EVF - makes you sick?

ChristianRock · 07-06-2015, 07:55 AM

Originally posted by DeadJohn

It's not just analog synths; the Yamaha DX7 is back in style and that's as digital-sounding as it gets.

I think you can make a case for computer-based software synths, but DX7? Seriously? Does anyone other than Brian Eno actually program one, and mainstream electronic music artists at that? That's the first time I hear this (FM8 on the other hand has a considerable user base but not nearly as much as software Virtual Analogs).

And yeah this has nothing to do with photography

I do believe some people (who actually use cameras daily for work) will try EVFs but a number of them will go back to OVFs. Quite a few won't make the switch unless EVFs change a lot from where they are now. That's of course just my opinion.

**hjoseph7** · 07-06-2015, 09:45 AM

People might find it odd, but I feel sick when I use the Blur tool in Photoshop...

Big Dave · 07-09-2015, 10:59 AM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by THoog

I've heard of headaches, not so much nausea - it wouldn't surprise me if you were trying to track action with a laggy EVF (because of the mismatch between what your eye is seeing and your inner ear is sensing), but the A7 VF is supposed to be really good, so I am puzzled.

I don't think that most of the comments made here are bases on experience with current technology. EVF's have vastly improved in the last few years. I don't have any problems with my Pentax OVF or my Sony A7 series cameras. I did pull my K5II out the other day, to update the firmware. The finder seemed so dark in my office, compared to my A7II. It took me about a week to get used to progressive eyeglasses. Maybe this is the case with some folks, Or maybe they are just to old to accept new ideas.

tim60 · 07-09-2015, 01:06 PM

I have heard of an odd effect in full immersion flight simulators where if there is even a few microsecond error between the visual display and the physical sensations even seasoned pilots get symptoms of airsickness.

Maybe there is a tiny delay between movement of the camera, felt by you, and the visual cue.

I might see one of my aviator colleagues and ask again about this.

philbaum · 07-09-2015, 04:46 PM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by Big Dave

I don't think that most of the comments made here are bases on experience with current technology. EVF's have vastly improved in the last few years. I don't have any problems with my Pentax OVF or my Sony A7 series cameras. I did pull my K5II out the other day, to update the firmware. The finder seemed so dark in my office, compared to my A7II. It took me about a week to get used to progressive eyeglasses. Maybe this is the case with some folks, Or maybe they are just to old to accept new ideas.

I don't want to embarass anyone but i think you're right. EVFs enable technology that makes things better for the photographer. I noticed with my older Nex6, that if i have it in Manual mode and also have parameters that result in a dark image in the VF/LCD, when i press the shutter, It will momentarily brighten the EVF or LCD screen until focus is obtained, and then return to my too-dark settings. I think thats cool programming for the camera.

**Rondec** · 07-11-2015, 04:03 AM

Originally posted by Big Dave

I don't think that most of the comments made here are bases on experience with current technology. EVF's have vastly improved in the last few years. I don't have any problems with my Pentax OVF or my Sony A7 series cameras. I did pull my K5II out the other day, to update the firmware. The finder seemed so dark in my office, compared to my A7II. It took me about a week to get used to progressive eyeglasses. Maybe this is the case with some folks, Or maybe they are just to old to accept new ideas.

I haven't used the most recent ones, but I would say that some people are a lot more sensitive than others. I never could play 3D games, even when I was a lot younger, as I got motion sick quickly. I don't know if over time I could get used to it, I just have never felt the need to do so when there are nice OVFs that seems to take care of things pretty well.

discharged · 07-22-2015, 01:49 AM

Originally posted by Big Dave

I don't think that most of the comments made here are bases on experience with current technology. EVF's have vastly improved in the last few years. I don't have any problems with my Pentax OVF or my Sony A7 series cameras. I did pull my K5II out the other day, to update the firmware. The finder seemed so dark in my office, compared to my A7II. It took me about a week to get used to progressive eyeglasses. Maybe this is the case with some folks, Or maybe they are just to old to accept new ideas.

Even if most comments are not made based on experience with current technology the thread start is. That an EVF can be better than an OVF in many situations was never the base of discussion. we all know the (and now I must say theoretical) benefits of an EVF. (The reason being that I would probably puke before I got any benefit from it). But there is a problem and I would suggest that you atleast try it before you buy it.

