K-5: 16MP, ISO25600 and 7 FPS worth the upgrade?

filorp · 08-23-2010, 06:25 PM

Originally posted by Pål Jensen

The DA* 16-50/2.8 is the slowest focusing lens I own. It is the only Pentax lens where I would admit that AF speed could be an issue

. All my screwdrive lenses, the Limiteds and the FA* 200 macro and 600/4, are very snappy in AF.

my da*16-50 is my favourite lens reg af speed... the slower is 43f1.9 im excluding beeeg zooms because its obvious that such kind of multielement lenses always will be slower it shouldn't happend when you compare 3x zooms in 16-200mm range.... its no ok when you compare macro and normal lens as well..

24X36NOW · 08-23-2010, 06:30 PM

Not if it's APS-C!

jmbradd · 08-23-2010, 06:49 PM

Originally posted by zackspeed

when you like the body of k-7,you will like the k-5.
when the autofocus is in the same range of going forward,like the other stuff,than it will be a great k-7 follower

Going a bit OT here but I think people underrate their own skills (this is a reply to all of the "AF is inferior" type posts we've seen lately)

Personally if I'm shooting a moving object I do one of three things.
1)Switch to center point only, hold down the AF button and fire a burst as I keep the center point down on the moving object.

2) Focus manually with a smooth consistent resistance AF lens like something in the Pentax A series. Seriously, the camera doesn't understand movement the way you do. If you can track objects well and have experience being able to visualize what depth field you can expect, you can 3d track with a manual focus lens better than any camera could with 3d AF.

3) Leave it in multi point mode and hope for the best.

90% of the time my camera is in AF-C and center AF point. When I bought this camera it was my first DSLR and I was concerned about AF points, speed and all of that wonderful stuff. I almost spend the extra few hundred for the insane many AF point system on the d300. Now that I actually take pictures with a DSLR its a bit of an afterthought.

glanglois · 08-23-2010, 07:02 PM

Originally posted by jmbradd

Going a bit OT here but I think people underrate their own skills (this is a reply to all of the "AF is inferior" type posts we've seen lately)

Personally if I'm shooting a moving object I do one of three things.
1)Switch to center point only, hold down the AF button and fire a burst as I keep the center point down on the moving object.

2) Focus manually with a smooth consistent resistance AF lens like something in the Pentax A series. Seriously, the camera doesn't understand movement the way you do. If you can track objects well and have experience being able to visualize what depth field you can expect, you can 3d track with a manual focus lens better than any camera could with 3d AF.

3) Leave it in multi point mode and hope for the best.

90% of the time my camera is in AF-C and center AF point. When I bought this camera it was my first DSLR and I was concerned about AF points, speed and all of that wonderful stuff. I almost spend the extra few hundred for the insane many AF point system on the d300. Now that I actually take pictures with a DSLR its a bit of an afterthought.

I was reasonably happy with center point until I began to shoot aerobatics as well as, and especially, my twin toddlers. My daughter's, actually, but you get the point.

I need, I think, the ability to pick a subject and allow the camera to stay focused on one as it moves around the viewfinder. It's rare that one of the twins is in the center of the composition I want - at least when they're in (rapid and unpredictable) motion. Same for aircraft, particularly in pairs.

I think I'm looking for tracking and perhaps predictive AF. Does this all make sense? Or perhaps others are right - I simply haven't learned enough photography.

Torphoto · 08-23-2010, 08:20 PM

Originally posted by filorp

i dont dig such a explanation... consumer zoom faster than professional lens? Tell something like this to canikonians... 16-85 faster than 70-200vr2 because 16-85 is plasticky lightweit and wobbly.... you'll hear the laugh(if it was a true... fact is 70-200vr2 heavy and bulky is the fastest lens iv ever checked)!!!

As the owner of the 70-200 L f2.8 MKII I can say 3 of my pentax lenses focus ( infinity to close and back, full rack ) faster than it, it's fast but not as fast as my DA 70, 16-45 or 40mm limited. It does kick the snot out of the 50-135 and just about every other zoom lens I have tried.

**ben-pentax** · 08-23-2010, 09:02 PM

Originally posted by zackspeed

when you like the body of k-7,you will like the k-5.
when the autofocus is in the same range of going forward,like the other stuff,than it will be a great k-7 follower

this is a "when" as in "this is a fact"
or ....
this is a "when" as in "if"

?

mysticcowboy · 08-23-2010, 09:24 PM

Lots of noise about cameras that nobody has seen. Specs sound good. I'll wait and see the DPReview tests, then wait for the initial price to drop. Getting all worked up about rumors is bad for the bile or something.

