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09-22-2009, 07:22 AM   #1
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an article on guns




Last edited by Peter Zack; 09-23-2009 at 11:42 AM.
09-22-2009, 07:44 AM   #2
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While the article is interesting and has merit, it also has the typical inaccuracies in it. First, there is still a legal militia in the U.S. that is separate from the Reserves and National Guard. It is provided for in the U.S. Code and it consists of all between 17 and 45 years old that aren't in the regular military, reserves or National Guard. The other is that with hand guns there has been waiting periods for years, actually decades and there is currently the computerized instant check for long guns.

I also find it ludicrous to think that any of the Amendments not limited to, but especially the Bill of Rights should be compromised away. Its also interesting that Che is made out as a folk hero. He is the guy responsible for the Cuban Missile Crisis and the leader of the Cuban Militia at the Bay of Pigs. I dare anyone to go into a Cuban bar in Florida and shout Viva Che!

In spite all of that, there are some interesting points that the article makes.
09-22-2009, 08:26 AM   #3
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I am certainly no shill for the RIAA, and, well, straddle the line when it comes to using copyright as a weapon, but shouldn't we photographers of all people be at least a little cognizant of the concept of copyright?
09-22-2009, 08:31 AM   #4
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am i making money from this posting

am i claiming it as my own

am i stealing money from the supposed sale of 3 year old back issue of a magazine i dont have a clue about (har har har)

i guess we should burn down libraries and pull the plug on the internet..

copyright

HA

you want copy right?

that K200D banner you have, did YOU make it? Or did you just copy an image tag?

09-22-2009, 08:35 AM   #5
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QuoteOriginally posted by Gooshin Quote
am i making money from this posting

am i claiming it as my own

am i stealing money from the supposed sale of 3 year old back issue of a magazine i dont have a clue about (har har har)

i guess we should burn down libraries and pull the plug on the internet..

copyright

HA
All are irrelevant. Posting the article in full on a photography forum do not constitute fair use.

By your logic I could do whatever I wanted with any of your photographs, that you took 3 years ago as long as I was following your guidelines and you would have no problems with it. Great, can you send me all of your files?
09-22-2009, 08:36 AM   #6
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QuoteOriginally posted by mtroute Quote
All are irrelevant. Posting the article in full on a photography forum do not constitute fair use.
i'll let Adam decide on that one.


When you read an article at a dentist office, are you commiting a crime?

When you take a shit in your friends house, and he happens to have a magazine laying around and you read it, are you commiting a crime?

Public Newspapers that still sell for a dollar something are free on the internet!

Whats your beef?
09-22-2009, 08:41 AM   #7
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QuoteOriginally posted by mtroute Quote
By your logic I could do whatever I wanted with any of your photographs, that you took 3 years ago as long as I was following your guidelines and you would have no problems with it. Great, can you send me all of your files?
If you took my photographs and showed them to friends i would not object

If you took my photographs and used them in a brochure to generate income for yourself then i might object, assuming i found out.

how is that anything at all like what i said

09-22-2009, 10:28 AM   #8
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QuoteOriginally posted by Gooshin Quote
If you took my photographs and showed them to friends i would not object

If you took my photographs and used them in a brochure to generate income for yourself then i might object, assuming i found out.

how is that anything at all like what i said
What if I took all your photos and, while giving you credit, put them all throughout my fictional dental office. I am not selling them, I am just using them to decorate my office...Would that be ok. It meets all your requirements, and is just like putting the copy of home and garden on the waiting room table...

Or if I put them in your fiends shitter so you could enjoy them while taking care of your business.

Bear in mind I am not asking your permission to do any of this...

I don't really give a shit what you do with the article, that is not my point. The point is that someone somewhere put work into this article, and had a reasonable expectation that they would be able to decide how it was used, I don't think Harpers would be to thrilled that you had posted it for the world to read, without permission.

Don't you want the same control of your work?
09-22-2009, 10:37 AM   #9
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you want my opinion?

the way i view photography as a means to generate income, is that i get a job where i take photos and then i give those photos to whoever paid me for them and let them do whatever they want with them

the photos i have now, go ahead, do what you will with them, i posted them on the internet knowing full well that anyone could rip them

otherwise i just would not bother posting them

also, for your information, i did not make the scan of the article, a certain someone at a high education insitution did for the whole class to read

i'm just spreading the info

so really, this is a case of you having too big a stick shoved up your ass, take it out, and relax.

