eye level viewfinders are evil.

Emacs · 01-01-2015, 06:00 AM

It is easy: they force photogs into eye level composition trap, which in some cases can be plain wrong.
For instance, eye level shooting is wrong for torso and full length portraits with normal and wide angle lenses.

Rimfiredude · 01-01-2015, 06:19 AM

I always used a tlr when shooting weddings and portraits. Great for group shots but not so easy for a head and shoulders shot.

VisualDarkness · 01-01-2015, 07:10 AM - **2 Likes**

That's why you have knees and a back so you can go low even with an eye level finder.

dakight · 01-01-2015, 07:27 AM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by VisualDarkness

That's why you have knees and a back so you can go low even with an eye level finder.

You younger folks have knees and a back while some of us may have the appearance but little more. I've started taking a folding chair with me whenever it's feasible. Watching me get up from a kneeling or sitting on the ground position is not for the faint of heart. A tilt out liveview screen would be a godsend; that's the one thing from my Nikon bridge camera that I miss.

foto guy · 01-01-2015, 07:42 AM

Amazon.com : Seagull 1x-2x Right Angle Finder for Canon, Nikon, Pentax, Minolta, Fuji, Olympus and Leica SLR cameras : Camera Lens Diopters : Camera & Photo

dakight · 01-01-2015, 07:47 AM

Originally posted by foto guy

Amazon.com : Seagull 1x-2x Right Angle Finder for Canon, Nikon, Pentax, Minolta, Fuji, Olympus and Leica SLR cameras : Camera Lens Diopters : Camera & Photo

Actually, I have a Pentax right angle viewer that I modified to fit the K-50. It works very well, but it isn't particularly convenient to use.

**patrick9** · 01-01-2015, 08:05 AM

Originally posted by dakight

You younger folks have knees and a back while some of us may have the appearance but little more. I've started taking a folding chair with me whenever it's feasible. Watching me get up from a kneeling or sitting on the ground position is not for the faint of heart.

I can still remember back in the day, when I could just stand up from any position.

Flugelbinder · 01-01-2015, 08:05 AM

Originally posted by VisualDarkness

That's why you have knees and a back so you can go low even with an eye level finder.

I was going to say the same...

**jac** · 01-01-2015, 08:17 AM

Originally posted by dakight

You younger folks have knees and a back while some of us may have the appearance but little more. I've started taking a folding chair with me whenever it's feasible. Watching me get up from a kneeling or sitting on the ground position is not for the faint of heart. A tilt out liveview screen would be a godsend; that's the one thing from my Nikon bridge camera that I miss.

With the new hip I'm quite comfortable kneeling, prone or standing. It's that mid-range when those damned kids (anyone under fifty) ask me if I need help that annoy me.

But I still like to get the lower angle wherever possible.

VisualDarkness · 01-01-2015, 08:25 AM

Still, a majority of the photographers can use an eye-level finder that way so to say that "they force photogs into eye level composition trap" is simply plain wrong for most.

**csa** · 01-01-2015, 08:55 AM

"Originally posted by VisualDarkness

That's why you have knees and a back so you can go low even with an eye level finder.

I was going to say the same...

"

Not all of us can use our knees and back readily! I have a fractured #7 vertebrae that then collapsed in my back, and both knees are bone on bone. I absolutely cannot get down on my knees, period!!!

However, I still enjoy my photography immensely! One must make do, with what they have!

Flugelbinder · 01-01-2015, 09:06 AM

Originally posted by csa

...Not all of us can use our knees and back readily! I have a fractured #7 vertebrae that then collapsed in my back, and both knees are bone on bone. I absolutely cannot get down on my knees, period!!!

However, I still enjoy my photography immensely! One must make do, with what they have!

...

I'm very sorry to hear that, however, my post was directed towards the OP's statement that "...they force photogs into eye level composition trap...".

dakight · 01-01-2015, 09:38 AM

It the same thing that left handed people often have to overcome; many tools are designed to be used right handed and to use them left handed often requires extraordinary adaptability that sometimes borders on the comical. Incidentally, a camera is one of those tools, particularly when used at eye-level.

