ePHOTOzine: K-7 vs. D90 vs. 550D

Boris · 08-24-2010, 08:59 PM

As a matter of shameless plug

: this is a blog entry I wrote on account of having read tests similar to this.

CWyatt · 08-24-2010, 10:27 PM

This article is getting a list of comments about all the inaccuracies. Wonder if it will be pulled/updated, or left on the site. They even managed to screw up their metering somehow - perhaps due to shooting centre-weighted it looks like.

CWyatt · 08-24-2010, 10:44 PM

Originally posted by K-9

Glad I'm not the only one disgusted with the K20D's metering. It's atrocious. I get more exposure reliability from my Nokia cell phone's cam. Surprised to see the K-7 beat one of those other brands in this test, which probably means the K-7 is superior to the K20d as far as metering.

K-7 has 77 segments in full matrix metering compared to 16 - I think the K20D had the same metering system as the K10D? Whether this makes a huge difference in use I'm not sure - I tend to think full-matrix is overall slightly improved. I'm surprised at the above though, the camera systems are very good at reading how much light there is relative to mid-tone grey, which is what a camera meter thinks everything is by default.

The K10D was a very capable metering system. I especially found spot metering definitively accurate, as it usually is.

Anyway this is for another thread.

emr · 08-24-2010, 11:31 PM

There are obvious flaws in the test wrt Pentax, but of course we don't know if the other brands were tested any better. Not that errors with all three would make it any better.

On the other hand, I guess it's human nature to defend ones own choices, but I have a feeling that if the test contained the very same flaws but Pentax came first, people here would comment that despite the minor errors, it was a great test. I don't own any of the three cameras or haven't even used one, but I do shoot Pentax and while there are many upsides in Pentax cameras, I don't automatically expect them to be #1 in everything.

janneman · 08-25-2010, 01:14 AM

The most intriguing part is.....
Why compare the
D90 (august 2008)
K-7 (may 2009)
550D (february 2010)
That is almost 1 dslr generation between each of them.... It is like have a 20 year old, a 40 year old and a 65 year old running the same race in the same class.

Gimbal · 08-25-2010, 01:45 AM

And the most irritating thing is that the 65 year old won.

Vaikis_ · 08-25-2010, 01:53 AM

and D90 colors in photos are awful compared with Pentax and Canon

When last time all camera testers calibrated monitors and visited eye doctor ?

kokkieblanda · 08-25-2010, 02:26 AM

from their own review of the K7 done earlier:
Sensitivity: ISO 100-6400
it seems that they don't know what and how they tested before

pcarfan · 08-25-2010, 02:53 AM

Originally posted by F-Stop

Don't get me wrong, I've taken some amazing shots with either camera. I just cannot rely on any of the three metering modes for correct exposure mostly during outdoor/landscape photography and expect to nail it more than 50-60% of the time. I've taken around 30,000 photos between the K100D and K20D and then double that in 'preview' shots due to exposure issues.

If there's something I'm doing wrong then I'm all ears/eyes. I'm basing my judgement on real world results from myself and what an average or perhaps in this case advanced user has shown.

With my K10D I was able to use spot metering with success, but at times it needed a few test shots to fine tune the exposure (The spot metering was accurate, but I wasn't always getting the reading from the right spot to get an accuarate exposure of the whole scene, which is what the matrix metering is supposed to do) - I assumed it was part of the dslr experience until I got the k-7, and now I only use matrix metering. So, I totally understand your exposure issues as your cameras share the same metering.

The matrix metering with my k10D can best be described as just working randomly, I could never fine tune it with test shots. It almost seems like magic when the k-7 gets it right every time - even in flash P-TTL, which after 1 year of use, I finally fooled the p-TTL two weeks ago when I took a shot of a person standing right in front a wall of windows.

pcarfan · 08-25-2010, 02:55 AM

Originally posted by rawr

The concept is very good - I like real world comparative tests that focus on image quality, rather than camera body features and gizmos - but they need to take more care in learning and setting up the cameras they use.

+1.....................

Tranzistors · 08-25-2010, 03:05 AM

Interesting, the admin said, the review will be reworked and the article is not active.
Have never seen that before.

pcarfan · 08-25-2010, 03:57 AM

Originally posted by Gimbal

And the most irritating thing is that the 65 year old won.

