[photogem]

So I have a relevant question for the group: I have a replacement white solenoid from eBay (harvested off a K-x/K-p or the like). My K-30 hasn't failed yet, but is it guaranteed to fail? Should I wait to see and replace it if/when it does, or just bite the bullet and hack into it now?

I love my K-30 and don't otherwise want or need to replace it. Especially now that, thanks to this forum, I can upgrade the firmware to give me most of the functionality of a K-50. That's why I got the replacement solenoid now, in case they become scarce. So I guess the answer to my question depends mostly on expected failure rate of the stock solenoid.

Currently, aperture is working fine.

Shutter Count 1,220

There is a good chance that it will fail. Particular because you don't use it often.

I see it like this: If I would have it and it would fail for examples in holidays or when I am at an important meeting where I need it (for video this is) then I would for sure

replace it.


If you feel up to it and confident to do it and you have the time and quiet, I would do it.

Why:

- The K30 works quicker with the white solenoid, you can sometimes even hear the difference
- It will work (aside of being a consumerproduct) with this low shuttercount for a long long time
- you have peace of mind
- you will feel proud of having done so

I know others feel different. Thats fine.

[Cee Cee]

Replace solenoid now or wait?

I don't know about others but mine gave me plenty of warning that things were amiss, several weeks infact. I first noticed every now again that the first shot after turning on was dark and I started thinking this may be that issue that I'd read about, it took some weeks before every time I turned on the first few shots were dark, and another couple of weeks before I was firing off 10 or 15 shots to get it working, I was using the camera through out that time so plenty of warning for me at least.

[photogem]

I don't know about others but mine gave me plenty of warning that things were amiss, several weeks infact. I first noticed every now again that the first shot after turning on was dark and I started thinking this may be that issue that I'd read about, it took some weeks before every time I turned on the first few shots were dark, and another couple of weeks before I was firing off 10 or 15 shots to get it working, I was using the camera through out that time so plenty of warning for me at least.

This happens sometimes, but my first one came with full failure.


But even if it happens as you describe, one thing one shouldn't do by all means is serial shots!
Firing the camera kind of violently (which it is then because the solenoid is stuck) will make things eventually worse.


One can still use it but live-view only.

[FritzCat66]

There is a good chance that it will fail. Particular because you don't use it often.

I see it like this: If I would have it and it would fail for examples in holidays or when I am at an important meeting where I need it (for video this is) then I would for sure replace it.

If you feel up to it and confident to do it and you have the time and quiet, I would do it.

Why:

- The K30 works quicker with the white solenoid, you can sometimes even hear the difference
- It will work (aside of being a consumerproduct) with this low shuttercount for a long long time
- you have peace of mind
- you will feel proud of having done so

I know others feel different. Thats fine.

This is why I was kind of leaning towards replacing it sooner rather than later - because I don't want it failing on a trip or something, so if it's pretty much inevitable that it will fail, then just do it now. The shutter count is low in part because I bought it new in the box yet only a couple years ago from old stock (I had still been using my trusty film SuperProgram until then - so yeah, my expectation from a Pentax is many decades of use); even so, it's true I tend to use it a lot on a trip or a launch, then it stays in the closet for weeks. But from what I've been reading, if anything that kind of use tends to exacerbate the solenoid problem, making it even more likely to fail.

I wish we had hard numbers on the failure rate and conditions which tend to increase the failure rate.

As for my immediate course of action, I think it will be this: For now, I'll leave it as-is. Locally, I use it to shoot a lot of rocket launches from Kennedy Space Center next door. If it fails on a rocket shoot, not that big a deal, I can take it home afterwards and do the swap. But next time I'm about to take it out on a week-plus journey where I intend to do a lot of shooting, I may swap that solenoid pre-emptively. I was an electronics tech back in the day, certified in soldering up to mil-spec, so as long as I can figure out the mechanicals, I have a lot of confidence in my repair skills.