Those of us with more limited physical abilities have to learn to adapt but the point of my remark above is that just saying "use your back and knees" doesn't work with everyone. Obviously there are ways to get around such limitations, but it does require adaptability, imagination and motivation and is not always as simple as it appears on its face.

reh321 · 01-01-2015, 09:41 AM

Originally posted by csa

"Originally posted by VisualDarkness That's why you have knees and a back so you can go low even with an eye level finder.

I was going to say the same...

"

Not all of us can use our knees and back readily! I have a fractured #7 vertebrae that then collapsed in my back, and both knees are bone on bone. I absolutely cannot get down on my knees, period!!!

I guess we all age differently.

I have issues with my back such that it is much easier for me to get on my knees than for me to bend 90 degrees at the waist.
Today, 45 degrees isn't going to happen (I wish I knew how I offended it two daze ago!)

Originally posted by csa

However, I still enjoy my photography immensely! One must make do, with what they have!

Yes!
Yes!!
Yes!!!

VisualDarkness · 01-01-2015, 09:44 AM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by csa

"Originally posted by VisualDarkness That's why you have knees and a back so you can go low even with an eye level finder.

I was going to say the same...

"

Not all of us can use our knees and back readily! I have a fractured #7 vertebrae that then collapsed in my back, and both knees are bone on bone. I absolutely cannot get down on my knees, period!!!

However, I still enjoy my photography immensely! One must make do, with what they have!

What I was aiming at was the false statement that it "forces" you to shoot at eye-level, which is false for the big majority. It's like stating that waist level finders forces you to shoot from frog perspective, which is just as false. People should use whatever suits them and fills their needs the best but don't shoot down different finders with false statements.

01-01-2015, 06:00 AM	#1
Emacs Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2010 Location: Moscow Posts: 1,223	eye level viewfinders are evil. It is easy: they force photogs into eye level composition trap, which in some cases can be plain wrong. For instance, eye level shooting is wrong for torso and full length portraits with normal and wide angle lenses.

01-01-2015, 09:06 AM	#12
Flugelbinder Veteran Member Join Date: Nov 2014 Location: Toronto - missing the ocean Posts: 466	Originally posted by csa ...Not all of us can use our knees and back readily! I have a fractured #7 vertebrae that then collapsed in my back, and both knees are bone on bone. I absolutely cannot get down on my knees, period!!! However, I still enjoy my photography immensely! One must make do, with what they have!... I'm very sorry to hear that, however, my post was directed towards the OP's statement that "...they force photogs into eye level composition trap...".

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01-01-2015, 06:19 AM	#2
Rimfiredude Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2014 Location: Washington Photos: Gallery Posts: 2,176	I always used a tlr when shooting weddings and portraits. Great for group shots but not so easy for a head and shoulders shot.

01-01-2015, 07:10 AM - 2 Likes	#3
VisualDarkness Veteran Member Join Date: Nov 2011 Location: Uppsala, Sweden Photos: Gallery Posts: 4,439	That's why you have knees and a back so you can go low even with an eye level finder.

01-01-2015, 07:27 AM - 1 Like	#4
dakight Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2014 Location: Phoenix, AZ Photos: Albums Posts: 1,216	Originally posted by VisualDarkness That's why you have knees and a back so you can go low even with an eye level finder. You younger folks have knees and a back while some of us may have the appearance but little more. I've started taking a folding chair with me whenever it's feasible. Watching me get up from a kneeling or sitting on the ground position is not for the faint of heart. A tilt out liveview screen would be a godsend; that's the one thing from my Nikon bridge camera that I miss.

01-01-2015, 07:42 AM	#5
foto guy Senior Member Join Date: Apr 2008 Location: Vernon, Connecticut Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 292	Amazon.com : Seagull 1x-2x Right Angle Finder for Canon, Nikon, Pentax, Minolta, Fuji, Olympus and Leica SLR cameras : Camera Lens Diopters : Camera & Photo

01-01-2015, 07:47 AM	#6
dakight Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2014 Location: Phoenix, AZ Photos: Albums Posts: 1,216	Originally posted by foto guy Amazon.com : Seagull 1x-2x Right Angle Finder for Canon, Nikon, Pentax, Minolta, Fuji, Olympus and Leica SLR cameras : Camera Lens Diopters : Camera & Photo Actually, I have a Pentax right angle viewer that I modified to fit the K-50. It works very well, but it isn't particularly convenient to use.

