Forgot Password
Pentax Camera Forums Home
 

Reply
Show Printable Version Search this Thread
09-07-2010, 09:32 AM   #1
Veteran Member




Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: NYC
Posts: 896
K-5, K-r (Sony) Sensors Compared by DPReview (RAW)

DPReview updated their Sony SLT-A55 review today with RAW data. If this is indeed the same 16.2MP sensor that will go into the upcoming K-5, it looks like it may be another case of a lower model (K-r) having better ISO than its more expensive, higher-resolution sister model (but much slighter this time).

It seems the 16.2MP Sony sensor has slightly more RAW noise than its sister 14MP sensor rumored to be in the K-r. Even more annoying is that they both seem to have worse RAW noise than the even higher-resolution 18MP Canon sensor (with a slightly smaller sensor dimension no less)

On the positive side, it looks like both Sony sensors have good dynamic range (9 stops), slightly bettering the Canon.

High ISO: Sony SLT-A55 Review: 9. Noise and Noise Reduction: Digital Photography Review

Dynamic Range: Sony SLT-A55 Review: 11. Dynamic Range: Digital Photography Review

RAW: Sony SLT-A55 Review: 17. Compared to (RAW): Digital Photography Review

09-07-2010, 09:49 AM   #2
Veteran Member




Join Date: Dec 2008
Location: Iowa
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 1,368
Note: The A55's noise performance may be affected by the use of the translucent mirror, which diverts part of the light gathered to the autofocus system. So the K-5's noise performance should be better than shown here.
09-07-2010, 10:06 AM   #3
Administrator
Site Webmaster
Adam's Avatar

Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Arizona
Photos: Gallery | Albums
Posts: 40,978
That noise control looks quite impressive as it is, but I'm a bit concerned that the auto NR will significantly reduce the overall sharpness of the photos.

Adam
PentaxForums.com Webmaster (Site Usage Guide | Site Help | My Photography)



PentaxForums.com's high server and development costs are user-supported. You can help cover those costs by donating. Or, buy your photo gear from our affiliates, Adorama, B&H Photo, or Topaz Labs, and get FREE Marketplace access - click here to see how! Trusted Pentax retailers:

09-07-2010, 10:07 AM   #4
Veteran Member




Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: NYC
Posts: 896
Original Poster
QuoteOriginally posted by Urkeldaedalus Quote
Note: The A55's noise performance may be affected by the use of the translucent mirror, which diverts part of the light gathered to the autofocus system. So the K-5's noise performance should be better than shown here.
that's a great point, certainly hope its true, but I imagine Sony increases the exposure accordingly somehow (and DPReviews tests 'brightness match" +- 6 E/V, they're testing ISO afterall, not exposures), most likely the shutter speed with ISO being the baseline.

09-07-2010, 10:09 AM   #5
Veteran Member




Join Date: Sep 2006
Location: Southern Calif
Posts: 555
"It seems the 16.2MP Sony sensor has slightly more RAW noise than its sister 14MP sensor rumored to be in the K-r."

Hasn't Adam been pretty clear? The K-r is slated to have a 12 MP sensor - instead of 14MP. We'll know for sure though by Sept 9.

If that's the case, it looks like there won't be a 14 MP possibility until the next iteration? I guess Hoya is saving a few $ on using a prior sensor.

Last edited by solar1; 09-07-2010 at 10:39 AM.
09-07-2010, 10:19 AM   #6
Veteran Member




Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: NYC
Posts: 896
Original Poster
QuoteOriginally posted by solar1 Quote
"It seems the 16.2MP Sony sensor has slightly more RAW noise than its sister 14MP sensor rumored to be in the K-r."

Hasn't Adam has been pretty clear? The K-r is slated to have a 12 MP sensor - instead of 14MP. We'll know for sure though by Sept 9.

If that's the case, it looks like there won't be a 14 MP possibility until the next iteration? I guess Hoya is saving a few $ on using a prior sensor.
Has that been confirmed? It's also been rumored that the K-r would have Sony's current 14MP sensor.