"paid for only" information is a dinasour approach, too many magazines are going out of business as it is, because people dont bother with hard copies

and if you dont provide your articles in online format, what then, the world should suffer because your company cant post their stuff?

hey, i dont see you heckling Nesster for his never ending (and god bless him) postings of all the old school Pentax advertisements

how is that any different?


also, how about when Ben posted scans of HIS work from old magazines... which were not his

were you there then, heckling on him?


QuoteOriginally posted by mtroute Quote
What if I took all your photos and, while giving you credit, put them all throughout my fictional dental office. I am not selling them, I am just using them to decorate my office...Would that be ok. It meets all your requirements, and is just like putting the copy of home and garden on the waiting room table...

Or if I put them in your fiends shitter so you could enjoy them while taking care of your business.

Bear in mind I am not asking your permission to do any of this...

I don't really give a shit what you do with the article, that is not my point. The point is that someone somewhere put work into this article, and had a reasonable expectation that they would be able to decide how it was used, I don't think Harpers would be to thrilled that you had posted it for the world to read, without permission.

Don't you want the same control of your work?

Last edited by Gooshin; 09-22-2009 at 10:46 AM.
09-22-2009, 11:07 AM   #10
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chill out dude, don't get so excited.

Right, what do the other guys postings have to do with anything. I didn't see them so I can't comment, but is they were from mags they were technically violating copyright.

as for your scan, The original scan, was fair use because it was used for "educational" purposes, you posting of the scan was not educational in the strictest sense.


QuoteQuote:
the way i view photography as a means to generate income, is that i get a job where i take photos and then i give those photos to whoever paid me for them and let them do whatever they want with them
But you are selling the copyright to your client. You now have no claim to them, which technically also means that you have to get permission to post any of them. They do however and have every right to control their use.

QuoteQuote:
the photos i have now, go ahead, do what you will with them, i posted them on the internet knowing full well that anyone could rip them
So because you don't care about your copyright, you assume others don't either?

edit:
QuoteQuote:
"paid for only" information is a dinasour approach, too many magazines are going out of business as it is, because people dont bother with hard copies
why should they when we can just read the illegal scans on the internet...

Listen I am not the copyright cops. But I hope that all photographers have a decent understanding of copyright and use that knowledge to protect their work should they choose but also to respect other photographers works.
09-22-2009, 11:14 AM   #11
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QuoteOriginally posted by mtroute:
Listen I am not the copyright cops. But I hope that all photographers have a decent understanding of copyright and use that knowledge to protect their work should they choose but also to respect other photographers works.
and my response,

QuoteOriginally posted by mtroute:
as for your scan, The original scan, was fair use because it was used for "educational" purposes, you posting of the scan was not educational in the strictest sense.
what exactly, is this "strictest sense"?

I am posting a piece of published literature that was so insightful that a professor thought well enough to share it with his or her students

i am simply extending my education upon those that wish to engage in it, in fact, i am giving to you for free which i have paid for!

if i have broken some sort of copyright law in the judicial courtroom lawyer speak sense, well, **** em, think of me as a rebel.

did you even READ the article, or did you reach straight for your whistle?
09-22-2009, 11:18 AM   #12
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Well this one sure sidetracked pretty fast
09-22-2009, 11:20 AM   #13
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QuoteOriginally posted by mtroute Quote
By your logic I could do whatever I wanted with any of your photographs, that you took 3 years ago as long as I was following your guidelines and you would have no problems with it.
Yep, you can do that with mine.

I'm not gonna be a greedy prick unless you're actually doing me some harm.
09-22-2009, 11:28 AM   #14
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QuoteOriginally posted by Gooshin Quote
and my response,



what exactly, is this "strictest sense"?

I am posting a piece of published literature that was so insightful that a professor thought well enough to share it with his or her students

i am simply extending my education upon those that wish to engage in it, in fact, i am giving to you for free which i have paid for!

if i have broken some sort of copyright law in the judicial courtroom lawyer speak sense, well, **** em, think of me as a rebel.

did you even READ the article, or did you reach straight for your whistle?

Yeah I read the article...so what.
09-22-2009, 11:31 AM   #15
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QuoteOriginally posted by mtroute Quote
Yeah I read the article...so what.
so, go play in the sandbox now, thanks.
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