Got vaccinated today. Anyone??

PDL · 09-21-2021, 10:15 PM - **1 Like**

This thread has nothing to do with Healthcare support systems, firearms, bean counters etc.

There are people world wide who are actively not getting the vaccines and there are people who have actively sought them out (raises hands). In the US and most other countries, I think, the vaccines are paid for by the local authorities or some other NGO. There are world wide issues with supply and overall access. My state has around a 70% vaccination rate, but there are places in my state where it is far too low and groups of people who just do not get it (metaphorically).

In a earlier thread about the virus I gave a pitch from a book I read on "The Effects of the use of Chemical and Biological Weapons" (UN circa 1970). In the preface there is a story from a professor standing in front of a class who holds up a cube of Plastic. He said (paraphrasing) In this cube is a crystal of Small Pox with enough virus to infect every human on the planet. Creating such a agent is not all that hard - the hard part is distributing a single virus particle to each individual on the planet. The problem is logistics and distribution mechanisms.

Currently with the SARS-Cov-19 virus, a professor could stand in front of a class and while holding up a vial of vaccine say - We have a solution to this Pandemic - but the issue is how do we get the shot into 7 Billion people.

Again - the issue is logistics and distribution mechanisms. Now, however we have the additional issue of those who should know better and are not getting the shot(s).

Get - Vaccinated.

slartibartfast01 · 09-21-2021, 11:09 PM

Originally posted by PDL

This thread has nothing to do with Healthcare support systems, firearms, bean counters etc.

There are people world wide who are actively not getting the vaccines and there are people who have actively sought them out (raises hands). In the US and most other countries, I think, the vaccines are paid for by the local authorities or some other NGO. There are world wide issues with supply and overall access. My state has around a 70% vaccination rate, but there are places in my state where it is far too low and groups of people who just do not get it (metaphorically).

In a earlier thread about the virus I gave a pitch from a book I read on "The Effects of the use of Chemical and Biological Weapons" (UN circa 1970). In the preface there is a story from a professor standing in front of a class who holds up a cube of Plastic. He said (paraphrasing) In this cube is a crystal of Small Pox with enough virus to infect every human on the planet. Creating such a agent is not all that hard - the hard part is distributing a single virus particle to each individual on the planet. The problem is logistics and distribution mechanisms.

Currently with the SARS-Cov-19 virus, a professor could stand in front of a class and while holding up a vial of vaccine say - We have a solution to this Pandemic - but the issue is how do we get the shot into 7 Billion people.

Again - the issue is logistics and distribution mechanisms. Now, however we have the additional issue of those who should know better and are not getting the shot(s).

Get - Vaccinated.

Do HMOs insist on vaccination for their clients? It would make perfect sense to do so.

MarkJerling · 09-22-2021, 01:42 AM

Originally posted by PDL

And what part of "And the US's medical system is a mess." did you not understand?

The US has tried to have a single payer system multiple times in the past (and future). There are forces here that will deny common sense at all levels.

Yeah, sorry, saw your later post. I was merely pointing out the interesting statistics.

MarkJerling · 09-22-2021, 01:43 AM

Lots of discussions here today about what level of vaccinations will allow us to stop having lockdowns. It seems the figure decided on is 90% of eligible people.

**Rondec** · 09-22-2021, 02:32 AM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by MarkJerling

My doctor can't be sued. Everyone gets paid whether I die or not.
Yet, NZ's average life expectancy is 82.3 years, USA is 78.9, Canada is 82.4.
NZ child mortality is 0.5% before age 5, USA is 0.7%, Canada is 0.5%.
Maternal mortality rate in NZ is 11 deaths per 100,000 live births, USA is 14, Canada is 7.
Per capita spending on health care in New Zealand is $4,018.31, USA is $9,402.54 and Canada is $4,640.95.

I'm not convinced the "Sue the crap out of them for wrongful death" model is all that successful. Well, it's probably successful for the lawyers, but I don't think it's helping health outcomes.

It feels like many of these things are related to societal issues that the medical system struggles to work with. Obesity rate is 30 percent in New Zealand, 27 percent in Canada and 42 percent in the US. Probably related to this, Diabetes prevalence is 5 percent in New Zealand, 9 percent in Canada and 11 percent in the US. These are problems that most wealthy countries deal with, but getting people to exercise and eat healthy are the basic building blocks for a health society -- not throw more medicine at the problem.

I don't think lawyers are particularly the issue, although of course doctors do worry some about that and may order more tests than is necessary in order to avoid a law suit.

