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09-21-2010, 06:11 AM - 1 Like   #286
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I'm wondering what sort of conclusions to draw from this camera.

Nice camera, and fantastic to have better focusing, fps and more useable ISO, that's great + for a lot of people

But why on earth have they completely ignored repeated requests for tethering, optional DFS and optional SDM. Looking at the petitions and various requests across successive models, they've just manage to alienate upwards of 1,500+ potential upgrade/replacement customers.

09-21-2010, 06:39 AM   #287
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Seems nice this far. Always things that can be made better.

Optional SDM would be more then great and worth a lot. Can't be any cost for Pentax to include that setting. Not fun to have a boken DA* that I only can use with my K10D with hacked firmware.

Now I'll wait for some ISO-noise sampleshots and of course see what the price might be after a few weeks.
09-21-2010, 07:56 AM   #288
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QuoteOriginally posted by Nass Quote
But why on earth have they completely ignored repeated requests for tethering, optional DFS and optional SDM. Looking at the petitions and various requests across successive models, they've just manage to alienate upwards of 1,500+ potential upgrade/replacement customers.
You're right,

there are too many easy to implement wishes than possible to explain. Other than that Pentax cannot communicate with their non-Japanese users.

Add to the list: Adjustable focal length with AF-teleconverters, video manual controls, focus bracketing and much more.
09-21-2010, 08:04 AM   #289
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I think I will hold off on making a judgment until the final firmware version is released. Remember with the k-7 when Beta testers were not allowed to post high ISO images. It was also reported early firmware versions allowed for Af in video. It seems the reps at Photokina don't have all the information available to them yet. We shall see. They might add some more features in firmware that are very useful.

09-21-2010, 08:54 AM   #290
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The K5 looks nice. I skipped the K7 waiting for something AWESOME. While it looks nice, I'm still not sold on it yet mainly because I want to hear reviews from production models and then I'll make up my mind. More than likely I will get it.

Anyhow, I did voice OUR concerns for simple upgrades that could be made (I think) via software to Pentax USA in an email. I doubt that I'll get answer from them as I'm still waiting for tech help that I emailed a month ago. Their customer service just sucks

Here's what I wrote them:

"I am a professional photographer using all Pentax gear (K20D). I skipped the K7 waiting for the K5. But as a pro, I'm not overly excited about it. My biggest problem is lack of tethering. I highly suggest that Pentax look at all the complaints on The Largest Pentax Camera & Photography Forum - Pentax News & Rumors - PentaxForums.com Home and try to please some of us with updates that could be done with software updates. I don't want to go to a new brand, but may start thinking about it."
09-21-2010, 10:08 AM   #291
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QuoteOriginally posted by Adam Quote
Pentax K-5 AF.C in action, compared to the K-7's:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=d4nv2QGktbw
Sorry OF but that guy have the funniest Arnoldface on...
09-21-2010, 11:31 AM   #292
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QuoteOriginally posted by m8o Quote
How 'bout all the exceptional photographs that may have been posted and you sumarily discounted? So it took you 20 minutes of searching from the time someone answered your question to find a photo taken -- that seems to me -- to either be subject to some camera shake / or focused on nothing in particular, using a lens that suffers from purple fringing.... and from this, you think you can draw a conclusion?. :ugh:
also i think the pic has good DR and nicely controlled highlights....not a lens trait but sensor/processor trait
09-21-2010, 12:23 PM   #293
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QuoteOriginally posted by janneman Quote
Ofcours e not all was solved but it seemd the vast majority was whining over High iso and AF performance...
Dual SD slot was only"demanded"when rumors said it might be in K-5.
Thetering was sometimes asked for, but not by many. Buffer? After high Iso and Af more fps was most demanded. Well, we have that now so it seems but at a cost.

A decent ranged WR zoomlens would also be appreciated, we have that now.

Only frequently asked items left are (IMHO):
a long * tele (not by me by the way)
a wide fast * or WR prime (demanded by me)
WR flash (not demanded by me)

The things now mentioned as missing were not in such a great demand as the items I mentioned.

One thing they should bring out next is a cheaper WR body, like K-r(WR) or K300D as that would attract a new crowd as now there are no sub usd 1000 sealed bodies in combination with a sub usd 500 (in kit) sealed zoomlens
I know I don't care about long glass, a few more fast wide primes would be fun and a WR flash would be dandy because while shooting with a flash while it's raining is sub-optimal, it's the ability to mount the flash during such conditions and have it when it can be used effectively that is important.