Winder · 08-23-2010, 09:31 PM

Originally posted by mysticcowboy

Lots of noise about cameras that nobody has seen. Specs sound good. I'll wait and see the DPReview tests, then wait for the initial price to drop. Getting all worked up about rumors is bad for the bile or something.

Well the new A55 tests are mostly up on DPR now.

Image Quality

The A55's 16.2MP CMOS sensor is new, and in collaboration with the camera's image processing, it offers excellent image quality. Detail capture is excellent at low ISO settings, though strong noise reduction does take its toll on detail at anything over ISO 400 (though it must be said that we're talking pixel-level detail here, which isn't something most people are going to worry about when shooting at ISO 1600).

Although we are currently unable to take a detailed look at the A55's RAW output, JPEG image quality is promising, and - for normal viewing magnifications, remains useable up to ISO 12,800 in a pinch. At lower ISO settings the A55 is able to resolve almost the same amount of visible detail as the Canon EOS 550D, which is currently the highest resolution camera in its class. Dynamic range is excellent too, at almost 9EV, which matches the best of the competition.

If this is the actual sensor to be used in the K-5 it looks good so far.

ogl · 08-23-2010, 10:00 PM

Originally posted by Winder

Well the new A55 tests are mostly up on DPR now.

Image Quality

Detail capture is excellent at low ISO settings, though strong noise reduction does take its toll on detail at anything over ISO 400

Although we are currently unable to take a detailed look at the A55's RAW output, JPEG image quality is promising

Visible loss of detail at anything over ISO 400 (noise reduction too strong)

If this is the actual sensor to be used in the K-5 it looks good so far.

I don't care JPEG IQ. But...No details at ISO over 400, worse colours and contrast = no IQ.

Anyway, the difference of work of in-camera processors could be huge.
Software is very important thing.

DronDrive · 08-24-2010, 12:34 AM

Originally posted by ogl

I don't care JPEG IQ. But...No details at ISO over 400, worse colours and contrast = no IQ.

The quality of 16 mp was not pleasant to me too

Kunzite · 08-24-2010, 12:42 AM

"No details"? None at all? That's what you read in the review?

Two things to consider:
a. Pentax is not Sony
b. A proper DSLR, unlike those "SLT" thingies, would send all the light to the sensor - during exposure.

ogl · 08-24-2010, 12:59 AM

Originally posted by Kunzite

"No details"? None at all? That's what you read in the review?

Two things to consider:
a. Pentax is not Sony
b. A proper DSLR, unlike those "SLT" thingies, would send all the light to the sensor - during exposure.

We see pictures...And pictures are really no good or bad.
http://www.dpreview.com/galleries/reviewsamples/albums/sony-slt-a55-review-samples

zackspeed · 08-24-2010, 01:01 AM

Originally posted by ben-pentax

this is a "when" as in "this is a fact"
or ....
this is a "when" as in "if"

?

if and hope for

that´s the unknown point

gazonk · 08-24-2010, 01:45 AM

Originally posted by Kunzite

"No details"? None at all? That's what you read in the review?

Two things to consider:
a. Pentax is not Sony
b. A proper DSLR, unlike those "SLT" thingies, would send all the light to the sensor - during exposure.

Imaging Resource also has a full review of the a-55, and when comparing their doll picture at ISO 3200 with the same picture from the K-x, there's an incredible lack of detail in the a-55 photo. I tried scaling both pictures down to 6mp, and even then, the level of detail in textures is better in the K-x picture.

BUT... as you say, Pentax is not Sony, and if I compare the K-x with the A-500 (which presumably uses a similar 12mp sensor?), the K-x has far better detail AND less chroma noise.

So I don't think there's any need to worry after seeing this.

mickey · 08-24-2010, 01:53 AM

Originally posted by jmbradd

Going a bit OT here but I think people underrate their own skills (this is a reply to all of the "AF is inferior" type posts we've seen lately)

Personally if I'm shooting a moving object I do one of three things.
1)Switch to center point only, hold down the AF button and fire a burst as I keep the center point down on the moving object.

This is true, and I also use the centre point the most when I'm shooting moving subjects, but it's not always the best for good composition, even taking cropping into consideration.

08-23-2010, 06:25 PM	#166
filorp Veteran Member Join Date: Jun 2008 Location: Aberdeen Scotland Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 398	Originally posted by Pål Jensen The DA* 16-50/2.8 is the slowest focusing lens I own. It is the only Pentax lens where I would admit that AF speed could be an issue. All my screwdrive lenses, the Limiteds and the FA* 200 macro and 600/4, are very snappy in AF. my da*16-50 is my favourite lens reg af speed... the slower is 43f1.9 im excluding beeeg zooms because its obvious that such kind of multielement lenses always will be slower it shouldn't happend when you compare 3x zooms in 16-200mm range.... its no ok when you compare macro and normal lens as well..

