Moving forward from a K-50

**niels hansen** · 11-09-2021, 03:54 AM

Originally posted by UncleVanya

The k-70 is still the lower end body in the current line up.

A Used KP is an option but those can be pricey. The k3 or k3-II is a fantastic upgrade from a k-50 with a very reliable shutter.

Does it mean that other shutters are unreliable - if yes- which?

**UncleVanya** · 11-09-2021, 05:07 AM

Originally posted by niels hansen

Does it mean that other shutters are unreliable - if yes- which?

No? The lower end bodies use the mechanism that sometimes loses aperture control and they aren’t rated for the same number of shots. That doesn’t make them unreliable, but maybe less reliable in the long run? The shutter portion of the camera tends to last longer than the aperture control block on those cameras but it may wear out sooner than the more premium bodies shutters which have a longer claimed lifespan.

SininStyle · 11-09-2021, 06:01 AM

Originally posted by photogem

The work with a K50 is pretty straight forward and doing it with both K50's at the same time makes it of course a bit quicker.
But I strongly recommend to print out the fotos of every side of the K50 for the location of the screws.
But then just pinch 2 x 2mm holes instead of one so you can stick the screws in there for both bodies.

Any of those usually have 2 solenoids:
ist*-D ist*DS ist*DS2 Samsung GX1 Samsung GX1s
ist*DL ist*DL2 Samsung GX1L
K100D K110D K200D
K-m/2000, K-x, K-r (but sometimes those have 1 green solenoid in the flash compartment)
those have just one:
K10D Samsung GX10; K20D Samsung GX20

My no means use a SLR solenoid, which looks quite similar but has a different holding force (MZ50 etc)
Some dealers on ebay Germany and ebay UK offer these but won't tell.
I had to re-repair a few of those cameras because the buyer purchased from ebay Germany and had bad results. Ebay Germany is not be mixed up with "ebay Kleinanzeigen" in Germany!

Those bodies are getting a bit harder to find these days because now it is known of their valuable "guts"

So the only other option in USA is ebay.com, just search for genuine solenoid Pentax there and you'll find it.

The price is quite o.k. because those solenoids seem to come from an ex-repair-shop and it is very difficult to get them NOS (New Old Stock).
Only some shops in Japan have them but only if you visit there directly and then not much cheaper either.

Not to worry about shuttercount of a donor camera! Those Japan-Solenoids last longer than the camera.
In the K30 of one of my sons I installed a K10D solenoid from a K10D with 46000 actuations!
The K30 had some 3000 then, now it is near 14,500 and works perfect.

I know of some K10D's and K20D's with much higher shuttercount and they still work very well.

Time for the actual repair when tools and good light are ready:
I do it within 20min

My first one was about 1 hour

Soldering is not that difficult but have some very thin solder and a thin tip!
Old type leaded solder works better than silver-solder.

I use solder without resin, because I use a tube of honey-like resin, place a tiny bit of that onto the wire or pin of the solenoid,
Then some solder on the tip of the soldering-iron (it won't fume as no resin).
That makes soldering very easy. I am older, my eye-sigth is not anymore as it used to be, sometimes my hands shake a bit,
but I find it pretty easy.

But don't forget the flash-condensor!

The danger to get a shock there if you don't discharge it is a 1001 x times higher than faint-hearted warnings of socalled specialists in this thread:
Modify vacuum-cleaner for safe dust-cleaning your Pentax (anti-static ESD) - PentaxForums.com

Appreciate the detailed response Photogem. Will very much come in handy.

**photogem** · 11-09-2021, 09:33 PM

Originally posted by UncleVanya

The shutter portion of the camera tends to last longer than the aperture control block on those cameras but it may wear out sooner than the more premium bodies shutters which have a longer claimed lifespan.

Shutterlive of Pentax bodies was always given a bit conservative, i.e. lower than other companies:

https://www.camerajungle.co.uk/shutter-counts-explained]Those gave 150.000 f...ssional bodies
Pentax gave for both for a long time just 100.000 (up to the K5-Series and entry = K-r, midrange = K30):
Pentax K-30 vs. Pentax K-5 vs. Pentax K-r - Pentax Camera Comparison - PentaxForums.com

With the K3 it rose up to 200.000, K1 up to 300.000 but KP remained at 100.000:
Pentax K-3 vs. Pentax K-1 vs. Pentax KP - Pentax Camera Comparison - PentaxForums.com

while from the K50 onwards there was no more shutterlife specified for entry/midrange bodies:
Pentax K-50 vs. Pentax K-S2 vs. Pentax K-70 - Pentax Camera Comparison - PentaxForums.com

I guess this was due to ABF although the stuck solenoid actually has nothing to do with shutterlife.

