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02-02-2010, 11:05 AM   #1
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A tiny fun bit on Gov't health care

This is just for fun. You do know the designers of the US PeeOn Care have a completly differant health care program too so maybe it ain't so funny.

'ST. JOHN'S, N.L. -- Newfoundland Premier Danny Williams will undergo heart surgery later this week in the United States.

Deputy premier Kathy Dunderdale confirmed the treatment at a news conference Tuesday, but would not reveal the location of the operation or how it would be paid for.

"He has gone to a renowned expert in the procedure that he needs to have done," said Ms. Dunderdale, who will become acting premier while Mr. Williams is away for three to 12 weeks.

"In consultation with his own doctors, he's decided to go that route."

Mr. Williams' decision to leave Canada for the surgery has raised eyebrows over his apparent shunning of Canada's health-care system.

"It was never an option offered to him to have this procedure done in this province," said Ms. Dunderdale, refusing to answer whether the procedure could be done elsewhere in Canada.

Mr. Williams, 59, has said nothing of his health in the media.

"The premier has made a commitment that once he's through this procedure and he's well enough, he's going to talk about the whole process and share as much detail with you as he's comfortable to do at that time," she said.

Ms. Dunderdale wouldn't say where in the U.S. Mr. Williams is seeking treatment.

A popular Progressive Conservative premier, Mr. Williams has also seen his share of controversy. During the 2008 federal election, Mr. Williams vehemently opposed the Conservative government, launching his "Anything But Conservative" -- which has been credited with keeping the Tories from winning any seats in the province.'


N.L. Premier Williams set to have heart surgery in U.S.

02-02-2010, 01:04 PM   #2
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Public relations gimmic

plain and simple AFAICT...
Only people w/ a lack of logic skills could not see this and treat it for any more than that.
BESIDES people (well usually well healed people) constantly travel to the doctors of their choice here.. including overseas...
Actually he should have been made to stay in his country for the service unless not available there.. Now that would be funny.......
nice to know that either 1) He has the private funds to pay for a $100,000 proceedure "out of pocket" or 2) Canada is corrupt enough to have the 'state" pay for it.... Also too funny.
02-02-2010, 01:58 PM   #3
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how is it corruption to have his government insurance pay for something in the US? If some treatment is required and it cannot be provided in Canada for some reason they will pay for you to have it done elsewhere.

There are also cases where a device or medication has not yet passed standards testing yet in Canada and in that case I think you would have to pay out of pocket, unless you also have some other private health insurance on top of the government one that covered such things.
02-02-2010, 02:10 PM   #4
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QuoteOriginally posted by BPT Quote
how is it corruption to have his government insurance pay for something in the US? If some treatment is required and it cannot be provided in Canada for some reason they will pay for you to have it done elsewhere.

There are also cases where a device or medication has not yet passed standards testing yet in Canada and in that case I think you would have to pay out of pocket, unless you also have some other private health insurance on top of the government one that covered such things.
Well I could go into "out of organization" sur charges as listed w/ most US insurers today. They may pay BUT at greatly reduced rates... Persuasion to stay" in their backyard" .......
I also did say "if not available there" as well.. Should take a few months of paper pushing here to make that stick...
I personally think that this is THE issue that should be pushed into the "public" option... Stay in your own country except at your expense.. Or buy your own darn insurance.. after all the taxes those MD's pay help support the system..
Thumbing your nose at your own system is just un--pick a country.
Emergencies excepted of course....
Where's the rabbit hole???
I BELIEVE in this case it is most likely not the availability but a choice....... a choice that he is picking... Remember conservatives want choice for everyone as long as they can afford it...
They just don't want to pay for people that have no choice.......
Every country has at least one doctor who ACTUALLY can practice good medicine.. or am I wrong?
I would be happy to hear from any US citizen that had their insurance company (normal ins plans please, no Cadillac plans (I worked for a health ins company and know that as long as you pay big buck for your ins you can get anything done practically) as most have plenty of limitation on this sort of thing)) pay "full boat" for a procedure that could just as easily been done here.. Please be honest here...
See our health ins system is sick and making people sicker every day......... though unfortunately the fear mongers have cowed most dissent.
Newsflash. This may be changing.................
http://www.statesman.com/news/content/news/stories/local/archive/1027medtourism.html
U.S. insurers consider sending patients overseas for cheaper treatment
They are not the only ones eyeing the bottom line. Some U.S. insurance companies — including Aetna and UnitedHealthcare — are considering paying for patients to go overseas for care, which could spark major growth in the medical travel industry. Wockhardt Hospitals officials said major insurers are requesting data that show how well the Indian company's hospitals treat patients, a sign that the insurers are investigating options in India.
One example is Hannaford, a self-insured grocery chain in New England and New York whose health plan is administered by Aetna. This year, in what Aetna calls a pilot program, Hannaford started giving employees the option of going to National University Hospital in Singapore for knee and hip replacements. Hannaford will waive the co-payment, saving the employee $2,500 to $3,000. Hannaford will also pay for the plane ticket.

