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03-11-2019, 10:39 PM   #271
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Thank you for sharing this. Thanks for sharing this. It's nice to read the discussion there (with the help of Google Translate) rather than second hand over here. Seems much of the information that is only coming to light here on PF was discussed years ago on that forum.

There is also a thread on the K-70 with photos that shows the K-70 uses a redesigned diaphragm control block but with an identical or similar solenoid as the K-30/50/KS-1/2.

03-12-2019, 04:12 AM   #272
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QuoteOriginally posted by useK30witheneloops Quote
Bought my K-30 on the famous platform, after a while the typical aperture problems appeared...first frustration....

...found the instructions of changing the green selenoid to the white one... opened up the camera.... damn...second frustration...it already had the white one...

...I gave up hope, it seemed that I had to accept that I've been cheated...

....then...thanks to a post on a german pentax-site...I found the advice to take eneloops within the battery holder instead of the block-battery -because there are some further electronic issues expected, not only the selenoid-
well, as a German you can read ... and translate what was written:

One member guesses (!) that he recalls (and later refers to) a comment he read here on pentaxforum.com i.e. the comment #502 by Jeff Lopez.

It is the guessing of somebody who never opened a Pentax K30 or similar.
Maybe you can post a photo of it so we can see which white solenoid was in this K30?

And maybe then you can also show us where there is this capacitor which might have gone off?

Strange thing is: if a capacitor is off or not working anymore, why then does it work with Eneloops?

And even more strange: Most Pentax DSLR bodies with a failing green made in China solenoid catch this problem with low shuttercount. All the sudden they don't work anymore.

But alas....even much more simply:

If one inspects the Diaphragm Control Block :
Where the heck can you detect an condensor there? One could searched with a magnifying glass: No capacitor either.

On its back side? BAD LUCK . No condensor.

I have 5 diaphragm Control Blocks here, so even statistics prove: No condensor. Not even an homeopathic dose.


So for a long time Pentax/Ricoh has repaired the shutter-problem via replacement of exactly this complete diaphragm-control-block (including the solenoid)
..... and the bloody thing worked... for a time, usually about a year and of course we only know of the reported cases where it went wrong again.

Why would it work for about 1 year and then fail again?
If there is a damaged power-supply or a damaged condensor it would not work anymore right away... right?


And why did the white made in Japan solenoid never go wrong in any of the pre K-30 DLSR cameras?
And in the K20D and K10D it was fed with a Li-Ion battery, not Eneloops!

As well as in the K-r, which was the first of the consumer series which could use Li-Ion.

The K-r had the white solenoid built in.

Well, I made once the test, I took out the white solenoid and built in the sanded green solenoid which had failed in a K30. I had tested it working in the K30 and then for fun it went into the K-r: The K-r right away produced mirror-flop! So I built a white made in Japan solenoid back in, it was alright again.

And why to all K30/50/500/K-S1/K-S2 etc. all the sudden work perfectly right with the white solenoid?
Well, of course except yours.

But maybe it wasn't a white solenoid from a DSLR but from a CD-Rom drive!

Last edited by photogem; 03-12-2019 at 08:22 AM.
03-12-2019, 10:00 AM   #273
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Hello photogem,

thank you for your interesting explanations.

I'm sorry, but I can't post a photo of the solenoid that was built in as I was finally happy that I could put everything together again, without a screw or spring left over .

I just posted my happiness and astonishment about the pleasure, that my K-30 suddenly started working again when I used those eneloops instead of the block-battery.
Of course I don't know how long this pleasure will last until the hangover... But I just wanted others to take part, if they like.
Someone asked for the links where I got the information and I gave it. I can't rate them. I'm not an electronics engineer. It is up to each one himself what benefit he takes of that.
I have read it, tested, and it works (for the moment). I enjoy this moment.

Thanks for your help and informations.
Have a sunny time.
03-17-2019, 02:48 AM   #274
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Thank you SO much for this master post.
I have a Pentax K30 (about 5 years old) with a kit 18-135 lens. Just recently, I have been getting an inexplicable dark photo problem for the first shot taken but second and subsequent shots are correctly exposed.

I did the tests you set out using my Sigma 100-300 which has a A setting on the aperture ring. I tend to frequently use the TAv setting. The readings of the camera's chosen ISO are the same although the resulting shot is extremely different. It only happens for the first shot after the camera has been off for a while. If i turn the camera off then on again shortly after, the shot is correct. But if say 10 minutes have passed, the first shot is very dark but the second and subsequent are fine again.
It seems to indicate my problem may be the first stages of aperture block and that it will only get worse. Is this correct?

I LOVE my camera and don't really want another one... but sadly think it might be coming. I have just left my home country for a year overseas. Bad timing.

What are your thoughts?

Thanks so much
Kerri-Ann

03-17-2019, 05:33 AM   #275
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The problem will get worse in time.


