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06-19-2010, 10:16 PM   #46
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QuoteOriginally posted by Paul Ewins Quote
Nikon used to make 35mm lenses, MF lenses (for Bronica and maybe others) and LF lenses along with a variety of industrial and scientific lenses (which they probably still do).

Fuji had their own range of 35mm and MF cameras and also made LF lenses.

Canon made/make movie/video lenses in a variety of formats as well as their 35mm lenses.

In 1984 when it introduced the 645 Pentax also had the 110, K mount and 6x7 systems, plus medical and scientific optics.

The real issue will be manufacturing capacity, not the ability of Pentax to design the lenses, and of course whether Pentax can sell enough of them to make it worth doing.
Yes, I knew about these (well, most of them), but I limited myself to the lenses used in consumer products actually manufactured. I should have added the Nikon MF lenses, though, since many of these are still selling today.

I do agree with the capacity to manufacture vs. the ability to design the lenses as well. I express myself inappropriately, here: you were far more accurate than me on that point!

06-20-2010, 03:15 AM   #47
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These are probably proof-of-concept designs. In some ways it probably represents Pentax exploring the m4/3 specifications and seeing what's possible with it. If you are a company thinking of entering the micro-mount arena you might do some experiments with an existing mount specification to see what's feasible with such short registration distances. If there are no other optical designs dated after November 2008 then it seems unlikely that Pentax is pursuing m4/3 lenses seriously doesn't it?

It may also be an attempt to block other's by patenting the best/better optical designs.
06-20-2010, 03:35 AM   #48
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QuoteOriginally posted by Asahiflex Quote
Well - whatever Pentax does: let's support them!
I've done that before, but these times are over for me. I love the brand but if they dont come up with what I want, I`ll get it at Nikon side. Lets wait till Photokina.
06-20-2010, 04:24 AM   #49
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QuoteOriginally posted by ilya80 Quote
I've done that before, but these times are over for me. I love the brand but if they dont come up with what I want, I`ll get it at Nikon side. Lets wait till Photokina.
at Photokina we should be seeing 2 DSLRs AFAIK, no news on 4/3 format...
anyway, when is Photokina???

06-20-2010, 05:37 AM   #50
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photokina

Will be very interesting this Year......much more than the last one

Best regards,Andy
06-20-2010, 06:12 AM   #51
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QuoteOriginally posted by axl Quote
anyway, when is Photokina???
Adam,

can you please embedd a Javascript countdown to next big photo show (photokina now) at the head of the news&rumors section?

An eternal thank you,
Falk
06-20-2010, 09:42 AM   #52
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Well, I guess I'll wait and see what Pentax does here. I was planning on having a MFT system anyway. I'd much rather have it a Pentax
06-20-2010, 05:23 PM   #53
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In Japan two years ago, Pentax had something like 4% of the DSLR market, with Olympus around 5-7% and Pansonic around 1-2%.

With the introduction of µ43, the sales of of Olympus and Pansonic interchangeable lens cameras has jumped to more than 20%!!!!!!

Pentax is stable at around 4-6%.

Can Pentax afford to ignore the success of µ43? I have had Pentax gear for more than 25 years, back when I was repairing cameras. (I still repair lenses and cameras in my spare time!)

These days a have a variety of DSLRs(from most manufacturers), along with µ43. I love using old Pentax, Nikon, Minolta, Konica, Canon, etc lenses on my µ43 camera. My µ43 is a Panasonic, but if Pentax brought one out, I would seriously consider one. It's rumored that Panasonic will release a truly tiny µ43 camera within a year. If Pentax could do this before Panasonic & Olympus, they could still carve out a big slice of the µ43 market.... after all, they have a great history of brilliant and tiny pancake lenses.

And i think this would be an ADDITIONAL line of cameras to the DSLR line, increasing Pentax's bottom line, making it more sustainable to produce a line of quality DSLRs..

06-20-2010, 07:29 PM   #54
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If Pentax introduces a mirrorless camera, either micro-4/3rds or with a similar mount, that will allow the use of adapters I'd sell my K200D in a heartbeat.

I'd love to be able to have a camera that can mount legacy K-mount and M-mount lenses via adapters along with (hopefully!) far more compact Limited lenses for the new format. Just keep it APS-C! I don't know if I can deal with a 2x factor!
06-21-2010, 04:21 AM   #55
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QuoteOriginally posted by dnas Quote
In Japan two years ago, Pentax had something like 4% of the DSLR market, with Olympus around 5-7% and Pansonic around 1-2%.

With the introduction of µ43, the sales of of Olympus and Pansonic interchangeable lens cameras has jumped to more than 20%!!!!!!

Pentax is stable at around 4-6%.

