[wildman]

My guess is that attitude is not all that exceptional if the truth be known.

Doctors have had their own little private unregulated cottage industry going for years and know a good thing when they see it.

Because of their special status in society they don't normally speak out as individuals but look at the historical position of the AMA for instance - it's just fine if you want to socialize the payment and collection of our fees but only we doctors have the wisdom to set fees.

This guy's attitude is not all that exceptional - what's exceptional is expressing it.

---

Last edited by wildman; 04-02-2010 at 03:31 PM.

I'm betting he will regret his ignorance....sooner than later.
Regards!

He was on the news tonight. So far most of the calls are supportive of his stance. Remember, he's treating everyone with the same level of care. And he's only lost 3 patients.

[Artesian]

I wonder how this would play out in a more rural area and the nearest alternative being a 40 minute drive away. Oh wait, I can see it now - new legislation - No Patient Left Behind.

Well all I can say is that if Idid go to him with problems, I would not tell him I voted for Obama. One may come out with a girly voice.
A

[jeffkrol]

Obama health-care supporters: Democrats outraged by Florida doctor who tells Obama supporters to go elsewhere - OrlandoSentinel.com
"Doctor Jack's a true American patriot," said Dan Evans, 34, a Georgia truck driver who detoured from a delivery in Apopka to shake the doctor's hand only to find the medical office is closed on Friday afternoons..................
Sandra Boynton, 68, a retired Florida nurse now living in Idaho, described Cassell's sign as "repugnant" behavior.
"As a nurse, I was taught you don't refuse care to anyone based on anything that's your personal views," she said. "I simply cannot imagine any nurse behaving in this self-centered manner. This man is a disgrace to his profession."
.............................
Cassell's former medical partner in Eustis, urologist Dr. James Young, 57, a self-described liberal Democrat, said a patient's politics should be no more important to a doctor than his favorite baseball team.
"It'd be like me saying I'm not going to treat a Cubs fan," said Young, a lifelong fan of the St. Louis Cardinals. "There are a number of thoughtful doctors who feel like Jack and probably a like number who feel the exact opposite, but they're not going to put a sign on their door. As doctors, our chief concern should always be what's best for the patient.............................."

[Das Boot]

I have a feeling that all of the patients he loses, he'll gain back with the publicity. It's not unlike a place in our state capital city that has a confederate flag flying high and proud over his place of business (Maurice's BBQ) even though he gets a daily fine for it. I really don't care either way about the flag and personally I think his BBQ is average, but the guy gets a ton of business from the publicity. It will be the same thing here.

[Ratmagiclady]

Interesting what 'makes right' among some, eh?

I mean, hey, there was a part where we were supposed to want to vote *for* what this 'doctor' did?

Using the 'status quo' system some have been wanting?


I mean, really, is this what's left of 'Conservative logic?' "I'm going to use the old system to hurt you while I can so I can blame 'Obamacare' for not allowing me to later?"

[Das Boot]

RML, this is more of a special interest story than anything... There are plenty of other urologists in the Orlando area to take care of the offended. If this was in a small town or extreme rural area there would be a much bigger stink that I would think the POTUS couldn't ignore in one of his 20-30 weekly televised stump speeches.

[Artesian]

Interesting what 'makes right' among some, eh?

I mean, hey, there was a part where we were supposed to want to vote *for* what this 'doctor' did?

Using the 'status quo' system some have been wanting?


I mean, really, is this what's left of 'Conservative logic?' "I'm going to use the old system to hurt you while I can so I can blame 'Obamacare' for not allowing me to later?"

Dudette,
Have you forgotten this is still supposed to be a free country? If he wants to cut his customer base it's his perogative. That is the difference between democracy and fasicm, which is the way you lean.
A

---------- Post added 04-03-2010 at 09:53 PM ----------

RML, this is more of a special interest story than anything... There are plenty of other urologists in the Orlando area to take care of the offended. If this was in a small town or extreme rural area there would be a much bigger stink that I would think the POTUS couldn't ignore in one of his 20-30 weekly televised stump speeches.

I am surprised someone hasn't written a speech for his teleprompter already. I am sure it will happen sooner or later.
A

[causey]

Easy (easily ignorant) talk of fascism and communism is an insult to those who suffered under fascists and communist regimes. If anything defines totalitarian spirits, that's their dogmatic conviction they are right in matters of social and political matters.