Vaccinations are very cost effective and a lot cheaper than either ICU care or Monoclonal antibodies (which are typically priced slightly over 2,000 dollars for an infusion). The idea that unvaccinated folks are willing to take monoclonal antibodies is odd to me, since they don't have multiple years of testing, but I guess somehow it seems less scary.

Just from a family standpoint, my 10 year old son has been struggling since getting over COVID. Just really seems to be battling terrible fatigue and maybe even some depression -- he's just tearful all of the time now. We are going to have him seen on Friday, but it has been three weeks and clearly something is wrong. Just because he is ten doesn't mean that he just popped out of it. I know in adults the rate of new psychiatric diagnosis is close to 20 percent after COVID, so I guess it makes sense that it can affect kids that way too. DEFINE_ME

MarkJerling · 09-22-2021, 03:05 AM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by Rondec

Just from a family standpoint, my 10 year old son has been struggling since getting over COVID. Just really seems to be battling terrible fatigue and maybe even some depression -- he's just tearful all of the time now. We are going to have him seen on Friday, but it has been three weeks and clearly something is wrong. Just because he is ten doesn't mean that he just popped out of it. I know in adults the rate of new psychiatric diagnosis is close to 20 percent after COVID, so I guess it makes sense that it can affect kids that way too. DEFINE_ME

I'm sorry to hear that. We seem to think the kids have it easy with Covid and it only knocks us older buggers! I hope he's fully recovered soon.

**Serkevan** · 09-22-2021, 03:17 AM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by Rondec

Just from a family standpoint, my 10 year old son has been struggling since getting over COVID. Just really seems to be battling terrible fatigue and maybe even some depression -- he's just tearful all of the time now. We are going to have him seen on Friday, but it has been three weeks and clearly something is wrong. Just because he is ten doesn't mean that he just popped out of it. I know in adults the rate of new psychiatric diagnosis is close to 20 percent after COVID, so I guess it makes sense that it can affect kids that way too. DEFINE_ME

I'm so sorry to hear this... I hope he recovers quickly and completely!

I can imagine that feeling tired all the time would be really stressful for a kid, I know I would feel down when I was a child and had to rest to recover from a fever... hopefully it's just that he's sad because of it, and nothing more serious

Racer X 69 · 09-22-2021, 03:32 AM - **2 Likes**

Originally posted by Wheatfield

This is way off topic, but.....

It's actually the individual provincial governments responsibility to pay for health care. The federal government sends out equalization payments to provinces that need a boost to maintain the system.

But the money comes from the people through taxes.

So each taxpayer is an owner of the health care system.

**aslyfox** · 09-22-2021, 03:39 AM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by Rondec

. . . Just from a family standpoint, my 10 year old son has been struggling since getting over COVID. Just really seems to be battling terrible fatigue and maybe even some depression -- he's just tearful all of the time now. We are going to have him seen on Friday, but it has been three weeks and clearly something is wrong. Just because he is ten doesn't mean that he just popped out of it. I know in adults the rate of new psychiatric diagnosis is close to 20 percent after COVID, so I guess it makes sense that it can affect kids that way too. . . .

sorry that he and the rest of the family are having to deal with this situation

so glad you are reaching out to seek help

good luck

**barondla** · 09-22-2021, 04:31 AM

Originally posted by MarkJerling

Lots of discussions here today about what level of vaccinations will allow us to stop having lockdowns. It seems the figure decided on is 90% of eligible people.

This is why so many don't trust the experts. We were told over and over, in the US, that 70% would do it.

Thanks,
barondla

**aslyfox** · 09-22-2021, 04:40 AM

Originally posted by barondla

This is why so many don't trust the experts. We were told over and over, in the US, that 70% would do it.

Thanks,
barondla

perhaps that was for the original not the variants ?

in any case, it was and remains an " educated guess "

Covid 19 has not been known or studied for that long of time

**alfa75ts** · 09-22-2021, 04:50 AM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by Rondec

my 10 year old son has been struggling since getting over COVID. Just really seems to be battling terrible fatigue and maybe even some depression

Very sorry to hear that, I hope he comes good soon.

This article might be better that the rather technical Lancet one: Long-Haul COVID-19 in Children and Teens - HealthyChildren.org

**Serkevan** · 09-22-2021, 04:52 AM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by barondla

This is why so many don't trust the experts. We were told over and over, in the US, that 70% would do it.