Thanks, all, for your feedback! These forums are one of the best reasons to continue using Pentax, in my opinion.

[Rob-48]

all I can say is to repeat a post I made LAST YEAR . . . . . . . . .
I am in Australia
I purchased a used K-50 from B&H, it was FAULTY, suffering the dreaded "Dark-Exposure".
B&H were marvellous, and gave me a full refund, & told me to keep the camera, and, if I could get it working, then good fortune for me !!!
I sent the camera to CR KENNEDY, in Melbourne, and, they REPAIRED the problem, at NO COST to me (because I bought the camera from a genuine outlet, and the problem was this well-documented, recurring issue, they called it a 'warranty' job).
I got a camera in perfect working order.


Take Note, fellow Aussies !!!!

[Not a Number]

I sent the camera to CR KENNEDY, in Melbourne, and, they REPAIRED the problem, at NO COST to me (because I bought the camera from a genuine outlet, and the problem was this well-documented, recurring issue, they called it a 'warranty' job).
I got a camera in perfect working order.

Odd, because as I recall recently another user from one of the Northern European / Scandinavian countries (or was it South Africa) was told that it was not a known problem and no service advisories were issued.

Pentax service and support in Oz seems why ahead of anywhere else outside of Japan.

[reh321]

I don't know about others but mine gave me plenty of warning that things were amiss, several weeks infact. I first noticed every now again that the first shot after turning on was dark and I started thinking this may be that issue that I'd read about, it took some weeks before every time I turned on the first few shots were dark, and another couple of weeks before I was firing off 10 or 15 shots to get it working, I was using the camera through out that time so plenty of warning for me at least.

Mine starting displaying Dark Image Syndrome on first shot at end of May {I know the date because it was during a trip we make every year at that time}. It is still doing that, 3-1/2 months later. I try to use it at least every seven days, but I carry a FA lens {which isn't very heavy} around in my bag so I can switch to manual control of aperture at a moment's notice, because I believe using a burst to free the solenoid is a good way to ruin the shutter also.

[Cee Cee]

Mine starting displaying Dark Image Syndrome on first shot at end of May {I know the date because it was during a trip we make every year at that time}. It is still doing that, 3-1/2 months later. I try to use it at least every seven days, but I carry a FA lens {which isn't very heavy} around in my bag so I can switch to manual control of aperture at a moment's notice, because I believe using a burst to free the solenoid is a good way to ruin the shutter also.

a similar experience to myself in terms of time from beginning of symptoms to the camera needing repair.

---------- Post added 09-14-18 at 08:56 AM ----------

all I can say is to repeat a post I made LAST YEAR . . . . . . . . .
I am in Australia
I purchased a used K-50 from B&H, it was FAULTY, suffering the dreaded "Dark-Exposure".
B&H were marvellous, and gave me a full refund, & told me to keep the camera, and, if I could get it working, then good fortune for me !!!
I sent the camera to CR KENNEDY, in Melbourne, and, they REPAIRED the problem, at NO COST to me (because I bought the camera from a genuine outlet, and the problem was this well-documented, recurring issue, they called it a 'warranty' job).
I got a camera in perfect working order.


Take Note, fellow Aussies !!!!

wow, good outcome Rob, interestingly Kennedy did charge TEDS Camera's for my repair under TEDS extended 5Year warranty ( I have a copy of the invoice )

---------- Post added 09-14-18 at 09:02 AM ----------

This happens sometimes, but my first one came with full failure.


But even if it happens as you describe, one thing one shouldn't do by all means is serial shots!
Firing the camera kind of violently (which it is then because the solenoid is stuck) will make things eventually worse.


One can still use it but live-view only.