Gotta love the system.........
The doctor will see you know..here's your plane ticket..........
Just an addition from the above article.............
Quests for care

Medical tourism isn't new. For decades, people from around the world have come to Houston, for example, in search of good doctors. Americans have long traveled within their country for specialized care — take U.S. Sen. Edward Kennedy, D-Mass., who went to North Carolina for surgery on a brain tumor.

And the American health care industry, like many businesses, is already outsourcing functions like reading X-rays to overseas providers.

Now, more and more Americans are traveling to countries like Singapore, Thailand and Costa Rica for medical procedures that are cheaper there than at home. Sometimes, they don't have insurance; sometimes, their insurance doesn't cover what they need.

"The American health care system has pushed itself into a corner where even the most routine care is not financially accessible for the average family," said Dr. Steven Tucker, an oncologist in Singapore who is president of the International Medical Travel Association, a nonprofit group of health care providers and medical travel agents.



Last edited by jeffkrol; 02-02-2010 at 02:30 PM.
02-02-2010, 02:18 PM   #5
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He's in Canada for God's sake, not Haiti. I can't believe that there is any technology, or physician skill levels that are available here that aren't available in Canada.
02-02-2010, 02:21 PM   #6
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The health care in Canada is provided by insurance. It is just government run insurance companies. There are also other companies that provide what is often termed extended health. Extended health is to provide the extras over the basic insurance the government gives you.

For me I have to pay a $108 premium (I think that what it is my wife sends the money in each month) for the basic government insurance and my work provides extended health.

If the procedure is available in Canada he would have to pay out of pocket as the government insurance wouldnt pay. The government insurance will pay only if he for some reason cannot get it done here in a reasonable time.
02-02-2010, 02:26 PM   #7
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QuoteOriginally posted by BPT Quote
The health care in Canada is provided by insurance. It is just government run insurance companies. There are also other companies that provide what is often termed extended health. Extended health is to provide the extras over the basic insurance the government gives you.

For me I have to pay a $108 premium (I think that what it is my wife sends the money in each month) for the basic government insurance and my work provides extended health.

If the procedure is available in Canada he would have to pay out of pocket as the government insurance wouldnt pay. The government insurance will pay only if he for some reason cannot get it done here in a reasonable time.
What's a reasonable time though? Before or after he's dead?
02-02-2010, 02:34 PM   #8
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QuoteOriginally posted by graphicgr8s Quote
What's a reasonable time though? Before or after he's dead?
That is what is related to reasonable time, before he would be in danger is a reasonable time. Where we run into problems is things like knee surgeries having a bad knee doesnt endanger your life so I have heard of fairly long waits.

In my Dad's case he needed dental surgion to remove his teeth due to work related factors. He worked in an area for 30 years with acid mist in the air, which caused his teeth to rot out of his mouth, it was recommended they be pulled by a dental surgeon rather then a regular dentist. He had a hell of a long wait, about 9 months.

02-02-2010, 02:46 PM   #9
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QuoteOriginally posted by BPT Quote
That is what is related to reasonable time, before he would be in danger is a reasonable time. Where we run into problems is things like knee surgeries having a bad knee doesnt endanger your life so I have heard of fairly long waits.