**RobA_Oz** · 07-22-2015, 02:37 AM

I don't think it helps to make snarky comments about age. I've only recently started using a mirrorless compact with an EVF (in spite of my age) and the first observation I'll make is that an EVF can only be as good as the sensor that feeds it the data. The 2/3" sensor on the X30 allows for quite good EVF viewing in bright light, but low light results in a blotchy, high contrast image, somewhat like the sensor produces. Obviously, a sensor with larger sensels will result in a better EVF image, but electronic enhancement to make a dark scene look like daylight is always going to look odd, even if it doesn't make me feel sick.

philbaum · 07-22-2015, 08:40 AM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by RobA_Oz

I don't think it helps to make snarky comments about age. I've only recently started using a mirrorless compact with an EVF (in spite of my age) and the first observation I'll make is that an EVF can only be as good as the sensor that feeds it the data. The 2/3" sensor on the X30 allows for quite good EVF viewing in bright light, but low light results in a blotchy, high contrast image, somewhat like the sensor produces. Obviously, a sensor with larger sensels will result in a better EVF image, but electronic enhancement to make a dark scene look like daylight is always going to look odd, even if it doesn't make me feel sick.

Rob, i agree that in low light, EVFs, at least the ones i have, can look rough. But the alternative is OVFs that one can't see thru at all in low light. About a year ago, 3 of us from a photo club met in a well lit cafe to look at 2 A7 type cameras. I brought my K3 for comparison. I was amazed at how dingy my OVF was compared to the EVFs of the A7r and A7S that were there. I just don't think that OVFs are the future of cameras. I use both EVFs and my K3 OVF on an almost weekly basis. I prefer EVFs frankly. But people should buy what they want.

ChristianRock · 07-27-2015, 09:38 AM

I have tried Sonys (including RX100 MkIII and A7II), Fujis (X100T, XE2), Olympus (EM5 MkII, EM10), Panasonic (I think it was the GH4), as I stated previously. None for a long period of time - didn't take me that long to find out I wasn't going to buy any of them. I'm 44 years old. Hopefully I'm not senile yet, and I don't think I have "hey kids get out of my lawn" syndrome. But I like OVFs better. I hope that's ok with you guys.

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07-06-2015, 07:55 AM	#31
ChristianRock Pentaxian Join Date: Jul 2013 Location: People's Republic of America Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 9,910	Originally posted by DeadJohn It's not just analog synths; the Yamaha DX7 is back in style and that's as digital-sounding as it gets. I think you can make a case for computer-based software synths, but DX7? Seriously? Does anyone other than Brian Eno actually program one, and mainstream electronic music artists at that? That's the first time I hear this (FM8 on the other hand has a considerable user base but not nearly as much as software Virtual Analogs). And yeah this has nothing to do with photography I do believe some people (who actually use cameras daily for work) will try EVFs but a number of them will go back to OVFs. Quite a few won't make the switch unless EVFs change a lot from where they are now. That's of course just my opinion.

07-06-2015, 09:45 AM	#32
hjoseph7 Site Supporter Join Date: May 2014 Location: Minnesota Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 2,047	People might find it odd, but I feel sick when I use the Blur tool in Photoshop...

07-09-2015, 10:59 AM - 1 Like	#33
Big Dave Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: San Antonio, Texas Photos: Gallery Posts: 547	Originally posted by THoog I've heard of headaches, not so much nausea - it wouldn't surprise me if you were trying to track action with a laggy EVF (because of the mismatch between what your eye is seeing and your inner ear is sensing), but the A7 VF is supposed to be really good, so I am puzzled. I don't think that most of the comments made here are bases on experience with current technology. EVF's have vastly improved in the last few years. I don't have any problems with my Pentax OVF or my Sony A7 series cameras. I did pull my K5II out the other day, to update the firmware. The finder seemed so dark in my office, compared to my A7II. It took me about a week to get used to progressive eyeglasses. Maybe this is the case with some folks, Or maybe they are just to old to accept new ideas.

07-09-2015, 01:06 PM	#34
tim60 Pentaxian Join Date: Apr 2011 Photos: Albums Posts: 8,746	I have heard of an odd effect in full immersion flight simulators where if there is even a few microsecond error between the visual display and the physical sensations even seasoned pilots get symptoms of airsickness. Maybe there is a tiny delay between movement of the camera, felt by you, and the visual cue. I might see one of my aviator colleagues and ask again about this.

07-09-2015, 04:46 PM - 1 Like	#35
philbaum Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Port Townsend, Washington State, USA Posts: 3,659	Originally posted by Big Dave I don't think that most of the comments made here are bases on experience with current technology. EVF's have vastly improved in the last few years. I don't have any problems with my Pentax OVF or my Sony A7 series cameras. I did pull my K5II out the other day, to update the firmware. The finder seemed so dark in my office, compared to my A7II. It took me about a week to get used to progressive eyeglasses. Maybe this is the case with some folks, Or maybe they are just to old to accept new ideas. I don't want to embarass anyone but i think you're right. EVFs enable technology that makes things better for the photographer. I noticed with my older Nex6, that if i have it in Manual mode and also have parameters that result in a dark image in the VF/LCD, when i press the shutter, It will momentarily brighten the EVF or LCD screen until focus is obtained, and then return to my too-dark settings. I think thats cool programming for the camera.

