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08-23-2010, 05:17 AM   #106
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Rumours

Ok, it's amusing to read wishes and hopes about new products.
But I'd like to know if there's any confirmed news or these are just rumours.

The info at home page is reliable? There are not only suggested characteristics
but also a price! Does that info come from some kind of a leak report that an employee, manager or marketing team has released?

08-23-2010, 05:55 AM   #107
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QuoteOriginally posted by Big G Quote
Dozens and dozens of razor sharp images.
I'd like to see one full-sized photo...Please. I've a lot of RAW from 7D.
I can't get really good photos from this camera.
08-23-2010, 05:57 AM   #108
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QuoteOriginally posted by Steelski Quote
We do not really know enough about the Safox 9 system on APS-c to make any real judgment.
We do not know how sensitive the sensors are, the speed of the system, the accuracy. we will wait and see.
I'd like meter Range from EV MINUS 6.5 like in LX.
08-23-2010, 06:02 AM   #109
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QuoteOriginally posted by ogl Quote
I'd like meter Range from EV MINUS 6.5 like in LX.
Heck, then I'll want OTS metering too (Off The Sensor), like the LX which had Off The Film metering.

08-23-2010, 06:18 AM   #110
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QuoteOriginally posted by ogl Quote
I'd like to see one full-sized photo...Please. I've a lot of RAW from 7D.
I can't get really good photos from this camera.
Take a look on my Flickr, I will provide 100% crops later.
08-23-2010, 06:23 AM   #111
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QuoteOriginally posted by Christopher M.W.T Quote
From what I know the camera will actually be able to do true 7fps.

I dare say it'll be quite similar in specs to the new Sony A580 that will also include the same new 16mp sensor.

And have a few other nice little features, sure it won't be the super quantum leap from the K-7 (ie to FF) that so many people have unrealistic expectations, but it is a logical upgrade like the K-7 was from the K20D.
Christopher, when I mentioned buffer, I wasn't talking about the fps slowing down in AF-C, but rather the buffer filling up within about 12 RAW shots, and then pausing. I have to shoot in Jpeg when using AF-C in High-fps mode so the action doesn't stop in 2-3 sec and then me having to wait for the camera to respond again as it writes the data. (This also means jpeg iso performance matters in this situation)

I know the K-7 was an immenses improvement over the K10D in reagrds to AF-C (went from utterly useless to very useable....K10D can still take subjects in motion, but is easier done in AF-S than in AF-C) and this was done by just tweaking the existing AF system, and as a definite improvemmet as it is, it also implies a true predictive AF will be an equally impressive leap (like in Nikon). So, yes the AF-C is useable now, but it can be better....it needs to be better, only given what the competition offers.

I am not saying we need FF. K-7 system (including lens) IMO was one of the best APS-C DSLR out there, except for the AF module and later the k-x/D5000 made the iso performace sub-par as well. These two improvements (iso and AF) IMO will make even the Pentax body formidable against the competition irrelevant of lens offerings.

But, knowing how Pentax has approached the market, the video will improve, iso will improve (but, my hunch is not more than what the K-x already offers - a 1.5-2 stop advantage in RAW more in jpeg), but AF may just get the 7fps improvement. It's still ok, but if that's all it is, then I will most likely not upgrade.

Last edited by pcarfan; 08-23-2010 at 06:31 AM.
08-23-2010, 06:26 AM   #112
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QuoteOriginally posted by Big G Quote
Take a look on my Flickr, I will provide 100% crops later.
All available sizes | Sea Eagle | Flickr - Photo Sharing!

I want this one
08-23-2010, 06:28 AM   #113
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Ok, will post a 100% crop this evening.