[Artesian]

Easy (easily ignorant) talk of fascism and communism is an insult to those who suffered under fascists and communist regimes. If anything defines totalitarian spirits, that's their dogmatic conviction they are right in matters of social and political matters.

I do not speak lightly of fascism or communism. Prior to becoming a fascist, Mussolini was a socialist. As far as I am concerned socialism is the beginning of fascism. It is well noted that liberals work in incriments towards socialism. Where are they going to stop?
A

[causey]

"If he wants to cut his customer base it's his prerogative. That is the difference between democracy and fascism, which is the way you lean."

Light as thin air.

About freedom of speech as a right... Rights are sustained by democracy, but not all rights are supportive of democracy (and freedom). Being free is, generally, being free to do whatever you want provided in doing so you don't interfere with the compossible spheres of freedom of the others. No matter how meaningless someone's words or actions, that person exercises his/her freedom as a right as long as s/he doesn't hurt (in the broadest sense) others. But meaningless, even nonsensical, stuff doesn't help either freedom or democracy.

Standing up for people who have been stripped of civil rights is an example of freedom of speech in a more robust sense--one that sustains freedom and democracy. Responsible, assumed freedom (of speech) means sacrificing something important (one's own valuables and or life) for the sake of the unfree. There are plenty of people in the US who really can't afford the same sense of dignity and entitlement as the others, nor are treated equally under the law, but thank God they aren't too visible (because powerless). (Fortunately, we get to watch 'courageous' groups of people defending liberties against the Big Islamic Socialist Guy.)

Now, you may think dr. Cassell's sign illustrates the second kind of freedom of speech. I beg to differ. He seems to act more for his own sake and for the sake of those who agree with him on a sensible political issue rather than against an obvious injustice. (If it were obvious, there wouldn't be so much disagreement.) I wonder if he would have displayed it if he had anticipated consequences much worse than losing the few Democrat-leaning patients he had.

Freedom in the US is to a large extent a matter of "ME, ME, ME!!" Few realize how fortunate they are not to have to stand up (and how many would then?) for basic rights. Few realize that "what's rightfully mine" actually depends on the structure of the society in which they live. In another kind of society (e.g., one of hunters and gatherers) much less, if anything, would be theirs. The basic structure of the society rests on social agreement, which nowadays isn't regarded as something of any importance. It's only about "me and what I deserve according to my rights."

I'd say one has as many rights as those one would be ready to claim in front of a military weapon. The other 'rights' are either gifts or delusions. "Live free or die" shouldn't be just a car banner proudly exhibited by the ungrateful (because ignorant).

[jeffkrol]

I do not speak lightly of fascism or communism. Prior to becoming a fascist, Mussolini was a socialist. As far as I am concerned socialism is the beginning of fascism. It is well noted that liberals work in incriments towards socialism. Where are they going to stop?
A

MAYBE you should read this while looking in the mirror. If your honest with yourself it may be an eye opener..then again maybe not:
An examination of Bush fascism
I'll start.......
1. Powerful and continuing expressions of nationalism: Catchy slogans, pride in the military, and demands for unity were common themes in expressing this nationalism. It was usually coupled with a suspicion of things foreign that often bordered on xenophobia

2. Disdain for the importance of human rights: Through clever use of propaganda, the population was brought to accept these human rights abuses by marginalizing, even demonizing, those being targeted. When abuse was egregious, the tactic was to use secrecy, denial, and disinformation.
Healthcare???
3. Identification of enemies/scapegoats as a unifying cause: The most significant common thread among these regimes was the use of scapegoating as a means to divert the people’s attention from other problems, to shift blame for failures, and to channel frustration in controlled directions.


6. A controlled mass media: Methods included the control of licensing and access to resources, economic pressure, appeals to patriotism, and implied threats. The leaders of the mass media were often politically compatible with the power elite.

8. Religion and ruling elite tied together: . Propaganda kept up the illusion that the ruling elites were defenders of the faith and opponents of the “godless.” A perception was manufactured that opposing the power elite was tantamount to an attack on religion.

9. Power of corporations protected: Members of the economic elite were often pampered by the political elite to ensure a continued mutuality of interests, especially in the repression of “have-not” citizens.

So who are the fascists......