When I'm birding I'll often shoot 5-10 shots in a few seconds, I don't consider I'm doing damage to the camera so why would shooting some frames to coax the camera into working be doing damage, beside the camera has a burst mode which shoots 5 or 6 or what ever it is, frames per sec. So what part of the camera would be getting damaged, I don't believe the solenoid itself would sustain any damage, but even if it did it's going to be replaced anyway

---------- Post added 09-14-18 at 09:19 AM ----------

This is why I was kind of leaning towards replacing it sooner rather than later - because I don't want it failing on a trip or something, so if it's pretty much inevitable that it will fail, then just do it now. The shutter count is low in part because I bought it new in the box yet only a couple years ago from old stock (I had still been using my trusty film SuperProgram until then - so yeah, my expectation from a Pentax is many decades of use); even so, it's true I tend to use it a lot on a trip or a launch, then it stays in the closet for weeks. But from what I've been reading, if anything that kind of use tends to exacerbate the solenoid problem, making it even more likely to fail.

I wish we had hard numbers on the failure rate and conditions which tend to increase the failure rate.

As for my immediate course of action, I think it will be this: For now, I'll leave it as-is. Locally, I use it to shoot a lot of rocket launches from Kennedy Space Center next door. If it fails on a rocket shoot, not that big a deal, I can take it home afterwards and do the swap. But next time I'm about to take it out on a week-plus journey where I intend to do a lot of shooting, I may swap that solenoid pre-emptively. I was an electronics tech back in the day, certified in soldering up to mil-spec, so as long as I can figure out the mechanicals, I have a lot of confidence in my repair skills.

Thanks, all, for your feedback! These forums are one of the best reasons to continue using Pentax, in my opinion.

If you have the skills to do the job then no problems do it whenever it suits , personally I would wait until symptoms started to appear, after all it might never happen ( and pigs might fly )

[Rob-48]

Odd, because as I recall recently another user from one of the Northern European / Scandinavian countries (or was it South Africa) was told that it was not a known problem and no service advisories were issued.

Pentax service and support in Oz seems why ahead of anywhere else outside of Japan.

As I said, in Australia, in MY experience, the legitimate Pentax importer, CR Kennedy, DOES support customers.
Also, in Australia, CR Kennedy give 24 months Warranty, not the 12 months, as stated elsewhere on this site


I can only speak to own personal experience, but, if a Pentax user is in Australia, why would you be going anywhere else?

---------- Post added 09-13-18 at 08:00 PM ----------




wow, good outcome Rob, interestingly Kennedy did charge TEDS Camera's for my repair under TEDS extended 5Year warranty ( I have a copy of the invoice )

---------- Post added 09-14-18 at 09:02 AM ----------


Re: TED's Cameras, in MY experience with TED;s -------> NO COMMENT (and I will never buy anything from teds again)(Hell will freeze over b4 I deal with teds again)

[Cee Cee]

As I said, in Australia, in MY experience, the legitimate Pentax importer, CR Kennedy, DOES support customers.
Also, in Australia, CR Kennedy give 24 months Warranty, not the 12 months, as stated elsewhere on this site


I can only speak to own personal experience, but, if a Pentax user is in Australia, why would you be going anywhere else?

---------- Post added 09-13-18 at 08:00 PM ----------




wow, good outcome Rob, interestingly Kennedy did charge TEDS Camera's for my repair under TEDS extended 5Year warranty ( I have a copy of the invoice )

---------- Post added 09-14-18 at 09:02 AM ----------


Re: TED's Cameras, in MY experience with TED;s -------> NO COMMENT (and I will never buy anything from teds again)(Hell will freeze over b4 I deal with teds again)

psst, don't mention TEDS, I mentioned it once but I think I got away with it.

[photogem]

As for my immediate course of action, I think it will be this: For now, I'll leave it as-is. Locally, I use it to shoot a lot of rocket launches from Kennedy Space Center next door. If it fails on a rocket shoot, not that big a deal, I can take it home afterwards and do the swap. But next time I'm about to take it out on a week-plus journey where I intend to do a lot of shooting, I may swap that solenoid pre-emptively. I was an electronics tech back in the day, certified in soldering up to mil-spec, so as long as I can figure out the mechanicals, I have a lot of confidence in my repair skills.