Well! most of us are wondering why the 40 year old was blind folded and left in shackles at the starting line ?

pcarfan · 08-25-2010, 03:58 AM

Originally posted by Tranzistors

Interesting, the admin said, the review will be reworked and the article is not active.
Have never seen that before.

That is nice to hear, but if they are going to test JPEG images only then the K-7 will still lag behind the other two.

If they can shoot in RAW and use the same RAW converter for all three, then there are no worries about getting all the Jpeg parameters in line (how does one even do this ?, is med NR the same medium NR among all manufacturers - obviously no). I think somone who is registered at the site should suggest this to them.

ll_coffee_lP · 08-25-2010, 04:55 AM

I can't say it enough, but those who say that the K-7 wasn't enough of an upgrade over the K20 just haven't used it enough. Metering is spot on ALL the time, WB is near perfect ALL the time, AF is vastly improved, 100% viewfinder matters, quiet shutter, many software upgrades (lens corrections, etc.). The difference between the two cams is massive, but many just want to hang on the fact that they use the same sensor and that the K20 had a tiny bit better dynamic range and a tiny bit better noise.

c[_]

Spag · 08-25-2010, 04:59 AM

Originally posted by ll_coffee_lP

I can't say it enough, but those who say that the K-7 wasn't enough of an upgrade over the K20 just haven't used it enough. Metering is spot on ALL the time, WB is near perfect ALL the time, AF is vastly improved, 100% viewfinder matters, quiet shutter, many software upgrades (lens corrections, etc.). The difference between the two cams is massive, but many just want to hang on the fact that they use the same sensor and that the K20 had a tiny bit better dynamic range and a tiny bit better noise.

c[_]

Amen to that!

08-25-2010, 02:53 AM	#39
pcarfan Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Dayton, Ohio Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 2,978	Originally posted by F-Stop Don't get me wrong, I've taken some amazing shots with either camera. I just cannot rely on any of the three metering modes for correct exposure mostly during outdoor/landscape photography and expect to nail it more than 50-60% of the time. I've taken around 30,000 photos between the K100D and K20D and then double that in 'preview' shots due to exposure issues. If there's something I'm doing wrong then I'm all ears/eyes. I'm basing my judgement on real world results from myself and what an average or perhaps in this case advanced user has shown. With my K10D I was able to use spot metering with success, but at times it needed a few test shots to fine tune the exposure (The spot metering was accurate, but I wasn't always getting the reading from the right spot to get an accuarate exposure of the whole scene, which is what the matrix metering is supposed to do) - I assumed it was part of the dslr experience until I got the k-7, and now I only use matrix metering. So, I totally understand your exposure issues as your cameras share the same metering. The matrix metering with my k10D can best be described as just working randomly, I could never fine tune it with test shots. It almost seems like magic when the k-7 gets it right every time - even in flash P-TTL, which after 1 year of use, I finally fooled the p-TTL two weeks ago when I took a shot of a person standing right in front a wall of windows. Last edited by pcarfan; 08-25-2010 at 05:00 AM.

08-25-2010, 03:58 AM	#43
pcarfan Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Dayton, Ohio Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 2,978	Originally posted by Tranzistors Interesting, the admin said, the review will be reworked and the article is not active. Have never seen that before. That is nice to hear, but if they are going to test JPEG images only then the K-7 will still lag behind the other two. If they can shoot in RAW and use the same RAW converter for all three, then there are no worries about getting all the Jpeg parameters in line (how does one even do this ?, is med NR the same medium NR among all manufacturers - obviously no). I think somone who is registered at the site should suggest this to them. Last edited by pcarfan; 08-25-2010 at 05:06 AM.

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08-24-2010, 08:59 PM	#31
Boris Veteran Member Join Date: Mar 2008 Location: Israel Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 932	As a matter of shameless plug : this is a blog entry I wrote on account of having read tests similar to this.

08-24-2010, 10:27 PM	#32
CWyatt Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 1,291	This article is getting a list of comments about all the inaccuracies. Wonder if it will be pulled/updated, or left on the site. They even managed to screw up their metering somehow - perhaps due to shooting centre-weighted it looks like.

