Smartphone Camera with a Q mount?

AtitG · 09-10-2015, 08:43 PM

I was wondering if there would be a market a such a camera. Other manufacturers like sony, olympus air and dxo one have made already cameras for phones with larger sensors but I think the Q's sensor is actually small enough to integrate it to the phone. Make a 35mm equivalent pancake kit lens and I think it would sell. Pentax previously had ties with samsung. The lenses are already there. What do you think?

Fogel70 · 09-10-2015, 09:29 PM

I don't see much point in this. By using a pancake lens, the lens will most likely be much slower than lenses used in most smartphones, so you would not gain much by using a larger sensor. And as Q mount has a register distance of 9.2 mm, the phone would be at least 15 mm thick without a lens attached, probably 20+ mm if using SR.

It would probably be better to design a detachable camera unit like other manufacturer have done, as most users don't want the extra bulk permanently on the phone.

Steve.Ledger · 09-11-2015, 01:52 AM - **1 Like**

What about a Q mount camera with integrated phone?

Sandy Hancock · 09-11-2015, 03:07 AM

The registration distance is way too big for a phone.

6BQ5 · 09-11-2015, 10:09 AM

Interesting idea! But, like @Fogel70 said above, I think Ricoh would have a better chance at making a stand alone sensor module like the Olympus Air that can be clipped onto the phone. This may sell better in Japan than elsewhere since the Q mount is not as popular as something like u4/3. It may help promote the mount, though, so it would be interesting indeed!

AtitG · 09-11-2015, 10:25 AM

I think that a company will eventually produce a phone camera with an interchangeable lens. As for the Q's registration distance, could they not make the mount collapsible/ telescoping, so that it only expands when in use.

---------- Post added 09-12-15 at 01:31 AM ----------

Or how about a phone with modules like the ricoh gxr. Insert a module with a q mount like the A12.

Fogel70 · 09-11-2015, 11:29 AM

Originally posted by AtitG

Or how about a phone with modules like the ricoh gxr. Insert a module with a q mount like the A12.

The way it's been done already is better as the lens unit can be used on any smartphone, and use wireless communication between camera unit and smartphone.

Using a interface like GXR is not as good as you need a custom design on the smartphone for the camera unit. Which means there will only be a limited numbers of smartphones that can be used with the lens unit.

I would not be too surprised if Ricoh comes out with something like WG-M1 that can be attached to a smartphone, and also be used stand alone.

Last edited by Fogel70; 09-11-2015 at 11:41 AM.

AtitG · 09-11-2015, 11:40 AM

But i feel that the modular design, compared to the add on design, will improve the handling and the integration of functions significantly. less time to start the camera for example and more secure fit.

---------- Post added 09-12-15 at 02:58 AM ----------

if somebody can pull it off, i think its ricoh plus samsung. Samsung have enough clout to sell such units, and has the phone and sensor technology. ricoh had experience with lens modules before, and they have the only established lens mount that will not look ridiculous on a phone. Not to mention that pentax and samsung built camera together before.

Na Horuk · 09-11-2015, 02:15 PM - **1 Like**

How about the other way around - smart camera with a phone function? In Q mount. I'd buy it. I wouldn't even worry about how people look at me as I lift a camera to my ear and start talking.

Bophoto · 09-11-2015, 10:12 PM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by AtitG

I was wondering if there would be a market a such a camera. Other manufacturers like sony, olympus air and dxo one have made already cameras for phones with larger sensors but I think the Q's sensor is actually small enough to integrate it to the phone. Make a 35mm equivalent pancake kit lens and I think it would sell. Pentax previously had ties with samsung. The lenses are already there. What do you think?

I think it´s a small market and Sony and Olympus has already occupied it. And if the market grow, the phone company's come up with their own solution.

"Na Horuk said

How about the other way around - smart camera with a phone function? In Q mount. I'd buy it. I wouldn't even worry about how people look at me as I lift a camera to my ear and start talking."

The camera company's did a mistake for 5-10 years ago, they let the phone company´s take over the big compact camera market. I don´t understand why they did´t put in a simple or more advanced phone in some compact cameras. Perhaps 20% of today's smartphone owners should have a Pentax, Canikon and ... if only...