Thanks,
barondla

It would do, for the original strain. Delta is significantly more infectious, and therefore needs a higher vaccination percentage to compensate.

mtkeller · 09-22-2021, 06:52 AM - **4 Likes**

Originally posted by barondla

This is why so many don't trust the experts. We were told over and over, in the US, that 70% would do it.

Thanks,
barondla

You seem to not understand how science works. Science constantly takes the best information available and draws conclusions. When more information becomes available or circumstances change, those conclusions get updated. Science is always the best we know now and prepared to change in the face of additional evidence.

Wheatfield · 09-22-2021, 06:56 AM - **2 Likes**

Originally posted by Rondec

Just from a family standpoint, my 10 year old son has been struggling since getting over COVID. Just really seems to be battling terrible fatigue and maybe even some depression -- he's just tearful all of the time now. We are going to have him seen on Friday, but it has been three weeks and clearly something is wrong. Just because he is ten doesn't mean that he just popped out of it. I know in adults the rate of new psychiatric diagnosis is close to 20 percent after COVID, so I guess it makes sense that it can affect kids that way too. DEFINE_ME

That's terrible. Hopefully he will get past it soon. I'm not a religious man, but if I was I would be praying for him and your family.
At least I can send a few kind thoughts your way.
Take care.

09-22-2021, 04:40 AM	#1631
aslyfox Seeker of Knowledge Join Date: Aug 2016 Location: Topeka, Kansas Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 24,581	Originally posted by barondla This is why so many don't trust the experts. We were told over and over, in the US, that 70% would do it. Thanks, barondla perhaps that was for the original not the variants ? in any case, it was and remains an " educated guess " Covid 19 has not been known or studied for that long of time Last edited by aslyfox; 09-22-2021 at 04:57 AM.

Similar Threads
Thread	Thread Starter	Forum	Replies	Last Post
Well I Got Surprised Today	mhsp1948	Pentax SLR Lens Discussion	16	07-25-2020 07:55 AM
I got myself a complete kit of a Pentax SLR with lenses today (Auto 110)	MrKodak	Film SLRs and Compact Film Cameras	19	05-08-2019 10:08 PM
I got one - I got one - I got one (K1M2)	rcolman	Pentax K-1 & K-1 II	8	04-08-2018 09:34 AM
I got a sideswipe from a Pro today...	Neville	Photographic Technique	65	09-29-2015 07:52 AM
It isn't a Pentax, but I got another film camera today.	little laker	Canon, Nikon, Sony, and Other Camera Brands	5	01-13-2010 11:57 AM

09-21-2021, 10:15 PM - 1 Like	#1621
PDL Pentaxian Join Date: Oct 2006 Location: PNW USA Photos: Gallery Posts: 2,127	This thread has nothing to do with Healthcare support systems, firearms, bean counters etc. There are people world wide who are actively not getting the vaccines and there are people who have actively sought them out (raises hands). In the US and most other countries, I think, the vaccines are paid for by the local authorities or some other NGO. There are world wide issues with supply and overall access. My state has around a 70% vaccination rate, but there are places in my state where it is far too low and groups of people who just do not get it (metaphorically). In a earlier thread about the virus I gave a pitch from a book I read on "The Effects of the use of Chemical and Biological Weapons" (UN circa 1970). In the preface there is a story from a professor standing in front of a class who holds up a cube of Plastic. He said (paraphrasing) In this cube is a crystal of Small Pox with enough virus to infect every human on the planet. Creating such a agent is not all that hard - the hard part is distributing a single virus particle to each individual on the planet. The problem is logistics and distribution mechanisms. Currently with the SARS-Cov-19 virus, a professor could stand in front of a class and while holding up a vial of vaccine say - We have a solution to this Pandemic - but the issue is how do we get the shot into 7 Billion people. Again - the issue is logistics and distribution mechanisms. Now, however we have the additional issue of those who should know better and are not getting the shot(s). Get - Vaccinated.