I suppose just adding Li-On capability and VF points could justify a whole new letter upgrade from the K-x, but with Canon's entry level being 18mp and even Nikon moving on from 12mp after so long, I fear Pentax could be seen as staying in place.
09-07-2010, 10:19 AM   #7
Veteran Member
Reportage's Avatar

Join Date: Feb 2009
Photos: Gallery
Posts: 739
well, since Pentax listens to its users..i have no doubt the upcoming model will have the option of disabling NR entirely.
09-07-2010, 10:20 AM   #8
Senior Member




Join Date: Oct 2008
Posts: 213
no point to make any analyzes, K-5 would have a different revision sensor then Sony A55 !!! Pentax K-x sensor is also different revision then these which Sony uses.

09-07-2010, 10:24 AM   #9
Veteran Member




Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: NYC
Posts: 896
Original Poster
QuoteOriginally posted by Reportage Quote
well, since Pentax listens to its users..i have no doubt the upcoming model will have the option of disabling NR entirely.
The Auto NR only applies to JPEGs if i'm not mistaken. We were looking at the newly updated RAW data with Adobe's NR turned 'off' across all brands.
09-07-2010, 10:25 AM   #10
Pentaxian




Join Date: Apr 2007
Location: Romania
Posts: 8,424
QuoteOriginally posted by illdefined Quote
that's a great point, certainly hope its true, but I imagine Sony increases the exposure accordingly somehow (and DPReviews tests 'brightness match" +- 6 E/V, they're testing ISO afterall, not exposures), most likely the shutter speed with ISO being the baseline.
From what I understand, this isn't the case. The Sony "SLT" cameras would additionally amplify the sensor's signal, in order to compensate for the lost light.
The same ISO would get the same exposure (everything else being equal) - but with more noise.
09-07-2010, 10:31 AM   #11
Senior Member
jon.partsch's Avatar

Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Northern California
Posts: 142
QuoteOriginally posted by illdefined Quote
DPReview updated their Sony SLT-A55 review today with RAW data. If this is indeed the same 16.2MP sensor that will go into the upcoming K-5, it looks like it may be another case of a lower model (K-r) having better ISO than its more expensive, higher-resolution sister model (but much slighter this time).

It seems the 16.2MP Sony sensor has slightly more RAW noise than its sister 14MP sensor rumored to be in the K-r. Even more annoying is that they both seem to have worse RAW noise than the even higher-resolution 18MP Canon sensor (with a slightly smaller sensor dimension no less)

On the positive side, it looks like both Sony sensors have good dynamic range (9 stops), slightly bettering the Canon.


Um, where's the analysis of RAW headroom? Where is the comparison of high ISO RAW noise (the last link only provides JPEGs for comparison)? The verdict on this sensor is STILL not in!
09-07-2010, 10:34 AM   #12
Veteran Member




Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: NYC
Posts: 896
Original Poster
QuoteOriginally posted by Kunzite Quote
From what I understand, this isn't the case. The Sony "SLT" cameras would additionally amplify the sensor's signal, in order to compensate for the lost light.
The same ISO would get the same exposure (everything else being equal) - but with more noise.
Really? is that stated somewhere? That could explain the noise difference between the mirrorless NEX-5 and the A55, but its so slight I figured it was just the difference in photocell size from the extra 2mp.

I'd imagine just amping up a sensor's signal (the definition of digital ISO?) 30% or whatever is lost by the pellicle mirror would cause noticeably more noise than that
09-07-2010, 10:35 AM   #13
Senior Member
jon.partsch's Avatar

Join Date: Oct 2009
Location: Northern California
Posts: 142
QuoteOriginally posted by illdefined Quote
I suppose just adding Li-On capability and VF points could justify a whole new letter upgrade from the K-x, but with Canon's entry level being 18mp and even Nikon moving on from 12mp after so long, I fear Pentax could be seen as staying in place.