The K10D was rated for 100.000 actuations but it is knows that quite some K10D's reached a very high shuttercount, same for the K20D,
both very similar built, one could even swap body-parts except LCD.
Both use the Japan-solenoid which shows that the aperture control block which is still the very same principle can last as long as the shutter mechanism itself,
actually longer, because it never failed in those.
So it is not the aperture-control-block (diaphragm-control-block)

but it's JUST THE made in China SOLENOID which fails.

Last edited by photogem; 11-10-2021 at 12:25 AM.

**niels hansen** · 11-10-2021, 01:45 AM

Originally posted by photogem

Shutterlive of Pentax bodies was always given a bit conservative, i.e. lower than other companies:

https://www.camerajungle.co.uk/shutter-counts-explained]Those gave 150.000 f...ssional bodies
Pentax gave for both for a long time just 100.000 (up to the K5-Series and entry = K-r, midrange = K30):
Pentax K-30 vs. Pentax K-5 vs. Pentax K-r - Pentax Camera Comparison - PentaxForums.com

With the K3 it rose up to 200.000, K1 up to 300.000 but KP remained at 100.000:
Pentax K-3 vs. Pentax K-1 vs. Pentax KP - Pentax Camera Comparison - PentaxForums.com

while from the K50 onwards there was no more shutterlife specified for entry/midrange bodies:
Pentax K-50 vs. Pentax K-S2 vs. Pentax K-70 - Pentax Camera Comparison - PentaxForums.com

I guess this was due to ABF although the stuck solenoid actually has nothing to do with shutterlife.

The K10D was rated for 100.000 actuations but it is knows that quite some K10D's reached a very high shuttercount, same for the K20D,
both very similar built, one could even swap body-parts except LCD.
Both use the Japan-solenoid which shows that the aperture control block which is still the very same principle can last as long as the shutter mechanism itself,
actually longer, because it never failed in those.
So it is not the aperture-control-block (diaphragm-control-block)

but it's JUST THE made in China SOLENOID which fails.

I guess that a oood deal of the shutterelements in K3 and Kp are the same, so why is the KP shutterlife shorter

**photogem** · 11-10-2021, 02:48 AM

Originally posted by niels hansen

I guess that a oood deal of the shutterelements in K3 and Kp are the same, so why is the KP shutterlife shorter

I don't think they are the same. The KP has an electronic shutter (in LV).

But lets leave it with this in this thread which is for the K50!

**UncleVanya** · 11-10-2021, 06:32 AM

Originally posted by niels hansen

I guess that a oood deal of the shutterelements in K3 and Kp are the same, so why is the KP shutterlife shorter

The k-50, k-3, and KP have distinctly different sounds. I suspect they’re all quite different. I’m also unclear after the posts above if the shutter life really differs or if the difference is mostly a value based labeling by Ricoh.

---------- Post added 11-10-21 at 08:34 AM ----------

Originally posted by photogem

I don't think they are the same. The KP has an electronic shutter (in LV).

But lets leave it with this in this thread which is for the K50!

Actually it’s also about moving on to something else from the k-50… so a bit of a broader landscape.

SininStyle · 11-10-2021, 07:13 AM

Think I will be getting the KP also. On top of fixing the K-50s. As an upgrade. The price curve beyond the KP seems to get insanely steep even used. Simple can't afford to get any better than that. The full frames look amazing, but realistically the benefits would be completely lost on me. Better bang for buck keeping with the smaller sensor. The tilting screen won't be used often but I can see it being nice once in a while. Back in 2015 the K-70 was just rolling out and the screen was one of the reasons I went K-50 instead. Just seemed like one of those things that would break before anything else.
So anyway, Photogem feel free to dive into the shutter if ya like. Wouldn't feel like derailment at all to me. Up to you of course.

**photogem** · 11-12-2021, 05:21 AM

Originally posted by SininStyle

So anyway, Photogem feel free to dive into the shutter if ya like. Wouldn't feel like derailment at all to me. Up to you of course.

Well, the shutter would break for sure.

SininStyle · 11-22-2021, 05:44 AM

Got a KP. Went used, got it from this forum. great shape. Appreciate all the help. Now I just need to find some solenoids.