01-01-2015, 08:05 AM	#7
patrick9 Site Supporter Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: Murfreesboro Tennessee Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 3,458	Originally posted by dakight You younger folks have knees and a back while some of us may have the appearance but little more. I've started taking a folding chair with me whenever it's feasible. Watching me get up from a kneeling or sitting on the ground position is not for the faint of heart. I can still remember back in the day, when I could just stand up from any position.

01-01-2015, 08:17 AM	#9
jac Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Dec 2010 Location: Clyde River, Nunavut, Canada Posts: 2,364	Originally posted by dakight You younger folks have knees and a back while some of us may have the appearance but little more. I've started taking a folding chair with me whenever it's feasible. Watching me get up from a kneeling or sitting on the ground position is not for the faint of heart. A tilt out liveview screen would be a godsend; that's the one thing from my Nikon bridge camera that I miss. With the new hip I'm quite comfortable kneeling, prone or standing. It's that mid-range when those damned kids (anyone under fifty) ask me if I need help that annoy me. But I still like to get the lower angle wherever possible.

01-01-2015, 08:25 AM	#10
VisualDarkness Veteran Member Join Date: Nov 2011 Location: Uppsala, Sweden Photos: Gallery Posts: 4,439	Still, a majority of the photographers can use an eye-level finder that way so to say that "they force photogs into eye level composition trap" is simply plain wrong for most.

01-01-2015, 08:55 AM	#11
csa Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Aug 2014 Location: Montana mountains Posts: 10,133	"Originally posted by VisualDarkness That's why you have knees and a back so you can go low even with an eye level finder. I was going to say the same... " Not all of us can use our knees and back readily! I have a fractured #7 vertebrae that then collapsed in my back, and both knees are bone on bone. I absolutely cannot get down on my knees, period!!! However, I still enjoy my photography immensely! One must make do, with what they have!

01-01-2015, 09:38 AM	#13
dakight Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2014 Location: Phoenix, AZ Photos: Albums Posts: 1,216	It the same thing that left handed people often have to overcome; many tools are designed to be used right handed and to use them left handed often requires extraordinary adaptability that sometimes borders on the comical. Incidentally, a camera is one of those tools, particularly when used at eye-level. Those of us with more limited physical abilities have to learn to adapt but the point of my remark above is that just saying "use your back and knees" doesn't work with everyone. Obviously there are ways to get around such limitations, but it does require adaptability, imagination and motivation and is not always as simple as it appears on its face.

01-01-2015, 09:41 AM	#14
reh321 Pentaxian Join Date: Nov 2014 Location: South Bend, IN, USA Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 23,179	Originally posted by csa "Originally posted by VisualDarkness That's why you have knees and a back so you can go low even with an eye level finder. I was going to say the same... " Not all of us can use our knees and back readily! I have a fractured #7 vertebrae that then collapsed in my back, and both knees are bone on bone. I absolutely cannot get down on my knees, period!!! I guess we all age differently. I have issues with my back such that it is much easier for me to get on my knees than for me to bend 90 degrees at the waist. Today, 45 degrees isn't going to happen (I wish I knew how I offended it two daze ago!) Originally posted by csa However, I still enjoy my photography immensely! One must make do, with what they have! Yes! Yes!! Yes!!!

01-01-2015, 09:44 AM - 1 Like	#15
VisualDarkness Veteran Member Join Date: Nov 2011 Location: Uppsala, Sweden Photos: Gallery Posts: 4,439	Originally posted by csa "Originally posted by VisualDarkness That's why you have knees and a back so you can go low even with an eye level finder. I was going to say the same... " Not all of us can use our knees and back readily! I have a fractured #7 vertebrae that then collapsed in my back, and both knees are bone on bone. I absolutely cannot get down on my knees, period!!! However, I still enjoy my photography immensely! One must make do, with what they have! What I was aiming at was the false statement that it "forces" you to shoot at eye-level, which is false for the big majority. It's like stating that waist level finders forces you to shoot from frog perspective, which is just as false. People should use whatever suits them and fills their needs the best but don't shoot down different finders with false statements.