In my Dad's case he needed dental surgion to remove his teeth due to work related factors. He worked in an area for 30 years with acid mist in the air, which caused his teeth to rot out of his mouth, it was recommended they be pulled by a dental surgeon rather then a regular dentist. He had a hell of a long wait, about 9 months.
That's a ridiculously long wait. What if he was in pain? So anything other than life threatening you're going to wait? and wait?

Pretty much if I am deemed to need knee surgery within a week I could be having it.
02-02-2010, 02:47 PM   #10
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So what? I have some rich Republican friends that are currently in Mexico for some serious procedures that they feel are better performed there, and they can enjoy the beaches and warm climate. I haven't heard them squealing about poor American Healthcare, but using the same logic some of you are using, I guess they should.

So, while you are at it, tell me how it is that Americans with no Health Insurance are better off than those Canadians? I always thought that a guy with a Big Mac was better off than a guy dead in the alley from starvation....but you guys don't seem to think so? Too much Cannoli blocks arteries and slows brain function, so take your time in responding...I certainly understand!
Regards!
02-02-2010, 02:48 PM   #11
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QuoteOriginally posted by Rupert Quote
So what? I have some rich Republican friends that are currently in Mexico for some serious procedures that they feel are better performed there, and they can enjoy the beaches and warm climate. I haven't heard them squealing about poor American Healthcare, but using the same logic some of you are using, I guess they should.

So, while you are at it, tell me how it is that Americans with no Health Insurance are better off than those Canadians? I always thought that a guy with a Big Mac was better off than a guy dead in the alley from starvation....but you guys don't seem to think so? Too much Cannoli blocks arteries and slows brain function, so take your time in responding...I certainly understand!
Regards!
What the hell could be performed better in mexico? Medical or not.
02-02-2010, 02:50 PM   #12
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QuoteOriginally posted by graphicgr8s Quote
That's a ridiculously long wait. What if he was in pain? So anything other than life threatening you're going to wait? and wait?

Pretty much if I am deemed to need knee surgery within a week I could be having it.
He was in pain. Try having a constant toothache in several teeth for a year.
02-02-2010, 02:51 PM   #13
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QuoteOriginally posted by graphicgr8s Quote
What the hell could be performed better in mexico? Medical or not.
Oh I think, hard as it may be to achieve, they have us beat at government corruption.
02-02-2010, 02:54 PM   #14
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QuoteOriginally posted by graphicgr8s Quote
What the hell could be performed better in mexico? Medical or not.
I dont doubt that there are Americans getting surgery in other countries as a procedure is better in another country or not done at all in the US. I seem to remember some but cant remember the specifics.

As to Mexico I had always thought in general people went there because it was cheaper and had laxer laws for some cosmetic procedures etc
02-02-2010, 03:35 PM   #15
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C'mon people, think about this.
Could it be that maybe, just maybe that the best surgeon for his particular ailment practices in the States and that he is lucky enough to be able to afford it?
Wouldn't any of you travel to another country if the best in that field practiced elsewhere?

Now I don't know about this particular case, but I do understand that if a Canadian is out of country and has to go to the hospital, the Canadian medicare system will reimburse you for what the same care would cost in Canada. Which usually means that you will still get stuck with a hell of a bill if you're unlucky enough to need medical help in SOME other country like the States.

Now let me tell you what I think of our medical system in Canada because the truth is... I DON'T THINK ABOUT IT AT ALL.
I don't think about the cost, I don't think about what I will have to give up in life, I don't think about the care that I will get, and I certainly don't think about pre-existing conditions
So far I have had a partial knee replacement, herniated navel surgery, a few broken bones, and as we speak, am now recovering from ulna nerve surgery. In all, I couldn't have asked for better care or more qualified Doctors.

Over the last few months I have been sitting here watching CNN, reading papers being simply amazed (while rolling my eyes) at the discussions and debates the American people have been having over what I and probably most other Canadians consider a no brainer. It also saddens me that some of you will inevitably loose your house, your 401k,s, and lets not forget a few marriages while we're at it.

Carry on and good luck.
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