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09-19-2010, 11:39 AM   #241
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QuoteOriginally posted by illdefined Quote
that it's a slightly upgraded version of a previous model. essentially a maintenance release.

simply compare the big recent and innovative announcements from their competitors around this price point (60D,7D, D7000) and Pentax isolates itself even further in today's market.
I don't agree with you at all.

What would be a "big upgrade" over a maintenance release? Cameras take pictures... the general principals have not changed since moved to ASP-C. But look! They increased ISO (decreased noise) increased mega pixels, increased AF speed, these are all very important things when it comes to IQ. If is about on par with the D7000, and the 60D.

Of course it is weather sealed (unlike the 60D), and it has shake reduction built in (unlike either Canon or Nikon).

The real black-marks I can forecast is subpar Movie controls, and the 1/180 flash sync.

So how much of an increase in quality is required before it is no longer a maintenance release?? IQ did not change much between the K20d and k7, and they still made a much better camera. Here, they have increased IQ AND functionality, and you still complain... what kind of technology do you need in a camera? What do you want? Full frame for 1000 less than the competition?


Last edited by paperbag846; 09-19-2010 at 11:49 AM.
09-19-2010, 11:39 AM   #242
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QuoteOriginally posted by vcheng9 Quote
If you think K-5 is bad, look at the Olympus E-5..it took Olympus 4 yrs for such a minor upgrade.

Big players like C/N/S have a much deeper pocket to invest in R&D and try out new tech (like Sony A55)...

Let's hope K-r and K-5 will be a success like K-x
Olympus is making their big innovations with their Micro 4/3s system. And Sony with their mirrorless and Pellicle mirror cameras. Pentax....
09-19-2010, 11:44 AM - 1 Like   #243
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QuoteOriginally posted by Raylon Quote
Actually it would be better if these two both sold like crap, and Hoya realizes they need to really invest some money in making truly great cameras, and revolutionize the market. How to do this? I have no idea.
This would result in the death of Pentax... we need these bodies to sell well so that the lens line can grow.

What do you want to "revolutionize" the market? Seriously people. We point the camera, meter, and shoot. This is OLD TECHNOLOGY. Image sensitivity is far beyond film technology. We have shake reduction. Instant review.... the ability to take 500 pictures on a card the cost of developing 2 rolls of film. The list goes on and on. And the major complaint, autofocus, has apparently been improved upon.

I just don't understand. I know people taking wonderful photographs with 4 year old Canon Rebels which look like Game Boy's compared to this new Pentax.
09-19-2010, 11:50 AM   #244
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QuoteOriginally posted by macTak Quote
"SMC Pentax-DA 18-135mm F3.5-5.6 ED AL [IF] DC WR"

But what can "DC" possibly be???
Defocus Control

09-19-2010, 12:03 PM   #245
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QuoteOriginally posted by blende8 Quote
Defocus Control
That was the first thing that popped into my head when I read it But the new thread has added to the suspicion I first voiced that it represents a new type of SDM. Adam suspects so as well.
09-19-2010, 12:04 PM   #246
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QuoteOriginally posted by paperbag846 Quote
What do you want to "revolutionize" the market? Seriously people. We point the camera, meter, and shoot. This is OLD TECHNOLOGY. Image sensitivity is far beyond film technology. We have shake reduction. Instant review.... the ability to take 500 pictures on a card the cost of developing 2 rolls of film. The list goes on and on. And the major complaint, autofocus, has apparently been improved upon.
All I can say is that this is a horribly short-sighted comment. Name one type of product in the history of mankind where all the companies simply say "well guys, it's good enough, so let's stop developing new technolgies and keep producing the same old stuff." Sure, the fork. The fork is a proven design. No need to improve really. But a camera? Please. There is much that could be done to revolutionize the market. But like I said, I have no idea how they could do it, just that they should.
09-19-2010, 12:13 PM   #247
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The only way K-5 defeats D7000 is buy more K-5's than D7000.=P
09-19-2010, 12:15 PM - 1 Like   #248
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QuoteOriginally posted by Raylon Quote
But like I said, I have no idea how they could do it, just that they should.
But this is a very silly thing to say.

The whole digital revolution has changed the way cameras are used. Read carefully: ISO 128000 was a fairy-tale 20 years ago. That ISO is effectively night-vision. Your complaint is that it's not different enough from Nikon or Canon... but it's not like Nikon or Canon are doing things very differently. The same technology, for the most part, is available to all of these companies. Don't hold your breath for major advances in lens technology... optics are not going to advance that quickly. So you can get excited about technological advancements, like we see here, or you can continue to say silly things.