08-23-2010, 06:50 AM - 3 Likes   #114
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Reading all the posts from the whole forum is quite interesting.
I didn't know there were so many Pentax fanboys deeply thinking that Pentax "has the best bodies" and "made the better glasses" and "so much cheaper" than any other brand, excepted maybe Leica for the quality (sic).
So Pentax/Hoya must not be worried about its future, its products will continue to sell "well".
Now, my opinion, first about bodies (and I clearly don't ask you to think the same, anyway, I already know you don't):
Pentax did a wonderful job with the K10D. This body was miles ahead of its competitors on ergonomics and possibilities. But not without any flaw. For example, the jpeg engine was just crap. Same for AF and WB. Still, a very impressive job from that "old forgotten brand" that was Pentax.
Then, the big ones understand people were ready to pay more for more functions, possibilities, performances. In my mind, Nikon was the first to counter-attack with the D90, still the affordable APS-C reference today. Then Nikon replyed with the 50D and it's high resolution sensors. And they continued to improve their bodies, AF, sensors, IQ, in new models such as D300s and 7D (not talking about FF here, that is another debate).
What was the answer of Pentax to that? The K20D was basically a K10D with a new sensor. Don't misunderstand me, I like my K20D, but AF sucks, and high isos also.
Then, came the K7. Presented as "the new hope" for all pentaxists, most have been disappointed. Not because of the body, a new piece of art. But the sensor, the body masterpiece for IQ, was almost the same than in the K20D, maybe even worse! No way to spend 1200 dollars to get a body with (at most) the same images than the previous body. Add to that the "shutter blur crysis" and a cheaper model (Kx) with "higher" IQ. Then you understand why it is difficult to advice this body for new photographers, and why even the oldest Pentaxians upgraded from their old bodies to the small one, not to the flagship one. During this time, the AF was improved, but basically, it remains the poorest AF of the APS-C market, far far behind SoNiCanon. And image stabilization is still very much not convincing to me (my Panasonic FZ50 was performing way better than Pentax SR, was a chock to me when I bought K20D!)
Now let's talk about the lenses:
I read here very often than Pentax lenses are the best of the world. Really? Which one? The one which are as expensive as a Canon L lens? Without fast and silent USM AF motor? Nor being fast ones?
While Pentax situation was quite OK 2 years ago with many new DA lenses coming out, today's situation is in my opinion extremely serious! When Kx was released, I was happy to tell new comers they must take a look at it. Very good IQ, low price. But today, if I was one of them, I would feel trapped. Where are the lenses necessary for any beginner to grow? WHere are the cheap primes? Where is the choice in non too much expensive telezoom? Pentax is the only one to not offer any opportunity to get cheap prime. And I really don't think a "beginner" will start with a 500 dollars one. Especially the old outdate plastic look FA35 and FA50mm. Manual focus ones? Come on, we are in an "all automatic" world...
So I stopped to tell people they must check at Pentax body(ies?). Even for advanced users as you and me. Are you happy to pay that amount for lenses DA only compatible, with the terribly noisy AF? Or a "doubtful" and very slow SDM AF?
Pentax must wake up and open its eyes on the actual catastrophic lenses line up they try to sell compared to other brands. Like the bodies, they don't even offer half of the references that you can find in C/N, and there you have silent ultrafast AF in most of their lenses coupled to the high-end body AF module.

Yes, I am sorry my post is a bit nasty (I terribly lack sleep), but it is what I exactly think of the present situation. Actually I do not leave Pentax for the lack of FF. APS-C is becoming better and better, even if still far from present FF bodies, maybe I don't need a soooo big improvement. But what I cannot support anymore is the lack of lenses and features that any other brands can offer to their costumers. I need silent AF because sometimes I have to shoot during scientific meetings or classical music events (and the driller sound of my K20D is not welcome), I need fast AF because Pentax ones was good enougth when I started, but now I am much faster and need it to follow me, I am tired of the poor SR sytem (maybe it is a personal problem, maybe my shaking is specially unadapted to Pentax SR system, still, it seems almost useless to me) and I definitely need more lenses choices.

If actual Pentax products suit all your needs, good for you. But please stop to say again and again Pentax is better than anybody else. That is totally wrong, that is fanboy discussion (just like on sony's forum). And if it was true there will not be so many (almost all of them) threads asking for so many improvement for the next generation. Some things are good in Pentax, but many have to be improved by a lot to catch up at the bigger companies (and they are not bigger for any reasons).
Lets see what will Pentax announces in Photokina, and people staying in Pentax must accept they have to do with what they have, without trying to auto-persuade themselves they have "all the best of the world".
08-23-2010, 07:08 AM   #115
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Ogl, you own a Canon 7D ?

Ogl, you own a Canon 7D ?

I find if one reads the instructions manuals for Canon cameras it helps.

Pentax is easy to use without reading manuals, Canon requires reading if you want to get the most out of their complicated cameras.