08-23-2010, 06:30 PM	#167
24X36NOW Veteran Member Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: CT, USA Posts: 498	In answer to the original question... Not if it's APS-C!

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08-23-2010, 06:49 PM	#168
jmbradd Veteran Member Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Portland, OR Photos: Albums Posts: 325	Originally posted by zackspeed when you like the body of k-7,you will like the k-5. when the autofocus is in the same range of going forward,like the other stuff,than it will be a great k-7 follower Going a bit OT here but I think people underrate their own skills (this is a reply to all of the "AF is inferior" type posts we've seen lately) Personally if I'm shooting a moving object I do one of three things. 1)Switch to center point only, hold down the AF button and fire a burst as I keep the center point down on the moving object. 2) Focus manually with a smooth consistent resistance AF lens like something in the Pentax A series. Seriously, the camera doesn't understand movement the way you do. If you can track objects well and have experience being able to visualize what depth field you can expect, you can 3d track with a manual focus lens better than any camera could with 3d AF. 3) Leave it in multi point mode and hope for the best. 90% of the time my camera is in AF-C and center AF point. When I bought this camera it was my first DSLR and I was concerned about AF points, speed and all of that wonderful stuff. I almost spend the extra few hundred for the insane many AF point system on the d300. Now that I actually take pictures with a DSLR its a bit of an afterthought.

08-23-2010, 07:02 PM	#169
glanglois Veteran Member Join Date: Aug 2007 Location: Madison, Wis., USA Posts: 1,506	Originally posted by jmbradd Going a bit OT here but I think people underrate their own skills (this is a reply to all of the "AF is inferior" type posts we've seen lately) Personally if I'm shooting a moving object I do one of three things. 1)Switch to center point only, hold down the AF button and fire a burst as I keep the center point down on the moving object. 2) Focus manually with a smooth consistent resistance AF lens like something in the Pentax A series. Seriously, the camera doesn't understand movement the way you do. If you can track objects well and have experience being able to visualize what depth field you can expect, you can 3d track with a manual focus lens better than any camera could with 3d AF. 3) Leave it in multi point mode and hope for the best. 90% of the time my camera is in AF-C and center AF point. When I bought this camera it was my first DSLR and I was concerned about AF points, speed and all of that wonderful stuff. I almost spend the extra few hundred for the insane many AF point system on the d300. Now that I actually take pictures with a DSLR its a bit of an afterthought. I was reasonably happy with center point until I began to shoot aerobatics as well as, and especially, my twin toddlers. My daughter's, actually, but you get the point. I need, I think, the ability to pick a subject and allow the camera to stay focused on one as it moves around the viewfinder. It's rare that one of the twins is in the center of the composition I want - at least when they're in (rapid and unpredictable) motion. Same for aircraft, particularly in pairs. I think I'm looking for tracking and perhaps predictive AF. Does this all make sense? Or perhaps others are right - I simply haven't learned enough photography.

08-23-2010, 08:20 PM	#170
Torphoto Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Trinidad W.I. Photos: Gallery Posts: 612	Originally posted by filorp i dont dig such a explanation... consumer zoom faster than professional lens? Tell something like this to canikonians... 16-85 faster than 70-200vr2 because 16-85 is plasticky lightweit and wobbly.... you'll hear the laugh(if it was a true... fact is 70-200vr2 heavy and bulky is the fastest lens iv ever checked)!!! As the owner of the 70-200 L f2.8 MKII I can say 3 of my pentax lenses focus ( infinity to close and back, full rack ) faster than it, it's fast but not as fast as my DA 70, 16-45 or 40mm limited. It does kick the snot out of the 50-135 and just about every other zoom lens I have tried.

08-23-2010, 09:02 PM	#171
ben-pentax Loyal Site Supporter Join Date: Feb 2007 Photos: Gallery Posts: 133	Originally posted by zackspeed when you like the body of k-7,you will like the k-5. when the autofocus is in the same range of going forward,like the other stuff,than it will be a great k-7 follower this is a "when" as in "this is a fact" or .... this is a "when" as in "if" ?

08-23-2010, 09:24 PM	#172
mysticcowboy Veteran Member Join Date: Apr 2009 Location: port townsend, wa Photos: Albums Posts: 968	Lots of noise about cameras that nobody has seen. Specs sound good. I'll wait and see the DPReview tests, then wait for the initial price to drop. Getting all worked up about rumors is bad for the bile or something.