Of course for the time being you can try using "AA-Eneloop" batteries with an AA-Adapter such as this one
or this one

But in many cases I know of the problem did return. The longer one uses the Pentax with a damaged solenoid the more you take a risk that it will be beyond a permanent repair. Every time the camera fires and the solenoid stays stuck it puts some strain to it because it tries to function but can't.


Where are you now? In USA?

We had a similar situatíon recently here and somebody offered to do the repair for a person.
Maybe you are lucky and find this kind of help as well.

Just make sure you have the "made in Japan" solenoid built in and not just another China made one!
The made in China one in many cases fails again.



Good luck!

Last edited by photogem; 03-18-2019 at 03:07 AM.
03-17-2019, 05:44 AM   #276
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QuoteOriginally posted by Kerri-Ann Quote
Thank you SO much for this master post.
I have a Pentax K30 (about 5 years old) with a kit 18-135 lens. Just recently, I have been getting an inexplicable dark photo problem for the first shot taken but second and subsequent shots are correctly exposed.

I did the tests you set out using my Sigma 100-300 which has a A setting on the aperture ring. I tend to frequently use the TAv setting. The readings of the camera's chosen ISO are the same although the resulting shot is extremely different. It only happens for the first shot after the camera has been off for a while. If i turn the camera off then on again shortly after, the shot is correct. But if say 10 minutes have passed, the first shot is very dark but the second and subsequent are fine again.
It seems to indicate my problem may be the first stages of aperture block and that it will only get worse. Is this correct?

I LOVE my camera and don't really want another one... but sadly think it might be coming. I have just left my home country for a year overseas. Bad timing.

What are your thoughts?

Thanks so much
Kerri-Ann
I believe that is the common experience. Initially the first image is dark, then the first two, then the first three, ... Using any AA-batteries will move the clock back, but eventually the problem will start with them also. In my case, I used Energizer and Duracell AA-batteries, but then in May the problems started; by November, so many uses of the aperture control (*) were needed to get one properly exposed photo (**) that I went to lenses with aperture ring only {and at the end of the month I purchased a KP, but I still use my K-30 with aperture rings on occasion}.


(*) Using the body's aperture control is all that is needed. As several have noted, using the DOF preview has the same effect as taking a photo

(**) The photos are not actually totally dark. If you read a "dark photo" into a PP program, you will discover that same kind of photo was taken, but the histogram is scrunched into the dark end, because the lens was f/22 {or whatever the smallest opening is}.
03-18-2019, 12:16 AM   #277
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thank you Photgem and reh321 for your particular responses, and for links to previous explanations - very helpful in understanding the issues.
I am now in France and of course don't want a failing camera.
Ironically, i left my AA battery adaptor and Li-AA batteries at home as a weight saving action and, being in a country with power all the time, I thought it wouldn't be a fall back option needed (as eg in remote Nepal or out bush in Oz for weeks)

That said... I am concerned by the implication in the threads that Pentax have this as a fatal problem across their range of DSLRs.

Should I be looking to replace by body with another Pentax? If so which one is closest to K30 (but with improved noise ) Are K30s sold new now or are they only re-conditioned ones?

Or should i be looking elsewhere for a whole new kit? (Nasty question on a Pentax forum i know..)

THANKS
Kerri-Ann
03-18-2019, 12:55 AM   #278
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Replacement of K30 or repair

You have those options:

Replacement with a second hand K5II or K5IIs (if you don't use the 55-300 PLM and are not going to use it!)

because those are pretty similar in size to your K30 but more robust and better in low-light.
I will never give away my own K5IIs. The K3 or K3II (no flash!) is larger, heavier and not really better but different. But allows the use of the PLM lens!
You can sell your broken K30 for around 80Euros on ebay France but make it available to the whole of Europe.
A 2nd. hand K5II can be found for around 300-350 Euros.


Repair: Do you feel you could do it yourself? If you don't have 2 left hands you might be able to.

The only Pentax APS-C bodies which do not have the solenoid but a stepper-motor are:
K7, K-01 (not an DSLR!) K5, K5II, K5IIs, K3, K3II, KP ( I would not recommend the K7)

Solenoid you find in:

K30/50/500, K-S1, K-S2, K70 (also in older ones but there you would be safe, but know now your K30, so the K5 is of similar but different quality,
the K5II is superior, as are the others of course.

As weight seems something you care about, be careful with the K3, it is bulkier and that bit more heavy. I can handle it but prefer the size of the K5 series.


Last edited by photogem; 03-18-2019 at 03:03 AM.
03-18-2019, 03:49 PM - 1 Like   #279
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QuoteOriginally posted by Kerri-Ann Quote
thank you Photgem and reh321 for your particular responses, and for links to previous explanations - very helpful in understanding the issues.
I am now in France and of course don't want a failing camera.
Ironically, i left my AA battery adaptor and Li-AA batteries at home as a weight saving action and, being in a country with power all the time, I thought it wouldn't be a fall back option needed (as eg in remote Nepal or out bush in Oz for weeks)

That said... I am concerned by the implication in the threads that Pentax have this as a fatal problem across their range of DSLRs.