11-09-2021, 03:54 AM	#16
niels hansen Site Supporter Join Date: Aug 2017 Posts: 343	shutter reliability Originally posted by UncleVanya The k-70 is still the lower end body in the current line up. A Used KP is an option but those can be pricey. The k3 or k3-II is a fantastic upgrade from a k-50 with a very reliable shutter. Does it mean that other shutters are unreliable - if yes- which?

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11-09-2021, 05:07 AM	#17
UncleVanya Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Jul 2014 Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 28,445	Originally posted by niels hansen Does it mean that other shutters are unreliable - if yes- which? No? The lower end bodies use the mechanism that sometimes loses aperture control and they aren’t rated for the same number of shots. That doesn’t make them unreliable, but maybe less reliable in the long run? The shutter portion of the camera tends to last longer than the aperture control block on those cameras but it may wear out sooner than the more premium bodies shutters which have a longer claimed lifespan.

11-09-2021, 06:01 AM	#18
SininStyle Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2015 Photos: Albums Posts: 138 Original Poster	Originally posted by photogem The work with a K50 is pretty straight forward and doing it with both K50's at the same time makes it of course a bit quicker. But I strongly recommend to print out the fotos of every side of the K50 for the location of the screws. But then just pinch 2 x 2mm holes instead of one so you can stick the screws in there for both bodies. Any of those usually have 2 solenoids: ist-D istDS istDS2 Samsung GX1 Samsung GX1s istDL ist*DL2 Samsung GX1L K100D K110D K200D K-m/2000, K-x, K-r (but sometimes those have 1 green solenoid in the flash compartment) those have just one: K10D Samsung GX10; K20D Samsung GX20 My no means use a SLR solenoid, which looks quite similar but has a different holding force (MZ50 etc) Some dealers on ebay Germany and ebay UK offer these but won't tell. I had to re-repair a few of those cameras because the buyer purchased from ebay Germany and had bad results. Ebay Germany is not be mixed up with "ebay Kleinanzeigen" in Germany! Those bodies are getting a bit harder to find these days because now it is known of their valuable "guts" So the only other option in USA is ebay.com, just search for genuine solenoid Pentax there and you'll find it. The price is quite o.k. because those solenoids seem to come from an ex-repair-shop and it is very difficult to get them NOS (New Old Stock). Only some shops in Japan have them but only if you visit there directly and then not much cheaper either. Not to worry about shuttercount of a donor camera! Those Japan-Solenoids last longer than the camera. In the K30 of one of my sons I installed a K10D solenoid from a K10D with 46000 actuations! The K30 had some 3000 then, now it is near 14,500 and works perfect. I know of some K10D's and K20D's with much higher shuttercount and they still work very well. Time for the actual repair when tools and good light are ready: I do it within 20min My first one was about 1 hour Soldering is not that difficult but have some very thin solder and a thin tip! Old type leaded solder works better than silver-solder. I use solder without resin, because I use a tube of honey-like resin, place a tiny bit of that onto the wire or pin of the solenoid, Then some solder on the tip of the soldering-iron (it won't fume as no resin). That makes soldering very easy. I am older, my eye-sigth is not anymore as it used to be, sometimes my hands shake a bit, but I find it pretty easy. But don't forget the flash-condensor! The danger to get a shock there if you don't discharge it is a 1001 x times higher than faint-hearted warnings of socalled specialists in this thread: Modify vacuum-cleaner for safe dust-cleaning your Pentax (anti-static ESD) - PentaxForums.com Appreciate the detailed response Photogem. Will very much come in handy.

11-09-2021, 09:33 PM	#19
photogem Site Supporter Join Date: Apr 2015 Posts: 3,522	Originally posted by UncleVanya The shutter portion of the camera tends to last longer than the aperture control block on those cameras but it may wear out sooner than the more premium bodies shutters which have a longer claimed lifespan. Shutterlive of Pentax bodies was always given a bit conservative, i.e. lower than other companies: https://www.camerajungle.co.uk/shutter-counts-explained]Those gave 150.000 f...ssional bodies Pentax gave for both for a long time just 100.000 (up to the K5-Series and entry = K-r, midrange = K30): Pentax K-30 vs. Pentax K-5 vs. Pentax K-r - Pentax Camera Comparison - PentaxForums.com With the K3 it rose up to 200.000, K1 up to 300.000 but KP remained at 100.000: Pentax K-3 vs. Pentax K-1 vs. Pentax KP - Pentax Camera Comparison - PentaxForums.com while from the K50 onwards there was no more shutterlife specified for entry/midrange bodies: Pentax K-50 vs. Pentax K-S2 vs. Pentax K-70 - Pentax Camera Comparison - PentaxForums.com I guess this was due to ABF although the stuck solenoid actually has nothing to do with shutterlife. The K10D was rated for 100.000 actuations but it is knows that quite some K10D's reached a very high shuttercount, same for the K20D, both very similar built, one could even swap body-parts except LCD. Both use the Japan-solenoid which shows that the aperture control block which is still the very same principle can last as long as the shutter mechanism itself, actually longer, because it never failed in those. So it is not the aperture-control-block (diaphragm-control-block) but it's JUST THE made in China SOLENOID which fails. Last edited by photogem; 11-10-2021 at 12:25 AM.