08-23-2010, 09:31 PM	#173
Winder Veteran Member Join Date: Apr 2010 Location: Tennessee Posts: 6,617	Originally posted by mysticcowboy Lots of noise about cameras that nobody has seen. Specs sound good. I'll wait and see the DPReview tests, then wait for the initial price to drop. Getting all worked up about rumors is bad for the bile or something. Well the new A55 tests are mostly up on DPR now. Image Quality The A55's 16.2MP CMOS sensor is new, and in collaboration with the camera's image processing, it offers excellent image quality. Detail capture is excellent at low ISO settings, though strong noise reduction does take its toll on detail at anything over ISO 400 (though it must be said that we're talking pixel-level detail here, which isn't something most people are going to worry about when shooting at ISO 1600). Although we are currently unable to take a detailed look at the A55's RAW output, JPEG image quality is promising, and - for normal viewing magnifications, remains useable up to ISO 12,800 in a pinch. At lower ISO settings the A55 is able to resolve almost the same amount of visible detail as the Canon EOS 550D, which is currently the highest resolution camera in its class. Dynamic range is excellent too, at almost 9EV, which matches the best of the competition. If this is the actual sensor to be used in the K-5 it looks good so far.

08-23-2010, 10:00 PM	#174
ogl Banned Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Sankt Peterburg Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 8,382	Originally posted by Winder Well the new A55 tests are mostly up on DPR now. Image Quality *Detail capture is excellent at low ISO settings, though strong noise reduction does take its toll on detail at anything over ISO 400* Although we are currently unable to take a detailed look at the A55's RAW output, JPEG image quality is promising Visible loss of detail at anything over ISO 400 (noise reduction too strong) If this is the actual sensor to be used in the K-5 it looks good so far. I don't care JPEG IQ. But...No details at ISO over 400, worse colours and contrast = no IQ. Anyway, the difference of work of in-camera processors could be huge. Software is very important thing.

08-24-2010, 12:34 AM	#175
DronDrive New Member Join Date: Oct 2009 Location: Novorossysk Posts: 14	Originally posted by ogl I don't care JPEG IQ. But...No details at ISO over 400, worse colours and contrast = no IQ. The quality of 16 mp was not pleasant to me too

08-24-2010, 12:42 AM	#176
Kunzite Pentaxian Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Romania Posts: 15,132	"No details"? None at all? That's what you read in the review? Two things to consider: a. Pentax is not Sony b. A proper DSLR, unlike those "SLT" thingies, would send all the light to the sensor - during exposure.

08-24-2010, 12:59 AM	#177
ogl Banned Join Date: Dec 2007 Location: Sankt Peterburg Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 8,382	Originally posted by Kunzite "No details"? None at all? That's what you read in the review? Two things to consider: a. Pentax is not Sony b. A proper DSLR, unlike those "SLT" thingies, would send all the light to the sensor - during exposure. We see pictures...And pictures are really no good or bad. http://www.dpreview.com/galleries/reviewsamples/albums/sony-slt-a55-review-samples

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08-24-2010, 01:01 AM	#178
zackspeed Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2010 Posts: 527	Originally posted by ben-pentax this is a "when" as in "this is a fact" or .... this is a "when" as in "if" ? if and hope for that´s the unknown point

08-24-2010, 01:45 AM	#179
gazonk Pentaxian Join Date: Feb 2009 Location: Oslo area, Norway Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 3,746	Originally posted by Kunzite "No details"? None at all? That's what you read in the review? Two things to consider: a. Pentax is not Sony b. A proper DSLR, unlike those "SLT" thingies, would send all the light to the sensor - during exposure. Imaging Resource also has a full review of the a-55, and when comparing their doll picture at ISO 3200 with the same picture from the K-x, there's an incredible lack of detail in the a-55 photo. I tried scaling both pictures down to 6mp, and even then, the level of detail in textures is better in the K-x picture. BUT... as you say, Pentax is not Sony, and if I compare the K-x with the A-500 (which presumably uses a similar 12mp sensor?), the K-x has far better detail AND less chroma noise. So I don't think there's any need to worry after seeing this.

08-24-2010, 01:53 AM	#180
mickey Veteran Member Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Japan Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 1,146	Originally posted by jmbradd Going a bit OT here but I think people underrate their own skills (this is a reply to all of the "AF is inferior" type posts we've seen lately) Personally if I'm shooting a moving object I do one of three things. 1)Switch to center point only, hold down the AF button and fire a burst as I keep the center point down on the moving object. This is true, and I also use the centre point the most when I'm shooting moving subjects, but it's not always the best for good composition, even taking cropping into consideration.