Yes I might bye a Q8 with a integrated smartphone that is just a little bigger than Q7. But that means that Pentax must come out with 2 or 3 Q models, one with a phone, one without a phone and hopefully one advanced model. But 3 different Q can be to much for Pentax?
I don´t now, but are a Richo GR Smart something for you?
I think that Richo can try with a WG6 Smart watertight to 10 meters, GPS, 4X zoom and smartphone. Active people out on adventure don´t want to carry so much so why have both a camera and a smartphone?

**RobA_Oz** · 09-11-2015, 10:37 PM

Originally posted by Sandy Hancock

The registration distance is way too big for a phone.

That assumes the lens is pointing the same way as a phone camera does now. Put a swivelling right-angle prism on it and the handling could be much more comfortable than the current mode of holding it up to eye height, whilst providing additional registration distance. It may require another lens in the body, because the registration distance would probably be too great, and it would be too big to fit in your pocket, but that's not to say it couldn't be done. Having said that, I think it would be a touch too "geeky" for most people. On the other hand, Holgas and Dianas sell quite well...

Fogel70 · 09-11-2015, 11:06 PM

Originally posted by Bophoto

I think it´s a small market and Sony and Olympus has already occupied it. And if the market grow, the phone company's come up with their own solution.

"Na Horuk said

How about the other way around - smart camera with a phone function? In Q mount. I'd buy it. I wouldn't even worry about how people look at me as I lift a camera to my ear and start talking."

The camera company's did a mistake for 5-10 years ago, they let the phone company´s take over the big compact camera market. I don´t understand why they did´t put in a simple or more advanced phone in some compact cameras. Perhaps 20% of today's smartphone owners should have a Pentax, Canikon and ... if only...

There are and have been smartphones with P&S camera built in, but the market is not interested in them so they sell poorly. FI Samsung S4 zoom or K zoom.

Quote:

Yes I might bye a Q8 with a integrated smartphone that is just a little bigger than Q7. But that means that Pentax must come out with 2 or 3 Q models, one with a phone, one without a phone and hopefully one advanced model. But 3 different Q can be to much for Pentax?
I don´t now, but are a Richo GR Smart something for you?
I think that Richo can try with a WG6 Smart watertight to 10 meters, GPS, 4X zoom and smartphone. Active people out on adventure don´t want to carry so much so why have both a camera and a smartphone?

The problem with smartphones is that they drain battery fast, so if you are out on the field you probably need to bring a battery bank with enough power so you can charge the unit every day. So you might not gain much in stuff you have to carry by combining a smartphone and camera.

To save battery by turning off the unit might not really an alternative, as it take at least 30 seconds for a smartphone to start. So you probably miss a lot of your shots by the time the camera is ready. So they will need to design the unit so the camera can still be used when the smartphone is turned off, but I don't think that has been the case with any of the smartphones with advanced cameras built in.

Steve.Ledger · 09-27-2015, 12:08 PM - **1 Like**

Originally posted by AtitG

..... less time to start the camera for example and more secure fit.

My cameras start faster than the camera apps on my phone...

Originally posted by Na Horuk

How about the other way around - smart camera with a phone function?.

Post #3

Nicolas06 · 11-01-2015, 06:29 AM

Yeah phone maker already tried bigger phones with a zoom. Issue is that it make the smartphone more fat and it doesn't sell that well. Sufficiently well for some model to exist, not enough for you or me to see people with one.

**monochrome** · 11-01-2015, 07:17 AM

I think the desire to make a smartphone truly competitive with a purpose-built camera is misguided.

I'm perfectly happy to carry a smartphone AND a Q / 01, so why would I want them integrated?

In fact, I'm perfectly happy to use my smartphone camera for grab shots. I can upload them to the web (even PF) seamlessly, they're automatically stored in the cloud, and they look good enough (for what they are) that using a free-standing camera would be counter-productive.

OTOH, if I know I'm taking a walk with the likely opportunity to make a 'keeper' or printable capture I can carry at least a Q and 3 lenses in a pouch, if not a full dSLR and lenses.

09-10-2015, 08:43 PM	#1
AtitG Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2014 Posts: 269	Smartphone Camera with a Q mount? I was wondering if there would be a market a such a camera. Other manufacturers like sony, olympus air and dxo one have made already cameras for phones with larger sensors but I think the Q's sensor is actually small enough to integrate it to the phone. Make a 35mm equivalent pancake kit lens and I think it would sell. Pentax previously had ties with samsung. The lenses are already there. What do you think?