Maybe these Canon 7D tutorials will help you achieve your potential with 7D:


Canon Digital Learning Center - EOS 7D: On-Camera Tutorial Videos



And for any other Canon cameras you may also own I offer up:

The Canon White Papers links

http://usa.canon.com/dlc/controller?act=GetArticleAct&articleID=1787


QuoteOriginally posted by ogl Quote
I'd like to see one full-sized photo...Please. I've a lot of RAW from 7D.
I can't get really good photos from this camera.
08-23-2010, 07:26 AM   #116
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Youki, I'm with you on the lens wagon...
Where are the FA50 and 35 equivalents??? These were plastic (but well-built) and reasonably cheap back in film days, but now the only affordable fast primes in Pentax mount are from Sigma!

Ok, FA31 is said to be a marvel, but frankly, it's a bit steep for one the only two sub-f/2 lens in the current lineup... And the other, the 43, is quite an investment, too...

The FA 50 (I doubt it's still officially in the lineup) is nearly affordable, but really needs an upgrade.
08-23-2010, 07:26 AM   #117
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QuoteOriginally posted by ogl Quote
I'll also get a crop from this one:

NYC - Looking up! | Flickr - Photo Sharing!

I remember this having excellent sharpness.
08-23-2010, 07:32 AM   #118
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Nice Rant

Nice Rant

Against my better judgement I'm holding out for Photokina 2010 for something amazing from Pentax.

For me thats Full Frame K Mount, image stabilized sensor, an item I've read about "coming soon" dating back before Hoya buyout of Pentax.

I suspect instead I'll see many new plastic mount lenses instead cause they are crazy profitable for Hoya.

But I wait....

29 more days

To see all the amazing new things Hoya has instore for Pentaxians




QuoteOriginally posted by youky63 Quote
Reading all the posts from the whole forum is quite interesting.
I didn't know there were so many Pentax fanboys deeply thinking that Pentax "has the best bodies" and "made the better glasses" and "so much cheaper" than any other brand, excepted maybe Leica for the quality (sic).
So Pentax/Hoya must not be worried about its future, its products will continue to sell "well".
Now, my opinion, first about bodies (and I clearly don't ask you to think the same, anyway, I already know you don't):
Pentax did a wonderful job with the K10D. This body was miles ahead of its competitors on ergonomics and possibilities. But not without any flaw. For example, the jpeg engine was just crap. Same for AF and WB. Still, a very impressive job from that "old forgotten brand" that was Pentax.
Then, the big ones understand people were ready to pay more for more functions, possibilities, performances. In my mind, Nikon was the first to counter-attack with the D90, still the affordable APS-C reference today. Then Nikon replyed with the 50D and it's high resolution sensors. And they continued to improve their bodies, AF, sensors, IQ, in new models such as D300s and 7D (not talking about FF here, that is another debate).
What was the answer of Pentax to that? The K20D was basically a K10D with a new sensor. Don't misunderstand me, I like my K20D, but AF sucks, and high isos also.
Then, came the K7. Presented as "the new hope" for all pentaxists, most have been disappointed. Not because of the body, a new piece of art. But the sensor, the body masterpiece for IQ, was almost the same than in the K20D, maybe even worse! No way to spend 1200 dollars to get a body with (at most) the same images than the previous body. Add to that the "shutter blur crysis" and a cheaper model (Kx) with "higher" IQ. Then you understand why it is difficult to advice this body for new photographers, and why even the oldest Pentaxians upgraded from their old bodies to the small one, not to the flagship one. During this time, the AF was improved, but basically, it remains the poorest AF of the APS-C market, far far behind SoNiCanon. And image stabilization is still very much not convincing to me (my Panasonic FZ50 was performing way better than Pentax SR, was a chock to me when I bought K20D!)
Now let's talk about the lenses:
I read here very often than Pentax lenses are the best of the world. Really? Which one? The one which are as expensive as a Canon L lens? Without fast and silent USM AF motor? Nor being fast ones?
While Pentax situation was quite OK 2 years ago with many new DA lenses coming out, today's situation is in my opinion extremely serious! When Kx was released, I was happy to tell new comers they must take a look at it. Very good IQ, low price. But today, if I was one of them, I would feel trapped. Where are the lenses necessary for any beginner to grow? WHere are the cheap primes? Where is the choice in non too much expensive telezoom? Pentax is the only one to not offer any opportunity to get cheap prime. And I really don't think a "beginner" will start with a 500 dollars one. Especially the old outdate plastic look FA35 and FA50mm. Manual focus ones? Come on, we are in an "all automatic" world...
So I stopped to tell people they must check at Pentax body(ies?). Even for advanced users as you and me. Are you happy to pay that amount for lenses DA only compatible, with the terribly noisy AF? Or a "doubtful" and very slow SDM AF?
Pentax must wake up and open its eyes on the actual catastrophic lenses line up they try to sell compared to other brands. Like the bodies, they don't even offer half of the references that you can find in C/N, and there you have silent ultrafast AF in most of their lenses coupled to the high-end body AF module.

