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09-14-2010, 05:55 PM   #61
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QuoteOriginally posted by farhagh Quote
If K-5 has a couple of features more than D7000, and is priced 200 less, it still can not compete. Do you know how many D90, D80,... owners will upgrade? And will advice it to their friends mentioning how much better that the D90, D80... it is? If Pentax can take a few new customers and keep the current Pentaxians it has done well (I guess it's not possible) with the higher price. The point is not how much better K-5 might be, it's still a Pentax with all those limited recognition.
then the D7000 also has some features not in the K5 and some features in the K5 not i the D7000, so both will have their own positives and negatives.

so i guess it's up to the user whether or not those features are worth the extra cost.

i'm saving up for the k5, but in all seriousness, the D7000's specs and price has got me interested and i guess i'm not the only one.

so we'll wait until rumors becomes fact or fiction and the 1st tests are reported.

09-14-2010, 06:01 PM   #62
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QuoteOriginally posted by opiedog Quote
then the D7000 also has some features not in the K5 and some features in the K5 not i the D7000, so both will have their own positives and negatives.
Sure; my point is that Pentax can not easily compete, even if it is more bang for the buck (as it has been till now). Now if it does not have this advantage it will be really harder too.
09-14-2010, 06:09 PM   #63
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QuoteOriginally posted by farhagh Quote
Sure; my point is that Pentax can not easily compete, even if it is more bang for the buck (as it has been till now). Now if it does not have this advantage it will be really harder too.

So very true.

The one thing Pentax had going for the brand was that it was the price/performance leader - at least up until this new round of camera bodies.

Now, with the price of the K-r and K-5 on the higher side of their respective market segments, the only way people will notice these cameras is if the features are significantly better than the competitors. Just being on par with Canikon is not enough. Unfortunately, this does not look to be the case. Even worse is the fact that the prices are higher than similarly equipped Canikon offerings.

I just can't imagine Pentax gaining market share with these models at these prices.
09-14-2010, 06:13 PM   #64
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QuoteOriginally posted by farhagh Quote
If K-5 has a couple of features more than D7000, and is priced 200 less, it still can not compete. Do you know how many D90, D80,... owners will upgrade? And will advice it to their friends mentioning how much better that the D90, D80... it is? If Pentax can take a few new customers and keep the current Pentaxians it has done well (I guess it's not possible) with the higher price. The point is not how much better K-5 might be, it's still a Pentax with all those limited recognition.
interesting view

it seems pentax can still attract (few?) new customers with very attractive entry dslr (Kx , then a promising Kr now) and sell them the next level of dslr for the high price

09-14-2010, 06:32 PM   #65
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QuoteOriginally posted by oliver939 Quote
interesting view

it seems pentax can still attract (few?) new customers with very attractive entry dslr (Kx , then a promising Kr now) and sell them the next level of dslr for the high price
Don't take me wrong; I shoot Pentax and I believe it's a fine system. On the other hand I'm not a brand loyal and may switch whenever I feel a specific brand is not for me anymore, so I'm neither biased nor against Pentax.
However, we all know having a very good camera -even having the best in class- is not enough to win the competition. And by winning competition I do not mean one body for one, which is not realistic. What I mean winning a competition is growing in the market (be it from 4% to 4.5% for example)
09-14-2010, 07:06 PM   #66
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D7000 vs. K-5

I looked up the D7000 specs as they have settled now. Wow...

On the spec sheet, both cameras look indistinguishable!

In common:
Mag-Alloy body, WR, 100% Prism, 2 wheel operation, 150k shutter, 16MP, ISO100-25k, 6 or 7fps, etc.

Pro K-5:
SR, In-body HDR (if Nikon did not catch up), Size?, Grip?

Pro D7000:
$200 less, Tethering?, 39AF points, Video-AF (if Pentax did not catch up), Dual SD (if Pentax did not catch up)

That's a close race and both cameras will have the same street price for sure. I am wondering if Pentax won't announce the K-5 at the $1200 price point too. The K-5 must launch at less than the K-7, not more anyway if you ask me...

Originally, the K-5 was targeted against the D300s. But Nikon acts like their is no niche left for a D300s between a D7000 and D700. And if there is no niche for Nikon, then there is none for Pentax either
09-14-2010, 07:08 PM   #67
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don't forget the latest rumors. NATIVE ISO 100!
if it's the same sensor, shouldn't it have the same Native ISO?
09-14-2010, 07:16 PM - 1 Like   #68
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QuoteOriginally posted by Copyright Quote
So really, the only lens that I have tied up is the FA50/1.4....and the price of this lens appears to be maintaining its ridiculous $450 price....
Seriously?!? I bought my FA50/1.4 brand-new about 2 years ago for $199. I've been sitting back and watching Pentax raise the prices of their lenses over, and OVER again and can't help but wonder "What the HELL are they thinking?!?!?!?"