09-11-2015, 11:06 PM	#12
Fogel70 Pentaxian Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Stockholm, Sweden Photos: Albums Posts: 3,062	Originally posted by Bophoto I think it´s a small market and Sony and Olympus has already occupied it. And if the market grow, the phone company's come up with their own solution. "Na Horuk said How about the other way around - smart camera with a phone function? In Q mount. I'd buy it. I wouldn't even worry about how people look at me as I lift a camera to my ear and start talking." The camera company's did a mistake for 5-10 years ago, they let the phone company´s take over the big compact camera market. I don´t understand why they did´t put in a simple or more advanced phone in some compact cameras. Perhaps 20% of today's smartphone owners should have a Pentax, Canikon and ... if only... There are and have been smartphones with P&S camera built in, but the market is not interested in them so they sell poorly. FI Samsung S4 zoom or K zoom. Quote: Yes I might bye a Q8 with a integrated smartphone that is just a little bigger than Q7. But that means that Pentax must come out with 2 or 3 Q models, one with a phone, one without a phone and hopefully one advanced model. But 3 different Q can be to much for Pentax? I don´t now, but are a Richo GR Smart something for you? I think that Richo can try with a WG6 Smart watertight to 10 meters, GPS, 4X zoom and smartphone. Active people out on adventure don´t want to carry so much so why have both a camera and a smartphone? The problem with smartphones is that they drain battery fast, so if you are out on the field you probably need to bring a battery bank with enough power so you can charge the unit every day. So you might not gain much in stuff you have to carry by combining a smartphone and camera. To save battery by turning off the unit might not really an alternative, as it take at least 30 seconds for a smartphone to start. So you probably miss a lot of your shots by the time the camera is ready. So they will need to design the unit so the camera can still be used when the smartphone is turned off, but I don't think that has been the case with any of the smartphones with advanced cameras built in. Last edited by Fogel70; 09-11-2015 at 11:16 PM.

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09-10-2015, 09:29 PM	#2
Fogel70 Pentaxian Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Stockholm, Sweden Photos: Albums Posts: 3,062	I don't see much point in this. By using a pancake lens, the lens will most likely be much slower than lenses used in most smartphones, so you would not gain much by using a larger sensor. And as Q mount has a register distance of 9.2 mm, the phone would be at least 15 mm thick without a lens attached, probably 20+ mm if using SR. It would probably be better to design a detachable camera unit like other manufacturer have done, as most users don't want the extra bulk permanently on the phone.

09-11-2015, 01:52 AM - 1 Like	#3
Steve.Ledger Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Far North Qld Posts: 3,301	What about a Q mount camera with integrated phone?

09-11-2015, 03:07 AM	#4
Sandy Hancock Moderator Site Supporter Join Date: Feb 2012 Location: Adelaide Hills, South Australia Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 11,272	The registration distance is way too big for a phone.

09-11-2015, 10:09 AM	#5
6BQ5 Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2013 Location: Nevada, USA Photos: Albums Posts: 3,348	Interesting idea! But, like @Fogel70 said above, I think Ricoh would have a better chance at making a stand alone sensor module like the Olympus Air that can be clipped onto the phone. This may sell better in Japan than elsewhere since the Q mount is not as popular as something like u4/3. It may help promote the mount, though, so it would be interesting indeed!

09-11-2015, 10:25 AM	#6
AtitG Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2014 Posts: 269 Original Poster	I think that a company will eventually produce a phone camera with an interchangeable lens. As for the Q's registration distance, could they not make the mount collapsible/ telescoping, so that it only expands when in use. ---------- Post added 09-12-15 at 01:31 AM ---------- Or how about a phone with modules like the ricoh gxr. Insert a module with a q mount like the A12.

09-11-2015, 11:29 AM	#7
Fogel70 Pentaxian Join Date: Sep 2009 Location: Stockholm, Sweden Photos: Albums Posts: 3,062	Originally posted by AtitG Or how about a phone with modules like the ricoh gxr. Insert a module with a q mount like the A12. The way it's been done already is better as the lens unit can be used on any smartphone, and use wireless communication between camera unit and smartphone. Using a interface like GXR is not as good as you need a custom design on the smartphone for the camera unit. Which means there will only be a limited numbers of smartphones that can be used with the lens unit. I would not be too surprised if Ricoh comes out with something like WG-M1 that can be attached to a smartphone, and also be used stand alone. Last edited by Fogel70; 09-11-2015 at 11:41 AM.