11-10-2021, 01:45 AM	#20
niels hansen Site Supporter Join Date: Aug 2017 Posts: 343	Originally posted by photogem Shutterlive of Pentax bodies was always given a bit conservative, i.e. lower than other companies: https://www.camerajungle.co.uk/shutter-counts-explained]Those gave 150.000 f...ssional bodies Pentax gave for both for a long time just 100.000 (up to the K5-Series and entry = K-r, midrange = K30): Pentax K-30 vs. Pentax K-5 vs. Pentax K-r - Pentax Camera Comparison - PentaxForums.com With the K3 it rose up to 200.000, K1 up to 300.000 but KP remained at 100.000: Pentax K-3 vs. Pentax K-1 vs. Pentax KP - Pentax Camera Comparison - PentaxForums.com while from the K50 onwards there was no more shutterlife specified for entry/midrange bodies: Pentax K-50 vs. Pentax K-S2 vs. Pentax K-70 - Pentax Camera Comparison - PentaxForums.com I guess this was due to ABF although the stuck solenoid actually has nothing to do with shutterlife. The K10D was rated for 100.000 actuations but it is knows that quite some K10D's reached a very high shuttercount, same for the K20D, both very similar built, one could even swap body-parts except LCD. Both use the Japan-solenoid which shows that the aperture control block which is still the very same principle can last as long as the shutter mechanism itself, actually longer, because it never failed in those. So it is not the aperture-control-block (diaphragm-control-block) but it's JUST THE made in China SOLENOID which fails. I guess that a oood deal of the shutterelements in K3 and Kp are the same, so why is the KP shutterlife shorter

11-10-2021, 02:48 AM	#21
photogem Site Supporter Join Date: Apr 2015 Posts: 3,522	Originally posted by niels hansen I guess that a oood deal of the shutterelements in K3 and Kp are the same, so why is the KP shutterlife shorter I don't think they are the same. The KP has an electronic shutter (in LV). But lets leave it with this in this thread which is for the K50!

11-10-2021, 06:32 AM	#22
UncleVanya Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Jul 2014 Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 28,445	Originally posted by niels hansen I guess that a oood deal of the shutterelements in K3 and Kp are the same, so why is the KP shutterlife shorter The k-50, k-3, and KP have distinctly different sounds. I suspect they’re all quite different. I’m also unclear after the posts above if the shutter life really differs or if the difference is mostly a value based labeling by Ricoh. ---------- Post added 11-10-21 at 08:34 AM ---------- Originally posted by photogem I don't think they are the same. The KP has an electronic shutter (in LV). But lets leave it with this in this thread which is for the K50! Actually it’s also about moving on to something else from the k-50… so a bit of a broader landscape.

11-10-2021, 07:13 AM	#23
SininStyle Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2015 Photos: Albums Posts: 138 Original Poster	Think I will be getting the KP also. On top of fixing the K-50s. As an upgrade. The price curve beyond the KP seems to get insanely steep even used. Simple can't afford to get any better than that. The full frames look amazing, but realistically the benefits would be completely lost on me. Better bang for buck keeping with the smaller sensor. The tilting screen won't be used often but I can see it being nice once in a while. Back in 2015 the K-70 was just rolling out and the screen was one of the reasons I went K-50 instead. Just seemed like one of those things that would break before anything else. So anyway, Photogem feel free to dive into the shutter if ya like. Wouldn't feel like derailment at all to me. Up to you of course.

11-12-2021, 05:21 AM	#24
photogem Site Supporter Join Date: Apr 2015 Posts: 3,522	Originally posted by SininStyle So anyway, Photogem feel free to dive into the shutter if ya like. Wouldn't feel like derailment at all to me. Up to you of course. Well, the shutter would break for sure.

11-22-2021, 05:44 AM	#25
SininStyle Senior Member Join Date: Mar 2015 Photos: Albums Posts: 138 Original Poster	Got a KP. Went used, got it from this forum. great shape. Appreciate all the help. Now I just need to find some solenoids.