Yes, I am sorry my post is a bit nasty (I terribly lack sleep), but it is what I exactly think of the present situation. Actually I do not leave Pentax for the lack of FF. APS-C is becoming better and better, even if still far from present FF bodies, maybe I don't need a soooo big improvement. But what I cannot support anymore is the lack of lenses and features that any other brands can offer to their costumers. I need silent AF because sometimes I have to shoot during scientific meetings or classical music events (and the driller sound of my K20D is not welcome), I need fast AF because Pentax ones was good enougth when I started, but now I am much faster and need it to follow me, I am tired of the poor SR sytem (maybe it is a personal problem, maybe my shaking is specially unadapted to Pentax SR system, still, it seems almost useless to me) and I definitely need more lenses choices.

If actual Pentax products suit all your needs, good for you. But please stop to say again and again Pentax is better than anybody else. That is totally wrong, that is fanboy discussion (just like on sony's forum). And if it was true there will not be so many (almost all of them) threads asking for so many improvement for the next generation. Some things are good in Pentax, but many have to be improved by a lot to catch up at the bigger companies (and they are not bigger for any reasons).
Lets see what will Pentax announces in Photokina, and people staying in Pentax must accept they have to do with what they have, without trying to auto-persuade themselves they have "all the best of the world".
08-23-2010, 07:44 AM   #119
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QuoteOriginally posted by Samsungian Quote
Nice Rant

Against my better judgement I'm holding out for Photokina 2010 for something amazing from Pentax.

For me thats Full Frame K Mount, image stabilized sensor, an item I've read about "coming soon" dating back before Hoya buyout of Pentax.

I suspect instead I'll see many new plastic mount lenses instead cause they are crazy profitable for Hoya.

But I wait....

29 more days

To see all the amazing new things Hoya has instore for Pentaxians
Thanks.
And I am surprised to not yet have been bashed in return. I am still expecting for the "you best go to Canon, we will not miss you" stuffs.
08-23-2010, 07:48 AM   #120
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QuoteOriginally posted by bobell69 Quote
I would also like to see the new camera offering Tethering along with the higher flash shutter speed. I'm still using a K10D and I can't tell you how often I have to turn my SR on and off. I certainly don't want to have to access the SR via the menu.
I believe the K-7 handles this differently... I came from the K100D and K20D, not the K10D, but I think that the K-7 behaves differently. SR is automatically shut off in certain circumstances, like when using 2-second delay (which I often use when shooting on a tripod), bulb mode, and I think maybe even when shooting flash... but I don't remember for sure.

Point being, with the K-7, I've rarely (if ever) had to take the time to manually turn SR on or off, unlike with the K100D/K20D.

As for the K-5... count me among those who is happy enough with the K-7 to be not in a rush to upgrade! Better high ISO performance is fantastic and would be the main reason for me to upgrade, but I am going to sit back. D700 levels of performance would be incredible but I am skeptical - offering 26,500 by itself doesn't mean much; just like PnS cameras have ISO 6400 now and my old *ist DL had ISO 3200 despite the same sensor as the Nikon D50 that could only do ISO 1600.

Yes, it's a bummer that my wife's K-x has better high ISO performance - but hey, if I was a Nikon shooter using a D300, the D90 would be better. Plus, look at the D300s - what a lousy "upgrade". Pity for poor advanced Sony shooter - if they're not ready to go FF, they have only an ancient A700 available. Canon regularly has entry-level DSLRs with newer, better sensors than their high-end ones.

Those trashing the K-7 should remember that noise-wise, it was not that different than the competition of the time. Fairly similar to the D300, 50D, etc. Yes, it should have been better than the K20D but really wasn't much (if at all), but it's not like it's suddenly become a lousy sensor. It also, from my experience, doesn't have the uneven ISO banding issues of the K20D sensor. In most other ways, it is a fantastic camera with very little to apologize for and offering a lot of unique, compelling features. And if you don't like the size, a $55 DealExtreme battery grip does wonders.

Price-wise, I doubt that even if it does retail at $1,600, that anyone will pay that. I bought my K-7 within a month or two of release and paid around $1,150 when it was retailing for $1,300. I'll probably upgrade to the K-5 when it drops to $1k or so.
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