09-21-2021, 11:09 PM	#1622
slartibartfast01 Pentaxian Join Date: May 2015 Photos: Gallery Posts: 1,931	Originally posted by PDL This thread has nothing to do with Healthcare support systems, firearms, bean counters etc. There are people world wide who are actively not getting the vaccines and there are people who have actively sought them out (raises hands). In the US and most other countries, I think, the vaccines are paid for by the local authorities or some other NGO. There are world wide issues with supply and overall access. My state has around a 70% vaccination rate, but there are places in my state where it is far too low and groups of people who just do not get it (metaphorically). In a earlier thread about the virus I gave a pitch from a book I read on "The Effects of the use of Chemical and Biological Weapons" (UN circa 1970). In the preface there is a story from a professor standing in front of a class who holds up a cube of Plastic. He said (paraphrasing) In this cube is a crystal of Small Pox with enough virus to infect every human on the planet. Creating such a agent is not all that hard - the hard part is distributing a single virus particle to each individual on the planet. The problem is logistics and distribution mechanisms. Currently with the SARS-Cov-19 virus, a professor could stand in front of a class and while holding up a vial of vaccine say - We have a solution to this Pandemic - but the issue is how do we get the shot into 7 Billion people. Again - the issue is logistics and distribution mechanisms. Now, however we have the additional issue of those who should know better and are not getting the shot(s). Get - Vaccinated. Do HMOs insist on vaccination for their clients? It would make perfect sense to do so.

09-22-2021, 01:42 AM	#1623
MarkJerling Moderator Site Supporter Join Date: May 2012 Location: Wairarapa, New Zealand Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 20,406	Originally posted by PDL And what part of "And the US's medical system is a mess." did you not understand? The US has tried to have a single payer system multiple times in the past (and future). There are forces here that will deny common sense at all levels. Yeah, sorry, saw your later post. I was merely pointing out the interesting statistics.

09-22-2021, 01:43 AM	#1624
MarkJerling Moderator Site Supporter Join Date: May 2012 Location: Wairarapa, New Zealand Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 20,406	Lots of discussions here today about what level of vaccinations will allow us to stop having lockdowns. It seems the figure decided on is 90% of eligible people.

09-22-2021, 02:32 AM - 1 Like	#1625
Rondec Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Gladys, Virginia Photos: Gallery Posts: 27,652	Originally posted by MarkJerling My doctor can't be sued. Everyone gets paid whether I die or not. Yet, NZ's average life expectancy is 82.3 years, USA is 78.9, Canada is 82.4. NZ child mortality is 0.5% before age 5, USA is 0.7%, Canada is 0.5%. Maternal mortality rate in NZ is 11 deaths per 100,000 live births, USA is 14, Canada is 7. Per capita spending on health care in New Zealand is $4,018.31, USA is $9,402.54 and Canada is $4,640.95. I'm not convinced the "Sue the crap out of them for wrongful death" model is all that successful. Well, it's probably successful for the lawyers, but I don't think it's helping health outcomes. It feels like many of these things are related to societal issues that the medical system struggles to work with. Obesity rate is 30 percent in New Zealand, 27 percent in Canada and 42 percent in the US. Probably related to this, Diabetes prevalence is 5 percent in New Zealand, 9 percent in Canada and 11 percent in the US. These are problems that most wealthy countries deal with, but getting people to exercise and eat healthy are the basic building blocks for a health society -- not throw more medicine at the problem. I don't think lawyers are particularly the issue, although of course doctors do worry some about that and may order more tests than is necessary in order to avoid a law suit. Vaccinations are very cost effective and a lot cheaper than either ICU care or Monoclonal antibodies (which are typically priced slightly over 2,000 dollars for an infusion). The idea that unvaccinated folks are willing to take monoclonal antibodies is odd to me, since they don't have multiple years of testing, but I guess somehow it seems less scary. Just from a family standpoint, my 10 year old son has been struggling since getting over COVID. Just really seems to be battling terrible fatigue and maybe even some depression -- he's just tearful all of the time now. We are going to have him seen on Friday, but it has been three weeks and clearly something is wrong. Just because he is ten doesn't mean that he just popped out of it. I know in adults the rate of new psychiatric diagnosis is close to 20 percent after COVID, so I guess it makes sense that it can affect kids that way too. DEFINE_ME

09-22-2021, 03:05 AM - 1 Like	#1626
MarkJerling Moderator Site Supporter Join Date: May 2012 Location: Wairarapa, New Zealand Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 20,406	Originally posted by Rondec Just from a family standpoint, my 10 year old son has been struggling since getting over COVID. Just really seems to be battling terrible fatigue and maybe even some depression -- he's just tearful all of the time now. We are going to have him seen on Friday, but it has been three weeks and clearly something is wrong. Just because he is ten doesn't mean that he just popped out of it. I know in adults the rate of new psychiatric diagnosis is close to 20 percent after COVID, so I guess it makes sense that it can affect kids that way too. DEFINE_ME I'm sorry to hear that. We seem to think the kids have it easy with Covid and it only knocks us older buggers! I hope he's fully recovered soon.