Not so fast - don't forget that we may have such goodies as second dial, top LCD, and faster FPS rate, better AF, etc. to look forward to from this camera, and those would be major improvements too.
09-07-2010, 10:35 AM   #14
Veteran Member




Join Date: May 2009
Location: Scotland
Posts: 581
As I said on another thread, they really praised the sensor and it looks very impressive to me; certainly up there with the best / latest APS-C cameras out there. RAW noise is only a touch worse than the 550D (Canon's flagship APS-C sensor) but still very well controlled up to ISO 3200, but the A55 has slightly better dynamic range - probably the best dynamic range out of any APS-C DSLR.

Aren't you guys happy / excited that Pentax's latest will have this stonkingly good sensor?
09-07-2010, 10:36 AM   #15
Veteran Member
magkelly's Avatar

Join Date: May 2010
Photos: Gallery
Posts: 5,905
Admittedly I don't know too much about the various censors but If I am reading these posts the lower sensor is better, less noisy? Isn't it smarter then to stay with that for now if the other sensor has more noise in RAW? Who cares about changing if what is new isn't maybe the best option? I'd much rather see Pentax stay with something that works better but that is older than see them use something that might be less optimal, wouldn't you? It doesn't really make sense to me to push for something just because it's "new" if indeed it's not the best choice.

Newer isn't always better. If it was so many PC people wouldn't still have XP on their machines versus Vista/Windows 7. Actually that's a pretty good example. Both OS's have been highly hyped and early adoption has been urged but you know I've tried them both out, fairly, and honestly for all it's security flaws XP is still the better OS if you ask me. The Vista, the Win 7 they just tend to restrict my choices and get in my way. I can protect my machine in other ways. I'm a power user. I don't need my hand held but Vista/Win 7, they pretty much insist upon it no matter how much you try to work around it no matter which flavor you try. I tend to find that completely annoying in the long run even if it is a bit more secure. To me the trade off just isn't worth it, hence both of my machines run updated XP with security software and such.

If it's not broken don't fix it....

More MP's and shiny new sensors those are great things if it all works well. But rushing to add things that might or not be best just because you can? That's not always such a bright idea. Me. I want a steady performing camera far more than I want more flash and dash. Don't get me wrong, I'm amused by all the colors and so forth, and of course I want to be able to do more than I can with a 6MP upscale point and shoot (My Fuji...) but I'm not really too sure I need that many MP anyhow, or video etc.

It's a camera. Picture quality that's got to be the bottom line and if the older sensor still works better than why not keep it till we have something that can actually surpass it? I wouldn't fault Pentax for that. I don't think I'd want "new" actually if in the long run the "new" camera isn't actually the better camera.
Reply

Bookmarks
  • Submit Thread to Facebook Facebook
  • Submit Thread to Twitter Twitter
  • Submit Thread to Digg Digg
Tags - Make this thread easier to find by adding keywords to it!
canon, k-r, noise, pentax news, pentax rumors, photography, range, review, sensor, sister, slt-a55, sony
Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Can sensors go bad? J Merrill Pentax DSLR Discussion 23 06-08-2010 10:40 PM
Favorable Review @ Alpha Mount World Compared with Sony A700 hans4 Pentax DSLR Discussion 5 04-11-2010 07:17 AM
Pentax Sensors scottax1 Pentax DSLR Discussion 2 04-07-2010 01:01 AM
Will Pentax go back to Sony sensors for the nextgen? virgilr Pentax DSLR Discussion 0 10-21-2009 06:49 AM
For Sale - Sold: Sony DSLR-A100, Sony 18-70, Tamron XR 28-200, Crumpler 3MDH inneyeseakay Sold Items 12 01-30-2009 05:47 AM



All times are GMT -7. The time now is 10:18 PM. | See also: NikonForums.com, part of our network of photo forums!
  • Red (Default)
  • Green
  • Gray
  • Dark
  • Dark Yellow
  • Dark Blue
  • Old Red
  • Old Green
  • Old Gray
  • Dial-Up Style
Hello! It's great to see you back on the forum! Have you considered joining the community?
register
Creating a FREE ACCOUNT takes under a minute, removes ads, and lets you post! [Dismiss]
Top