08-24-2010, 10:44 PM	#33
CWyatt Veteran Member Join Date: Jul 2009 Posts: 1,291	Originally posted by K-9 Glad I'm not the only one disgusted with the K20D's metering. It's atrocious. I get more exposure reliability from my Nokia cell phone's cam. Surprised to see the K-7 beat one of those other brands in this test, which probably means the K-7 is superior to the K20d as far as metering. K-7 has 77 segments in full matrix metering compared to 16 - I think the K20D had the same metering system as the K10D? Whether this makes a huge difference in use I'm not sure - I tend to think full-matrix is overall slightly improved. I'm surprised at the above though, the camera systems are very good at reading how much light there is relative to mid-tone grey, which is what a camera meter thinks everything is by default. The K10D was a very capable metering system. I especially found spot metering definitively accurate, as it usually is. Anyway this is for another thread.

08-24-2010, 11:31 PM	#34
emr Guest	There are obvious flaws in the test wrt Pentax, but of course we don't know if the other brands were tested any better. Not that errors with all three would make it any better. On the other hand, I guess it's human nature to defend ones own choices, but I have a feeling that if the test contained the very same flaws but Pentax came first, people here would comment that despite the minor errors, it was a great test. I don't own any of the three cameras or haven't even used one, but I do shoot Pentax and while there are many upsides in Pentax cameras, I don't automatically expect them to be #1 in everything.

08-25-2010, 01:14 AM	#35
janneman Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Netherlands Photos: Gallery Posts: 908	The most intriguing part is..... Why compare the D90 (august 2008) K-7 (may 2009) 550D (february 2010) That is almost 1 dslr generation between each of them.... It is like have a 20 year old, a 40 year old and a 65 year old running the same race in the same class.

08-25-2010, 01:45 AM	#36
Gimbal Pentaxian Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: Sweden Posts: 2,106	And the most irritating thing is that the 65 year old won.

08-25-2010, 01:53 AM	#37
Vaikis_ Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2008 Posts: 213	and D90 colors in photos are awful compared with Pentax and Canon When last time all camera testers calibrated monitors and visited eye doctor ?

08-25-2010, 02:26 AM	#38
kokkieblanda Inactive Account Join Date: Jun 2010 Photos: Gallery Posts: 13	from their own review of the K7 done earlier: Sensitivity: ISO 100-6400 it seems that they don't know what and how they tested before

08-25-2010, 02:55 AM	#40
pcarfan Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Dayton, Ohio Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 2,978	Originally posted by rawr The concept is very good - I like real world comparative tests that focus on image quality, rather than camera body features and gizmos - but they need to take more care in learning and setting up the cameras they use. +1.....................

08-25-2010, 03:05 AM	#41
Tranzistors Senior Member Join Date: May 2009 Location: Latvia Photos: Albums Posts: 112	Interesting, the admin said, the review will be reworked and the article is not active. Have never seen that before.

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08-25-2010, 03:57 AM	#42
pcarfan Veteran Member Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Dayton, Ohio Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 2,978	Originally posted by Gimbal And the most irritating thing is that the 65 year old won. Well! most of us are wondering why the 40 year old was blind folded and left in shackles at the starting line ?

08-25-2010, 04:55 AM	#44
ll_coffee_lP Inactive Account Join Date: Jan 2008 Location: Ontario, Canada Posts: 1,972	I can't say it enough, but those who say that the K-7 wasn't enough of an upgrade over the K20 just haven't used it enough. Metering is spot on ALL the time, WB is near perfect ALL the time, AF is vastly improved, 100% viewfinder matters, quiet shutter, many software upgrades (lens corrections, etc.). The difference between the two cams is massive, but many just want to hang on the fact that they use the same sensor and that the K20 had a tiny bit better dynamic range and a tiny bit better noise. c[_]

08-25-2010, 04:59 AM	#45
Spag Senior Member Join Date: Oct 2008 Location: Berlin Photos: Gallery \| Albums Posts: 118	Originally posted by ll_coffee_lP I can't say it enough, but those who say that the K-7 wasn't enough of an upgrade over the K20 just haven't used it enough. Metering is spot on ALL the time, WB is near perfect ALL the time, AF is vastly improved, 100% viewfinder matters, quiet shutter, many software upgrades (lens corrections, etc.). The difference between the two cams is massive, but many just want to hang on the fact that they use the same sensor and that the K20 had a tiny bit better dynamic range and a tiny bit better noise. c[_] Amen to that!