Thats like saying: oh, last year they released a 2 gigahertz CPU, and now they are releasing a 2.4 gigahertz CPU. Who cares? It's just faster, I want them to revolutionize the way computers work!

Give me a break. Every once and a while, something changes the way we work (i.e., digital camera sensors), most of the time, releases are refinements of previous ideas (e.g., ISO improvements). Both of these things are necessary for us to move "forward" (wherever that leads... I'm beginning to think that we are just moving into a future of total luxury paradoxically paired with perpetual unhappiness).

What does Pentax do differently from Nikon and Canon? Nothing really. They are kind of the Canada of camera companies. They do things tried and true, don't take major risks, don't ask too much, and provide a very nice and balanced experience. Sure, you can "have it all" in the USA... if you make it. And you can have it all with Canon or Nikon for only 30 000+ dollars. Pentax gives you a very nice selection of practical features at a competitive price point. It's boring and practical. It's why I chose Pentax. Why did you chose Pentax? With the hopes that they would release a laser-guided autofocus system which captures 3D holographic images?

09-19-2010, 12:28 PM   #249
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Since were nearing at the release. Might as well we check out the other lenses 18-260mm and 400 mm DA*. Also the WR Flash.
09-19-2010, 12:31 PM   #250
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QuoteOriginally posted by paperbag846 Quote
Why did you chose Pentax? With the hopes that they would release a laser-guided autofocus system which captures 3D holographic images?
All good points paperbag. I chose my K200D nearly three years ago because it was a weather sealed body with some great features for about $560. Pentax, back then, was ahead of the curve. There was no way that anyone else could even come close to matching that pricepoint with those features. Also the lenses for Pentax were dirt cheap, and I picked up about 4 lenses on ebay for under $100 that I still use.

But fast forward two years. Pentax is no longer ahead of the curve in terms of features and price. They are about equal with(and slightly lagging behind) other companies. And if the price sticks of $1700, I would much rather save $200 and get a camera with better features. Add on top of that that lenses aren't exactly going down in price, someone starting photography won't even look twice at Pentax. And Pentax needs those people, every single one of them. That's all I am saying.

BTW, I do know a person here in St. Louis who can take 3D holographic images with lasers. It's good stuff.
09-19-2010, 12:32 PM   #251
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QuoteOriginally posted by Priyantha Bleeker Quote
Autofocus: 11 Points, SAFOX VIII+
No AF improvement over the K-7 on the Pentax flagship?
09-19-2010, 12:41 PM   #252
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QuoteOriginally posted by tigrebleu Quote
No AF improvement over the K-7 on the Pentax flagship?
Can't you at least first search within the thread you are posting in?

It's a typo
09-19-2010, 12:47 PM   #253
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QuoteOriginally posted by Kenn100D Quote
Since were nearing at the release. Might as well we check out the other lenses 18-260mm and 400 mm DA*. Also the WR Flash.
Is that real?
Some people will really like the 400!!!!! what about an F number?
09-19-2010, 12:49 PM   #254
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This camera is aimed at users not already upgraded to the k-7.

I really feel compelled to jump back from Canon! They have finally ironed out all the kinks in the k-7.
09-19-2010, 12:50 PM   #255
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QuoteOriginally posted by Raylon Quote
]... if the price sticks of $1700, I would much rather save $200 and get a camera with better features. Add on top of that that lenses aren't exactly going down in price, someone starting photography won't even look twice at Pentax. And Pentax needs those people, every single one of them. That's all I am saying.

BTW, I do know a person here in St. Louis who can take 3D holographic images with lasers. It's good stuff.
I completely agree with the price-comparison, but I have 2 rebuttals.

From a business standpoint, I believe Pentax was under-selling itself in order to gather a user-base. That strategy worked (it sucked both you and I in), and then Hoya said "OK, now our prices will be on par with the competition". In that respect, I think they are holding true... for the most part, the price/feature comparison between companies tends to even out to 1:1. Pentax products tend to be smaller and slower for the same coin, but mostly, it all equals out. Often times, Pentax products seem to be more expensive... until you realize they are weather sealed. Finally, I get the impression that Nikon is positioning the D7000 as a "Pentax killer" and might be underselling it a little bit.

However we have no really good reason to think that this camera will sell for 1700. That is a rumored MRSP, and I think it is inflated... or the one with the 18-135 lens bundled. If this camera retails for the same price as the K7, it will be a winner. At this rumored MRSP, it will be a flop. Even more importantly, retail prices will be below the MRSP.

I remain hopeful. Ever since Pentax released the K-X... they have seemed to "get" what the market is looking for.

PS I love how you know a laser-photographer. Very cool stuff. The closest thing I have seen is Radiohead's "House of Cards" music video.... the entire thing was shot with a laser grid, and no traditional cameras were used.
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