Can Pentax afford to ignore the success of µ43?
Let's put it this way. Pentax has taken 4-6% from those 80% (the DSLR market); how much could they gain if they compete in a much smaller (20%) market?
IMO if they can't take half of that market for themselves (which I seriously doubt) there is no point in entering it - a much riskier and costly maneuver.
06-21-2010, 04:56 AM   #56
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QuoteOriginally posted by Kunzite Quote
Let's put it this way. Pentax has taken 4-6% from those 80% (the DSLR market); how much could they gain if they compete in a much smaller (20%) market?
IMO if they can't take half of that market for themselves (which I seriously doubt) there is no point in entering it - a much riskier and costly maneuver.
The figures between Panasonic & Olympus just for µ43 in May or April was around 20.5%, plus Olympus' 4/3 sales in Japan.

If Pentax got just 1/4 of those figures, then along with DSLR sales, we're talking possibly 9-11%, doubling their interchangeable lens camera sales.

However, if that µ43 segment continues to GROW and Pentax has 1/3 of those sales, then they could be looking at 12-15% of the interchangeable lens camera sales. What's not to like?
06-21-2010, 05:00 AM   #57
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QuoteOriginally posted by Kunzite Quote
Let's put it this way. Pentax has taken 4-6% from those 80% (the DSLR market); how much could they gain if they compete in a much smaller (20%) market?
IMO if they can't take half of that market for themselves (which I seriously doubt) there is no point in entering it - a much riskier and costly maneuver.
Agreed. The only truly economical; way for Pentax to do so would be an EVIL system with k-mount lens capabilities and APS-C.

It doesn't have to be a "smaller is best" form factor race.
06-21-2010, 05:21 AM   #58
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QuoteOriginally posted by Kunzite Quote
Let's put it this way. Pentax has taken 4-6% from those 80% (the DSLR market); how much could they gain if they compete in a much smaller (20%) market?
IMO if they can't take half of that market for themselves (which I seriously doubt) there is no point in entering it - a much riskier and costly maneuver.
I'm not being sarcastic, but how big is the market for 24 x 36 sensor cameras? Anecdotally, I know 1 person who has one. I now know 5 people who have jumped on to micro 4/3 in the last couple of months. I realize that means nothing but I would be curious to see out of all DSLR sales worldwide or Japan or Europe or US what percentage are 24 x 36.

I realize they cost more so that's probably one factor in their total sales. Having used one, I just wouldn't be interested unless they could make it the size of a K7 or smaller. It's a really big camera. I wonder if the large size impacts their sales figures? My friend who has one admitted she doesn't use it as much because it's such a hassle to lug it around. She wished she hadn't dumped her ASP-C camera and is about to buy an E-P2 after trying mine out.

Personally I don't care if Pentax makes a micro 4/3 or not since I already have an E-P2 and all the lenses for it, plus the Novoflex K mount adapter. That said if Pentax could somehow make one with a K mount I would definitely buy it. I'm pretty sure I wouldn't buy a 24 x 36. I find that the K7 and KX are fine with me. I'll probably skip their next two bodies because after awhile it just seems kind of silly to buy a new $1,000+ camera body every year. Plus I must say, I am really thrilled with the E-P2.

Anyway, how big is the market for 24 x 36. Not what someone projects it to be if the prices fall or if the cameras get smaller, but what is it now with current prices and size? If anyone knows.

Just curious.
06-21-2010, 05:35 AM   #59
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QuoteOriginally posted by stanleyk Quote
I'm not being sarcastic, but how big is the market for 24 x 36 sensor cameras? Anecdotally, I know 1 person who has one. I now know 5 people who have jumped on to micro 4/3 in the last couple of months. I realize that means nothing but I would be curious to see out of all DSLR sales worldwide or Japan or Europe or US what percentage are 24 x 36.
M43 has demonstrably poorer IQ than APS-C. There will always be a large segment of consumers who want better IQ.

Make the form factor too small, and a significant % of consumers will feel uncomfortable using the camera.

Finally, APS-C a la the Sony NEX can match M43. So it's about EVIl in its many guises, not just M43.

Panny and Oly have used excellent marketing to gain market share. There is no doubt the hulking FF beasts some people lug around are real turn-off to DSLR's. There will be a continuum of form factors out there, however (as there are with cars, some people will never drive a Smart car, but will enjoy a Honda Civic), with image and ergonomic performance weighing in appropriately.
06-21-2010, 05:35 AM   #60
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QuoteOriginally posted by Aristophanes Quote
Agreed. The only truly economical; way for Pentax to do so would be an EVIL system with k-mount lens capabilities and APS-C.

It doesn't have to be a "smaller is best" form factor race.
First, like it or not, completely viewfinderless is the new chic, not those looks-like-an-SLR EVIL cameras. Second, it can't have K-mount, it must have a much smaller flange distance. But if "k-mount lens capabilities" means that they'll provide a fully automatic (including AF) K-mount adapter, then by all means, that would really be cool.
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