09-11-2015, 11:40 AM	#8
AtitG Senior Member Join Date: Jan 2014 Posts: 269 Original Poster	But i feel that the modular design, compared to the add on design, will improve the handling and the integration of functions significantly. less time to start the camera for example and more secure fit. ---------- Post added 09-12-15 at 02:58 AM ---------- if somebody can pull it off, i think its ricoh plus samsung. Samsung have enough clout to sell such units, and has the phone and sensor technology. ricoh had experience with lens modules before, and they have the only established lens mount that will not look ridiculous on a phone. Not to mention that pentax and samsung built camera together before.

09-11-2015, 02:15 PM - 1 Like	#9
Na Horuk Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2012 Location: Slovenia, probably Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 11,186	How about the other way around - smart camera with a phone function? In Q mount. I'd buy it. I wouldn't even worry about how people look at me as I lift a camera to my ear and start talking.

09-11-2015, 10:12 PM - 1 Like	#10
Bophoto Veteran Member Join Date: Dec 2006 Location: Sweden Photos: Gallery Posts: 429	Originally posted by AtitG I was wondering if there would be a market a such a camera. Other manufacturers like sony, olympus air and dxo one have made already cameras for phones with larger sensors but I think the Q's sensor is actually small enough to integrate it to the phone. Make a 35mm equivalent pancake kit lens and I think it would sell. Pentax previously had ties with samsung. The lenses are already there. What do you think? I think it´s a small market and Sony and Olympus has already occupied it. And if the market grow, the phone company's come up with their own solution. "Na Horuk said How about the other way around - smart camera with a phone function? In Q mount. I'd buy it. I wouldn't even worry about how people look at me as I lift a camera to my ear and start talking." The camera company's did a mistake for 5-10 years ago, they let the phone company´s take over the big compact camera market. I don´t understand why they did´t put in a simple or more advanced phone in some compact cameras. Perhaps 20% of today's smartphone owners should have a Pentax, Canikon and ... if only... Yes I might bye a Q8 with a integrated smartphone that is just a little bigger than Q7. But that means that Pentax must come out with 2 or 3 Q models, one with a phone, one without a phone and hopefully one advanced model. But 3 different Q can be to much for Pentax? I don´t now, but are a Richo GR Smart something for you? I think that Richo can try with a WG6 Smart watertight to 10 meters, GPS, 4X zoom and smartphone. Active people out on adventure don´t want to carry so much so why have both a camera and a smartphone?

09-11-2015, 10:37 PM	#11
RobA_Oz Site Supporter Join Date: Nov 2008 Location: Tasmania, Australia Photos: Gallery Posts: 8,197	Originally posted by Sandy Hancock The registration distance is way too big for a phone. That assumes the lens is pointing the same way as a phone camera does now. Put a swivelling right-angle prism on it and the handling could be much more comfortable than the current mode of holding it up to eye height, whilst providing additional registration distance. It may require another lens in the body, because the registration distance would probably be too great, and it would be too big to fit in your pocket, but that's not to say it couldn't be done. Having said that, I think it would be a touch too "geeky" for most people. On the other hand, Holgas and Dianas sell quite well...

09-27-2015, 12:08 PM - 1 Like	#13
Steve.Ledger Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Far North Qld Posts: 3,301	Originally posted by AtitG ..... less time to start the camera for example and more secure fit. My cameras start faster than the camera apps on my phone... Originally posted by Na Horuk How about the other way around - smart camera with a phone function?. Post #3

11-01-2015, 06:29 AM	#14
Nicolas06 Veteran Member Join Date: Nov 2013 Posts: 4,854	Yeah phone maker already tried bigger phones with a zoom. Issue is that it make the smartphone more fat and it doesn't sell that well. Sufficiently well for some model to exist, not enough for you or me to see people with one.

11-01-2015, 07:17 AM	#15
monochrome Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Working From Home Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 26,276	I think the desire to make a smartphone truly competitive with a purpose-built camera is misguided. I'm perfectly happy to carry a smartphone AND a Q / 01, so why would I want them integrated? In fact, I'm perfectly happy to use my smartphone camera for grab shots. I can upload them to the web (even PF) seamlessly, they're automatically stored in the cloud, and they look good enough (for what they are) that using a free-standing camera would be counter-productive. OTOH, if I know I'm taking a walk with the likely opportunity to make a 'keeper' or printable capture I can carry at least a Q and 3 lenses in a pouch, if not a full dSLR and lenses.