[jon.partsch]

I hope this thread never ends! Whining and complaining is a Pemtaxian tradition!

[gawan]

where's that thing I should put above the "a" in your name?

Alt+0229

[Lars]

Why have Nikon priced D7000 so low (relatively)? Making room for a FF at or below 17000-18000$? If so, this might lead to less growth for Pentax, and how would Hoya react to this? I think Pentax needs success with K-r and K-5!

[Aristophanes]

Why have Nikon priced D7000 so low (relatively)? Making room for a FF at or below 17000-18000$? If so, this might lead to less growth for Pentax, and how would Hoya react to this? I think Pentax needs success with K-r and K-5!

This appears likely as the D7000 is closer to the D300 as to the D90 it supposedly replaces. The blending of the high-end APS-C by Nikon will happen in the next 2 years latest with top-end APS-C bodies being permanently below US$1,500 MSRP. This makes room for FF sub-US$2,000 bodies, putting an enormous crunch on Pentax trying to compete without an FF body. Pentax will bleed high-margin sales with the D7000 and the Nikon market push. We'll have to see Canon's and Sony's response.

[JohnBee]

Making room for a FF at or below 17000-18000$?

At 17-18 thousand for a FF camera, I doubt Pentax has much to worry about.

[ghelary]

This appears likely as the D7000 is closer to the D300 as to the D90 it supposedly replaces. The blending of the high-end APS-C by Nikon will happen in the next 2 years latest with top-end APS-C bodies being permanently below US$1,500 MSRP. This makes room for FF sub-US$2,000 bodies, putting an enormous crunch on Pentax trying to compete without an FF body. Pentax will bleed high-margin sales with the D7000 and the Nikon market push. We'll have to see Canon's and Sony's response.

Did you see the price of their 24-70/2.8 ? of the 24/1.4 ? of the 34/1.4 ? of their long lenses ?

And then you have to take consideration of their size and weight. High end APSC have still a future, for those who want quality and reliability but not IQ... (yes, there are those, those were the ones who used Nikon F or Leica M and not medium format.)

[Ivan Glisin]

Who is becoming nervous after the K5 vs. the D7000 announcement?

Canon?

[Aristophanes]

Did you see the price of their 24-70/2.8 ? of the 24/1.4 ? of the 34/1.4 ? of their long lenses ?

And then you have to take consideration of their size and weight. High end APSC have still a future, for those who want quality and reliability but not IQ... (yes, there are those, those were the ones who used Nikon F or Leica M and not medium format.)

Yes, and they have a 24-120 VR FF for more budget conscious consumers, and other options as well. And a 24/1.4? That's going to be a big, pricey piece of glass regardless.

What's your point? This is an issue about pricing, FF vs. APS-C.

[Lars]

At 17-18 thousand for a FF camera, I doubt Pentax has much to worry about.

Yes, maybe so. I would probably not pay that kind of money for a camera (= wife would not let me), but there will be more people how would.

Also, what will the answer be from Canon? (Sony? Taking another direction?) Nikon seems to be a little bit ahead for the moment, and I suppose Canon want to do something about this.

If people se prices of FF starts falling, will they not be more prone to go for a brand that can provide this?

/lars

[ManuH]

This appears likely as the D7000 is closer to the D300 as to the D90 it supposedly replaces. The blending of the high-end APS-C by Nikon will happen in the next 2 years latest with top-end APS-C bodies being permanently below US$1,500 MSRP. This makes room for FF sub-US$2,000 bodies, putting an enormous crunch on Pentax trying to compete without an FF body. Pentax will bleed high-margin sales with the D7000 and the Nikon market push. We'll have to see Canon's and Sony's response.

Yes, I can see Nikon massing their FF troops on the APS-C frontier ready to invade the high-end APS-C territory.

That's why I may buy a K-5 but not at the same price I bought the K-7 (1500$ CAD + taxes), that just doesn't make sense. The bodies lose their values much too fast. If I sold my K-7 today my net loss would be around 1000$ ! If good FF bodies become available under 2000$, it would further the depreciation of a high end APS-C body.

[ghelary]

Yes, and they have a 24-120 VR FF for more budget conscious consumers, and other options as well. and a 24/1.4? That's going to be a big, pricey piece f glass regardless.

What's your point? This is an issue about pricing, FF vs. APS-C.

Well, that's my point. Considering the price of FF vs APSC with the sole price of body is pointless. Even if next year you can get a FF body for the price of a D300s now, it doesn't mean that the full system will be the same price.

There will still be people who want high quality APSC body and will be willing to pay that much because they need it - like most pros who are on a budget. And a lot of them are.

Plus there still will be some people valuating weight and compactness over high isos and massive prints. And willing to pay for the quality features, 100% viewfinder, Magnesium body, weathersealing, double card slots etc...

Will APSC body at the same price of a FF be relevant ? Yes, if it is enough well built.

At least that's my opinion.

[reeftool]

To get nervous about Nikon having a similar spec'd camera is silly. They always have a competing model. Pentax usually has only 2 DSLR's in production at any one time if recent history is any indication. Nikon and Canon have several DSLR models in production and a large stock of previous models still in the market place at all times. I saw Nikon D40's still on the shelf at Walmart recently and they were outdated 2 yrs. ago. Despite their lack of retail marketing in the US, the Kx and K7 have been successful. The new Kr and the rumored K5 have fixed many of the shortcomings of the previous models. There is no reason that these new camera bodies won't do equally well.

[Ishpuini]

Canon?

LOL!! This must be the only correct answer indeed!!

Wim

[Lars]

Will APSC body at the same price of a FF be relevant ? Yes, if it is enough well built.

I agree, but the total market for these type might decrease. Will pentax be able to increase their part of the market, not having FF?

I would very much want to have one of each (APSC and FF) for different situations, but not two sets of lenses, flashes, etc.

/Lars

[Prox-iee]

the d7000 is just the d90 that stole ideas from the k-x. I wouldn't be surprised if they offer colors haha

Pentax will provide us with a better camera, again, and sell it for 1/3rd the price of its competitors, again.