07-11-2015, 04:03 AM	#36
Rondec Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Gladys, Virginia Photos: Gallery Posts: 27,653	Originally posted by Big Dave I don't think that most of the comments made here are bases on experience with current technology. EVF's have vastly improved in the last few years. I don't have any problems with my Pentax OVF or my Sony A7 series cameras. I did pull my K5II out the other day, to update the firmware. The finder seemed so dark in my office, compared to my A7II. It took me about a week to get used to progressive eyeglasses. Maybe this is the case with some folks, Or maybe they are just to old to accept new ideas. I haven't used the most recent ones, but I would say that some people are a lot more sensitive than others. I never could play 3D games, even when I was a lot younger, as I got motion sick quickly. I don't know if over time I could get used to it, I just have never felt the need to do so when there are nice OVFs that seems to take care of things pretty well.

07-22-2015, 01:49 AM	#37
discharged Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2014 Location: viking country Photos: Albums Posts: 276 Original Poster	Originally posted by Big Dave I don't think that most of the comments made here are bases on experience with current technology. EVF's have vastly improved in the last few years. I don't have any problems with my Pentax OVF or my Sony A7 series cameras. I did pull my K5II out the other day, to update the firmware. The finder seemed so dark in my office, compared to my A7II. It took me about a week to get used to progressive eyeglasses. Maybe this is the case with some folks, Or maybe they are just to old to accept new ideas. Even if most comments are not made based on experience with current technology the thread start is. That an EVF can be better than an OVF in many situations was never the base of discussion. we all know the (and now I must say theoretical) benefits of an EVF. (The reason being that I would probably puke before I got any benefit from it). But there is a problem and I would suggest that you atleast try it before you buy it.

07-22-2015, 02:37 AM	#38
RobA_Oz Site Supporter Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Tasmania, Australia Photos: Gallery Posts: 8,197	I don't think it helps to make snarky comments about age. I've only recently started using a mirrorless compact with an EVF (in spite of my age) and the first observation I'll make is that an EVF can only be as good as the sensor that feeds it the data. The 2/3" sensor on the X30 allows for quite good EVF viewing in bright light, but low light results in a blotchy, high contrast image, somewhat like the sensor produces. Obviously, a sensor with larger sensels will result in a better EVF image, but electronic enhancement to make a dark scene look like daylight is always going to look odd, even if it doesn't make me feel sick.

07-22-2015, 08:40 AM - 1 Like	#39
philbaum Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2007 Location: Port Townsend, Washington State, USA Posts: 3,659	Originally posted by RobA_Oz I don't think it helps to make snarky comments about age. I've only recently started using a mirrorless compact with an EVF (in spite of my age) and the first observation I'll make is that an EVF can only be as good as the sensor that feeds it the data. The 2/3" sensor on the X30 allows for quite good EVF viewing in bright light, but low light results in a blotchy, high contrast image, somewhat like the sensor produces. Obviously, a sensor with larger sensels will result in a better EVF image, but electronic enhancement to make a dark scene look like daylight is always going to look odd, even if it doesn't make me feel sick. Rob, i agree that in low light, EVFs, at least the ones i have, can look rough. But the alternative is OVFs that one can't see thru at all in low light. About a year ago, 3 of us from a photo club met in a well lit cafe to look at 2 A7 type cameras. I brought my K3 for comparison. I was amazed at how dingy my OVF was compared to the EVFs of the A7r and A7S that were there. I just don't think that OVFs are the future of cameras. I use both EVFs and my K3 OVF on an almost weekly basis. I prefer EVFs frankly. But people should buy what they want.

07-27-2015, 09:38 AM	#40
ChristianRock Pentaxian Join Date: Jul 2013 Location: People's Republic of America Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 9,910	I have tried Sonys (including RX100 MkIII and A7II), Fujis (X100T, XE2), Olympus (EM5 MkII, EM10), Panasonic (I think it was the GH4), as I stated previously. None for a long period of time - didn't take me that long to find out I wasn't going to buy any of them. I'm 44 years old. Hopefully I'm not senile yet, and I don't think I have "hey kids get out of my lawn" syndrome. But I like OVFs better. I hope that's ok with you guys.