The United States is not a fascist nation nor is the republican party a fascist party. The conclusion drawn here is that a small cadre of corporate elite have formed a fascist organization which has usurped the United States government through a questionable election and sympathetic court, installed their members in the top levels of the executive, diplomatic, and military offices, and have hijacked the nations policy to fit their fascist agenda. If actions are not taken to end and reverse this trend, the United States will meet the inevitable collapse met by all fascist regimes.
Counterpoint though if you look at Rowe and Cheny some disturbing tendencies are seen.
http://www.associatedcontent.com/article/39002/why_george_w_bush_is_not_a_fascist.html
I have no doubt that Bush was more of a figure head.......
What has since been defined by most political psychologists as an "authoritarian personality," this sense of sycophantic obedience towards higher authorties and sharing a common goal of statist supremacy are in staunch contradiction to the actions and beliefs of our current president..........
Fascism has been identified (by Marxists and intellectuals alike) as extreme right conservatism, based on the traditional values that are typically
associated with conservative thought. Fascism makes connections between the traditionally conservative and the extreme. Bush's neoliberalism falls on a more moderate scale of conservative liberalism. The association between typical conservatism (or mainstream American conservatism) and ethnocentrism/anti-Semitism does exist; however, it is not strong enough to correlate any connection with outright fascism...... Scarey huh.....just a matter of degrees.. ???
Finally, and perhaps the most widely known scale in assessing fascistic tendencies is the F-scale, or the implicit antidemocratic trends of potentiality for fascism scale. The F-scale measures implicit authoritarianism trends in personality, the same trends that render the personality susceptible to explicit fascist propaganda. The content of the F-scale is broken down to nine "syndromes" that indicate an affiliation with antidemocratic or fascistic trends. These "syndromes" or characteristics, are outlined as follows:
1. Conventionalism - as a rigid adherence to conventional middle-class values.
2. Authoritarian submissio - submissive, uncritical attitude toward idealized moral authorities of the ingroup.
3. Authoritarian aggression - a tendency to be on the lookout for, and to condemnt, reject, and punish people who violate conventional values.
4. Anti-intraception - an opposiiton to the subjective, the imaginative, the tender minded
5. Superstition and Stereotypy - the belief in mystical determinants of the individual's fate, the disposition to think in rigid categories.
6. Power and "Toughness" - a preoccupationwith the dominance-submission, strong-weak, leader-follower dimensions; identification with power figures; overemphasis upon the conventionalized attributes of the go; exaggerated assertion of strength and toughness.
7. Destructiveness and Cynicism - a generalized hostility, vilification of the human.
8. Projectivity - the disposiiton to believe that wild and dangerous things go on in the world; the projection outwards of unconcious emotional impulses.
9. Sex - exaggerated concern with sexual "goings-on."



Bush holds profits and capitalist gains to be the center of his values............. See red 9 above....

Scarey isn't it............ Liberalism, by it's very nature cannot be Fascist....

"Fascism should rather be called corporatism, as it is the merging of government and corporate power." --Benito Mussolini

"Fascism should rather be called corporatism, as it is the merging of government and corporate power." --Benito Mussolini

Well according to this The Big O is a fascist then.

[Rupert]

Well according to this The Big O is a fascist then.

If you ever learn how to read, you might be dangerous George. Staying ignorant of facts, as you do, renders you totally harmless.
Regards!

[jeffkrol]

Well according to this The Big O is a fascist then.

Lets try again shall we.....


2. Disdain for the importance of human rights: Through clever use of propaganda, the population was brought to accept these human rights abuses by marginalizing, even demonizing, those being targeted. When abuse was egregious, the tactic was to use secrecy, denial, and disinformation.

4. The supremacy of the military/avid militarism: Ruling elites always identified closely with the military and the industrial infrastructure that supported it. A disproportionate share of national resources was allocated to the military, even when domestic needs were acute

5. Rampant sexism: Beyond the simple fact that the political elite and the national culture were male-dominated, these regimes inevitably viewed women as second-class citizens. They were adamantly anti-abortion and also homophobic.

7. Obsession with national security: It was usually an instrument of oppression, operating in secret and beyond any constraints. Its actions were justified under the rubric of protecting “national security,” and questioning its activities was portrayed as unpatriotic or even treasonous.

http://www.secularhumanism.org/index.php?section=library&page=britt_23_2

Free Inquiry readers may pause to read the “Affirmations of Humanism: A Statement of Principles” on the inside cover of the magazine. To a secular humanist, these principles seem so logical, so right, so crucial. Yet, there is one archetypal political philosophy that is anathema to almost all of these principles. It is fascism. And fascism’s principles are wafting in the air today, surreptitiously masquerading as something else, challenging everything we stand for. The cliché that people and nations learn from history is not only overused, but also overestimated; often we fail to learn from history, or draw the wrong conclusions. Sadly, historical amnesia is the norm.....................Does any of this ring alarm bells? Of course not. After all, this is America, officially a democracy with the rule of law, a constitution, a free press, honest elections, and a well-informed public constantly being put on guard against evils. Historical comparisons like these are just exercises in verbal gymnastics. Maybe, maybe not.

http://www.themodernword.com/eco/eco_blackshirt.html
3. Irrationalism also depends on the cult of action for action's sake.