Should I be looking to replace by body with another Pentax? If so which one is closest to K30 (but with improved noise ) Are K30s sold new now or are they only re-conditioned ones?

Or should i be looking elsewhere for a whole new kit? (Nasty question on a Pentax forum i know..)

THANKS
Kerri-Ann
The problem affects mostly K-30 and K-50 cameras, and rarely K-70 and some others. The K-3 / K-5 series does not suffer from this problem and neither does the K-1.
It's rumoured that the next Pentax APS-C camera model should be released in the not too distant future, so, if you do decide it's time to upgrade, then waiting may be an option, or you could consider the KP, which gets good reviews.
03-18-2019, 05:37 PM   #280
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I think it is still too soon to see if it affects the K70 since the K-S1 and K-S2 were apparently affected too. I personally will not buy a K-P either until I see some that are 5+ years old without any issues. My K-30 manifested the problem at around 5 years old with a relatively low shutter count.
03-18-2019, 07:37 PM   #281
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The German Pentaxians forum points out that the K-30/50 failures didn't start manifesting itself in significant numbers until after about 2 1/2 years. It was announced in June 2016 so we should be seeing something soon if the trend holds up. The K-S2 was announced in Feb 2015, while a number of failures have been reported nothing like what is seen for the K-30./50 but that could be due to total number of units sold.
03-18-2019, 09:27 PM   #282
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QuoteOriginally posted by stillshot2 Quote
I think it is still too soon to see if it affects the K70 since the K-S1 and K-S2 were apparently affected too. I personally will not buy a K-P either until I see some that are 5+ years old without any issues. My K-30 manifested the problem at around 5 years old with a relatively low shutter count.
The K-30/50/S2 cameras all use a solenoid to control the aperture. I have already purchased a KP because I am quite confident that it has the stepper motor aperture control which is in the K-7/5/3 {all those cameras - and the KP - have a bulge next to the K-mount}. I also remember - but cannot find right now - an interview in which a Pentax representative affirmed that the KP's aperture control is different from control used by the K-30/50.
03-19-2019, 01:16 AM   #283
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QuoteOriginally posted by Not a Number Quote
The German Pentaxians forum points out that the K-30/50 failures didn't start manifesting itself in significant numbers until after about 2 1/2 years.
That is the problem when you use google translations, they can give odd translations.

In the EU and Switzerland there are 2 years warranty. So any failures would not have been made public because people sent their cameras back for warranty repair.
Actually Ricoh Germany extended this warranty usually a bit longer, so this is why the first complaints where made about 21/2 years after the K30 and K50 came out.


QuoteOriginally posted by Not a Number Quote
It (K70) was announced in June 2016 so we should be seeing something soon if the trend holds up. The K-S2 was announced in Feb 2015, while a number of failures have been reported nothing like what is seen for the K-30/50 but that could be due to total number of units sold.
Because the issue became known (particular with members of forums and those previously having owned K30/50's) first failures have been this time reported during warranty time, but of course repaired at Ricoh due to warranty. With most repairs it was stated that the solenoid had been changed!

---------- Post added 03-19-19 at 01:23 AM ----------

QuoteOriginally posted by reh321 Quote
The K-30/50/S2 cameras all use a solenoid to control the aperture. I have already purchased a KP because I am quite confident that it has the stepper motor aperture control which is in the K-7/5/3 {all those cameras - and the KP - have a bulge next to the K-mount}.
I have seen the KP open, it is a stepper-motor!


QuoteOriginally posted by reh321 Quote
I also remember - but cannot find right now - an interview in which a Pentax representative affirmed that the KP's aperture control is different from control used by the K-30/50.
I have an email from a Pentax representative stating it is as you say.
I have as well an email from the same representative stating that the aperture control of the K70 is different.

At least as far as I can tell it the block looks slightly different and the screw holding the solenoid is now on the left side.
03-20-2019, 12:34 AM   #284
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Hmmm. thanks everyone for ongoing commentary from experienced perspectives.

It does seem the jury is still out on the K70 which I had been thinking of buying. It has a solenoid not stepper motor? But supposedly improved??
The KP seems a larger camera and more expensive.
I would rather buy new with appropriate warranties than try to do second hand. But it seems there are few Pentax stockists in rural France and online is the only choice. That makes it difficult to get a feel of a camera in your hand and when you are on the move...
I do not want to attempt any repair myself and will probably keep the K30 body for use with my A Sigma 100-300 lens.
Thanks
Kerri-Ann
03-20-2019, 01:49 AM   #285
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If you buy online such as ebay, you have the right for a return.
You might have to pay the return shipping costs though.

PM sent were you can find the best K70 deal!
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