Now, I love my Pentax K10D, but let's face it... just about every single camera release from Pentax is a step, or two backwards from the "big boys" Canon, Nikon, etc. From my perspective the only real reasons to stay with Pentax have been the weathersealing and lower cost of the bodies and lenses compared to the competition. But now it seems that the competition is wising up to the whole "weather-resistant-yet-affordably-priced" concept and with Pentax now having DOUBLED the prices of some of their lenses in some cases I just can't help but feel as if Pentax has been setting itself up for failure. I belong to several, local photo clubs where I am pretty much the ONLY Pentax user and I spend a great deal of time defending the overall technology and cost-benefit of Pentax over their Canon's and Nikon's... but that task is becoming harder and harder.

Pentax seems to take twice as long as the competitors to release a newer version of a specific "level" of camera body... and again... it seems that when they do the offering falls short of the competition. The K-5 NEEDS to be priced competitively from the start and Pentax NEEDS to get it's cameras into physical store locations at BestBuy, Wal-Mart, etc where people can actually have a look at them.... and not just rely on the web sites alone trying to push the cameras.

I'm eagerly awaiting the final specs of the K-5, as well as release of the introductory price... but if it ends up being true that the Nikon comes out similarly-spec'd, yet $500 less than the Pentax, then I too think Pentax might as well just throw in the towel and sell nothing other than "designer" cameras.

09-14-2010, 07:23 PM   #69
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QuoteOriginally posted by TiminyCricket Quote
just about every single camera release from Pentax is a step, or two backwards from the "big boys" Canon, Nikon, etc. From my perspective the only real reasons to stay with Pentax have been the weathersealing and lower cost of the bodies and lenses compared to the competition.
Hmmm, I disagree with Pentax being backward the big boys. On the contrary this is the first time I see you may be able to buy a comparable package (features, size) in the same range of price. However, still I do not see a body the reason for switching, how much they are different at the end of the day? 10%?
However, if the lenses of the other brand are matching what you want better, now with this new body it may be justified. Still, may be better to wait and see what each of the players have to offer. I guess everybody (including me) is going too far based on some unproven rumors.
09-14-2010, 07:27 PM   #70
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This D7000 looks like a copy cat of the K-7/K-5: 100% VF, WR, Mag alloy body. That's bad for Pentax and nobody did see it coming because these features were usually reserved for the D200/D300 class of camera. That's also why I was never really interested in the D90.

On the positive side, Pentax will have the same sensor (apparently) thus very similar high ISO. But the K-5 will have in body IS giving it an advantage on many lenses, especially the fast primes.

On the negative side I'm pessimistic about the AF performance. Nikon has nothing to prove while Pentax has still a lot to prove.

The D3100 and D7000 are coming head to head with the K-r and K-5 and it will be difficult for Pentax to show any strong advantage over them. Moreover it seems that Pentax will be more expensive.
09-14-2010, 07:35 PM   #71
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QuoteOriginally posted by opiedog Quote
don't forget the latest rumors. NATIVE ISO 100!
if it's the same sensor, shouldn't it have the same Native ISO?
Not the same sensor; Nikon has switched to Nikon-designed APS-C sensors with the 14mp sensor in the D3100 (base iso 100 also), probably manufactured by Renesas (just like the D3(s) sensor).
09-14-2010, 07:39 PM   #72
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We have this "pricing discussion" periodically (usually at the introduction of a new camera), and it's probably worth reminding ourselves that pricing generally is dictated by the marketplace, not the manufacturer. Under normal circumstances, a company will try to find the sweet spot between volume and margin to produce the maximum return, which may be neither the most aggressive price nor highest volume and will change constantly. Consequently, a discussion of the rumored prices attached to cameras with rumored specs may be fun, but we shouldn't take it too seriously.

Jer
09-14-2010, 07:44 PM   #73
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QuoteOriginally posted by falconeye Quote
I looked up the D7000 specs as they have settled now. Wow...

On the spec sheet, both cameras look indistinguishable!

Except for price.

I think the difference is substantially more than $200.
09-14-2010, 08:40 PM   #74
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If both cams are specced so similarly, I'm sorta betting that Nikon's AF will still own Pentax's....hmm..
09-14-2010, 09:04 PM   #75
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It is on their wesite:

Nikon | Imaging Products

http://www.nikon.com/about/news/2010/0915_d7000_02.htm

-----------------

dpreview has the price at 699 USD with 18-55 VR lens. this MUST be a typo.

Last edited by KungPOW; 09-14-2010 at 09:30 PM.
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