Action being beautiful in itself, it must be taken before, or without, reflection. Thinking is a form of emasculation. Therefore culture is suspect insofar as it is identified with critical attitudes. Distrust of the intellectual world has always been a symptom of Ur-Fascism, from Hermann Goering's fondness for a phrase from a Hanns Johst play ("When I hear the word 'culture' I reach for my gun") to the frequent use of such expressions as "degenerate intellectuals," "eggheads," "effete snobs," and "universities are nests of reds." The official Fascist intellectuals were mainly engaged in attacking modern culture and the liberal intelligentsia for having betrayed traditional values.................
6. Ur-Fascism derives from individual or social frustration.

That is why one of the most typical features of the historical fascism was the appeal to a frustrated middle class, a class suffering from an economic crisis or feelings of political humiliation, and frightened by the pressure of lower social groups. In our time, when the old "proletarians" are becoming petty bourgeois (and the lumpen are largely excluded from the political scene), the fascism of tomorrow will find its audience in this new majority.....................8. The followers must feel humiliated by the ostentatious wealth and force of their enemies.

When I was a boy I was taught to think of Englishmen as the five-meal people. They ate more frequently than the poor but sober Italians. Jews are rich and help each other through a secret web of mutual assistance. However, the followers of Ur-Fascism must also be convinced that they can overwhelm the enemies. Thus, by a continuous shifting of rhetorical focus, the enemies are at the same time too strong and too weak. Fascist governments are condemned to lose wars because they are constitutionally incapable of objectively evaluating the force of the enemy...............
Because of its qualitative populism, Ur-Fascism must be against "rotten" parliamentary governments. Wherever a politician casts doubt on the legitimacy of a parliament because it no longer represents the Voice of the People, we can smell Ur-Fascism .,,,,,,,,,Franklin Roosevelt's words of November 4, 1938, are worth recalling: "If American democracy ceases to move forward as a living force, seeking day and night by peaceful means to better the lot of our citizens, fascism will grow in strength in our land." Freedom and liberation are an unending task.
I know the reading must be stressful by now but one more............
The merger of the Republican party with the right-wing religious evangelism of Pat Robertson and Jerry Falwell; the supreme exaltation of the executive branch of government initiated by Nixon, Reagan and Bush; the congressional acquiescence in extraordinary powers to the presidency; the 'voluntary' censorship of the press; the suspension of civil rights; the retraction of the fourth amendment; the isolation from constitutional protection for targeted segments of society; the systematic insinuation of civilians into domestic espionage; the use of torture in prisons; the perversion of the concept of American patriotism to mean nothing more than political support for the president; the reduction of government to military and police operations; the implementation of vast secret police forces; engagement in ill-defined foreign wars; tax cuts for the rich; dissolution of domestic social programmes; merger of state and Christian church; deletion of women's rights to terminate pregnancies; legalization of marital rape, incest and domestic violence; scientific confirmation of the intellectual inferiority of racial groups; ; racial discrimination in law enforcement and criminal justice; repeal of environmental protection laws and the dissolution of the EPA; large scale timber felling and mineral exploitation in national parks by private corporations; the political implosion of the Democratic Party - Sound familiar? If so, then imagine that somewhere in America , a single solitary visionary at work alone in his garret produced a novel based on the scenario above. Now imagine the date: 1996. Jonathan Westminster has done precisely that.
http://www.oldamericancentury.org/15_solution.htm
It's only a fictional book.........!!!!!!!!
http://www.greanvillepost.com/?p=3922
This is the second installment of a project that is likely to extend over a two-year-period from January, 2010. It is the serialization of a book entitled “The 15% Solution: A Political History of American Fascism, 2001-2022.” Under the pseudonym Jonathan Westminster, it is purportedly published in the year 2048 on the 25th Anniversary of the Restoration of Constitutional Democracy in the Re-United States. It was actually published in 1996 by the Thomas Jefferson Press,