's the best method is exactly because it constantly challenges its own theories to try to make them better.

As for coronavirus: epidemiologists have known for many years that something like this would come along eventually. They've done as much research as possible into previous less widespread epidemics, and they've formulated recommendations for scientific best practice that were already available to governments before this crisis ever started. But unfortunately politicians from all parts of the spectrum tend to believe that their own particular ideologies hold the answer to everything, and so in country after country they've ignored the scientific evidence.

So now scientists are scrambling to catch up and find ways to fix the damage caused by ideological rather than evidence-based responses. Don't blame the scientists for the state things have come to around the world in this crisis; blame the ideologues of all sorts of different kinds in all sorts of different countries.

---

Last edited by Dartmoor Dave; 04-06-2020 at 03:27 AM. Reason: Deleted a possibly inflammatory sentence.

[Serkevan]

The scientific method is the best way we've got of being sure that we actually do know the things that we think we know. And the reason why it's the best method is exactly because it constantly challenges its own theories to try to make them better.

As for coronavirus: epidemiologists have known for many years that something like this would come along eventually. They've done as much research as possible into previous less widespread epidemics, and they've formulated recommendations for scientific best practice that were already available to governments before this crisis ever started. But unfortunately politicians from all parts of the spectrum tend to believe that their own particular ideologies hold the answer to everything, and so in country after country they've ignored the scientific evidence.

So now scientists are scrambling to catch up and find ways to fix the damage caused by ideological rather than evidence-based responses. Don't blame the scientists for the state things have come to around the world in this crisis; blame the ideologues of all sorts of different kinds in all sorts of different countries.

Long term planning, investments in infrastructure and other such measures cost a lot of money.

[BigMackCam]

Folks, we've cut everyone (ourselves included) some slack in this thread, but please respect our forum rules which preclude political commentary and discussion. Let's all reign this back in, please, otherwise I'll have to close the thread.

Thanks in advance

[aslyfox]

A Surprise it is, no. A big problem, it is. As it means that it is possible for an animal reservoir to keep the virus in active circulation and the longer that persists the higher the chance the virus could mutate into something even worse. Potentially rendering any future vaccine development as an exercise in futility.

many animals may " host " viruses and we have learned to deal with them

to name a few:

plague - rodents transmitted to us via fleas

hantavirus - transmitted by disturbing droppings

lyme disease - infected animals transmitted via fleas again

[Rondec]

It appears that human-animal transmission of CoViD-19 is possible.

Hmmm... not good. Animals can catch this...

Tiger at US zoo tests positive for coronavirus - BBC News

I thought it was mildly amusing that people apparently got really upset that a tiger could get tested for COVID when multiple New Yorkers haven't been able to. It turns out that you don't send tiger blood to a human lab (or vice versa). Bronx Zoo says tiger didn't get a human coronavirus test

There does seem to be good news coming out of Europe, where Spain and Italy seem to have crested. Ecuador looks like it is in dire straits, although with the minimum level of testing being done there, it is hard to know what the number of deaths from COVID there are in that country.

[Serkevan]

many animals may " host " viruses and we have learned to deal with them

to name a few:

plague - rodents transmitted to us via fleas

hantavirus - transmitted by disturbing droppings

lyme disease - infected animals transmitted via fleas again

Both lyme and the plague are cause by bacteria, so antibiotics tend to work, and the hantavirus is transmitted almost exclusively via aerosolized feces, so rodent control is a relatively easy way of minimizing its impact. None of these have the pandemic potential of this thing, particularly if it infects pets and cattle.

[aslyfox]

Both lyme and the plague are cause by bacteria, so antibiotics tend to work, and the hantavirus is transmitted almost exclusively via aerosolized feces, so rodent control is a relatively easy way of minimizing its impact. None of these have the pandemic potential of this thing, particularly if it infects pets and cattle.

my point wasn't that the diseases were on the same " level " but that we have dealt with diseases which have a " natural reservoir " that never have been completely eliminated

perhaps there will be such effective measures developed for this problem as well

rodent [ mice and rats ] control has been a long term goal of humanity throughout history

not very well controlled in a whole lot of areas as far as I know

luckily, as far as I know, not all mice and rats carry the hantavirus

as far as I know, it is limited in scope

[Digitalis]

I thought it was mildly amusing that people apparently got really upset that a tiger could get tested for COVID when multiple New Yorkers haven't been able to.

Some people can't science.

[aslyfox]

my local news [ update 2 times a day ] from yesterday:

ArcGIS Dashboards

more tested

more found to be infected

no more deaths as of now

one additional survivor noted

[Serkevan]

my point wasn't that the diseases were on the same " level " but that we have dealt with diseases which have a " natural reservoir " that never have been completely eliminated

perhaps there will be such effective measures developed for this problem as well

rodent [ mice and rats ] control has been a long term goal of humanity throughout history

not very well controlled in a whole lot of areas as far as I know

luckily, as far as I know, not all mice and rats carry the hantavirus

as far as I know, it is limited in scope

On that, certainly; it's just that I'd rather not have to deal with it

[Dartmoor Dave]

Folks, we've cut everyone (ourselves included) some slack in this thread, but please respect our forum rules which preclude political commentary and discussion. Let's all reign this back in, please, otherwise I'll have to close the thread.

Thanks in advance

Apologies if that was me. I've deleted the original last sentence of my comment as probably too inflammatory.

[BigMackCam]

Apologies if that was me. I've deleted the original last sentence of my comment as probably too inflammatory.

It's all (or at least, many) of us, Dave I'm certainly not pointing fingers at any specific members, and we mods have taken a few liberties too, it must be said. I'd just like to manage this before it becomes a problem requiring infractions and thread closure...