09-22-2021, 03:17 AM - 1 Like	#1627
Serkevan Site Supporter Join Date: May 2019 Photos: Albums Posts: 5,976	Originally posted by Rondec Just from a family standpoint, my 10 year old son has been struggling since getting over COVID. Just really seems to be battling terrible fatigue and maybe even some depression -- he's just tearful all of the time now. We are going to have him seen on Friday, but it has been three weeks and clearly something is wrong. Just because he is ten doesn't mean that he just popped out of it. I know in adults the rate of new psychiatric diagnosis is close to 20 percent after COVID, so I guess it makes sense that it can affect kids that way too. DEFINE_ME I'm so sorry to hear this... I hope he recovers quickly and completely! I can imagine that feeling tired all the time would be really stressful for a kid, I know I would feel down when I was a child and had to rest to recover from a fever... hopefully it's just that he's sad because of it, and nothing more serious

09-22-2021, 03:32 AM - 2 Likes	#1628
Racer X 69 Moderator Man With A Camera Join Date: Jun 2010 Location: The Great Pacific Northwet, in the Land Between Canada and Mexico Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 28,065	Originally posted by Wheatfield This is way off topic, but..... It's actually the individual provincial governments responsibility to pay for health care. The federal government sends out equalization payments to provinces that need a boost to maintain the system. But the money comes from the people through taxes. So each taxpayer is an owner of the health care system.

09-22-2021, 03:39 AM - 1 Like	#1629
aslyfox Seeker of Knowledge Join Date: Aug 2016 Location: Topeka, Kansas Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 24,581	Originally posted by Rondec . . . Just from a family standpoint, my 10 year old son has been struggling since getting over COVID. Just really seems to be battling terrible fatigue and maybe even some depression -- he's just tearful all of the time now. We are going to have him seen on Friday, but it has been three weeks and clearly something is wrong. Just because he is ten doesn't mean that he just popped out of it. I know in adults the rate of new psychiatric diagnosis is close to 20 percent after COVID, so I guess it makes sense that it can affect kids that way too. . . . sorry that he and the rest of the family are having to deal with this situation so glad you are reaching out to seek help good luck

09-22-2021, 04:31 AM	#1630
barondla Site Supporter Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: midwest, United States Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 5,714	Originally posted by MarkJerling Lots of discussions here today about what level of vaccinations will allow us to stop having lockdowns. It seems the figure decided on is 90% of eligible people. This is why so many don't trust the experts. We were told over and over, in the US, that 70% would do it. Thanks, barondla

09-22-2021, 04:50 AM - 1 Like	#1632
alfa75ts Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Jun 2009 Location: Melbourne Australia Photos: Albums Posts: 1,356	Originally posted by Rondec my 10 year old son has been struggling since getting over COVID. Just really seems to be battling terrible fatigue and maybe even some depression Very sorry to hear that, I hope he comes good soon. This article might be better that the rather technical Lancet one: Long-Haul COVID-19 in Children and Teens - HealthyChildren.org

09-22-2021, 04:52 AM - 1 Like	#1633
Serkevan Site Supporter Join Date: May 2019 Photos: Albums Posts: 5,976	Originally posted by barondla This is why so many don't trust the experts. We were told over and over, in the US, that 70% would do it. Thanks, barondla It would do, for the original strain. Delta is significantly more infectious, and therefore needs a higher vaccination percentage to compensate.

09-22-2021, 06:52 AM - 4 Likes	#1634
mtkeller Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2019 Location: Sioux City, IA Photos: Gallery Posts: 938	Originally posted by barondla This is why so many don't trust the experts. We were told over and over, in the US, that 70% would do it. Thanks, barondla You seem to not understand how science works. Science constantly takes the best information available and draws conclusions. When more information becomes available or circumstances change, those conclusions get updated. Science is always the best we know now and prepared to change in the face of additional evidence.

09-22-2021, 06:56 AM - 2 Likes	#1635
Wheatfield Moderator Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: The wheatfields of Canada Posts: 15,981	Originally posted by Rondec Just from a family standpoint, my 10 year old son has been struggling since getting over COVID. Just really seems to be battling terrible fatigue and maybe even some depression -- he's just tearful all of the time now. We are going to have him seen on Friday, but it has been three weeks and clearly something is wrong. Just because he is ten doesn't mean that he just popped out of it. I know in adults the rate of new psychiatric diagnosis is close to 20 percent after COVID, so I guess it makes sense that it can affect kids that way too. DEFINE_ME That's terrible. Hopefully he will get past it soon. I'm not a religious man, but if I was I would be praying for him and your family. At least I can send a few kind thoughts your way. Take care.