I know now quite a few people who undertook the repair without having done any soldering or repair ... and they did it.

So yes, you should have it very easy.

Very important:

- take the long silver coloured screw out in side the battery compartment out as well! (Some say this is not needed: Very wrong advice)
- discharge the flash condensor

- lift the top part slightly but don't take it off completly because:
a) this gives easier access to the solenoid with the soldering iron
b) allows to take the front part off easier because interlinked with the top-part
- make sure that you remember which was the AF ON/OFF button was when you take the front part off! The inner switch is always opposite to the outer lever!

This is what some forget. Right away when you place the front part back to its place, you check if the AF switch moves the screwdrivemechanism through that
tiny hole (AF ON) and back (AF OFF).

[Tangent88]

Where do you solder to though?

Sounds like doing it to the board is not a good idea so you must have to detach the other end which is glued on rather than soldered I gather, so where do you cut the wires?

[photogem]

Where do you solder to though?

Sounds like doing it to the board is not a good idea so you must have to detach the other end which is glued on rather than soldered I gather, so where do you cut the wires?

You will see it when you unsolder the 2 wires off the green solenoid. There are 4 pins on the solenoid: 2 on the side (which hold the thin wires of the coils) and 2 facing away from the solenoid. The wires are soldered right there. One could solder on the board but this is way more complicated. A pencil-shaped tip for the soldering-iron is highly recommended.
There are even 6V pencil-soldering-irons on the market with can be fed with a simple 6V DC powersupply (or even 4 x AA batteries)

[reh321]

It is the holding force of the magnet and the worse structure of the plastic body (PET in the green solenoid, PTFE in the white one) and the precision those bodys are manufactured, as well as the horseshoe.

So, the "green" plastic is PET and the "white" plastic is PTFE.

Two question:

1. Do you know whether the metal in the two different solenoids also differ?

2. Do you know whether they could make a "white" version of PET that would look like PTFE?

I had heavy and regular used K30's which eventually developed this problem as well, but it seems that when a K30 or similar is not used for a long time, they often develop this problem.

[photogem]

So, the "green" plastic is PET and the "white" plastic is PTFE.
Two questions:

The original white "made in Japan" solenoid is PTFE, yes!

1. Do you know whether the metal in the two different solenoids also differ?

Yes, but I don't know the composites.

The surface of the white made in Japan solenoid is smoother
and .. only a guess.... less prone to corrosion.
------

I had once the horseshoe of a green solenoid obviously having some corrosion. The K30 it was taken off was treated well and had no other signs of corrosion.
I know that in regions with high humidity and near the sea this can cause problems, but this K30 did not come from a region prone to high humidity.

2. Do you know whether they could make a "white" version of PET that would look like PTFE?

YES! I actually had the chance to purchase three new different solenoids from the chinese manufacturer.

1. green and PET... the one we know
2. blue (15 ohms impedance, as used in CD- and DVD-ROM drives)
3. white (32 ohms like the made in Japan one but PET like the others)

I was hoping LSAGuy who wrote post #66 in this thread would upload photos of his complete replacement assembly he got from USCamera. The photos there show the green solenoid.

But they way he describes the looks of the white solenoid made me wonder if this version the white solenoid is exactly the same which I have seen.

The difference is quite clear, but I don't have this new China-made white solenoid anymore.
So I have to see if I can get another one and post photos of the original Japan-made one next to this one.

The small permanent magnet of the original white solenoid cannot be moved in this longer slot for the magnet!

But the chinese white solenoid had an ever stronger magnet, the holding force was stronger as well.

I will try to get another one and post photos of both white version

Of course there is another possibity: The white made in Japan solenoid was soldered onto the replacement assembly.
For whatever reason...