I also don't care about a cheaper WR body...unless it gives me tethering and real live view not the crap on the K20D.

I think you might be under estimating the importance of tethering to a lot of people out there. Right now you might not see many requests for it because those who NEED it are either sticking with their K10D/K20D or have either moved back or to a Canikon solution.

I know for me tethering is maybe one of the top three things I need in a DSLR...possibly the number one "extra" feature. This is because I need it daily, sometimes for single items or other days all day long. To me it's the difference between getting a few dozen items shot in a 2-3hr span or a dozen items shot if I don't have it and need to fiddle to get things setup because I can't see the viewfinder/screen to check the frame and focus point. This, for me, shows how the lack of tethering represents a big difference in daily income potential.

I am so pleased I waited to move to a K7 because I simply assumed tethering, of any sort, was a given in a modern day DSLR. As we see so far tethering is, apparently, not going to be part of the K5. As I have mentioned in another thread, this forces my hand and I cannot remain using Pentax even if I want to. For me the K20D is is good but not a great camera, it's OK as a stop-gap/bridge to a more advanced body like the K7 (mehhh, too many issues that we saw as people used it more) but certainly the K5 would be a wonderful body, I hope anyway...but lacking the tethering those both may well be just pinhole cameras.

There are a lot of us out here who need this feature and I would not be as dismissive of it as it seems you are...I am going to wait a short time to see if Pentax does indeed add it in a FW (hell we have not yet seen the final firmware) release. But to be candid if it's not there on product release or we are not told it will be there shortly, then I cannot afford to wait because the K20D is not as "fun" to use in a product shooting situation as even my 40D was thanks to the crappy live view and I am reluctant to shell out for the AC adapter, for an old body I am only tolerant of using, to make studio shooting less battery burning...so at worst I go back to a 40D/50D or at best a 7D if I feel rich.

For me having only a couple lenses but a body that lets me be more productive and look forward to working is far more important than the features a K5 might offer me for my hobby use of the body. HoyaTax can blow off people like me fine...I am brand agnostic because they all work and if I end up back with Canon, fine because my limiteds are worth far more than I paid for them and will easily fund the switch. I won't have the fun feel of the Pentax but will be more productive. Maybe HoyaTax doesn't want people who work for a living?

But that is my long winded look at how significant tethering is for ME...and I know not everyone needs tethering but by not including this low cost, if any, feature it ensures the loss of more customers from the HoyaTax user base. But hey it's all good...look at all those pretty colored lenses...now THAT means real photography!!

09-21-2010, 12:58 PM   #294
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QuoteOriginally posted by falconeye Quote
You're right,

there are too many easy to implement wishes than possible to explain. Other than that Pentax cannot communicate with their non-Japanese users.

Add to the list: Adjustable focal length with AF-teleconverters, video manual controls, focus bracketing and much more.
I'm wondering...can't we get in contact with the Japanese engineers that designs the camera ? I mean, some friendly emails with suggestions and questions or something like this ? Directly to the engineering team - not just the marketing or some people who don't know what we are talking about.

Because this is my thought exactly, maybe the Japanese engineers or software programmers that work on the camera don't know we want these stuff. My impression is the English speaking representatives (Uk, US, you name it) don't have a good connection with the actually developer team in Japan.

They may have a connection with the marketing teams and so on - and maybe pass most requests from us - but it seem a lot of stuff that seem easy to implement is not.
09-21-2010, 01:22 PM   #295
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QuoteOriginally posted by CaymanImaging Quote
Anyhow, I did voice OUR concerns for simple upgrades that could be made (I think) via software to Pentax USA in an email....
Here's what I wrote them:
"...I highly suggest that Pentax look at all the complaints on ..."
You probably would have better luck writing to Pentax Japan, though you need to write in Japanese... Pentax USA or any Pentax outside Japan has very little influence on the camera features and design. And pointing to a web site or forum won't work either.
09-21-2010, 01:58 PM   #296
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QuoteOriginally posted by falconeye Quote
You're right,

there are too many easy to implement wishes than possible to explain. Other than that Pentax cannot communicate with their non-Japanese users.

Add to the list: Adjustable focal length with AF-teleconverters, video manual controls, focus bracketing and much more.
Maybe some of these things are indeed possible in software, but the project managers resigned some of features they deemed "nice to have" to future firmware updates in order to meet the schedule?

Perhaps they just ran out of time/resources to be able to impliment and test them all in time.

At least Pentax has a history of updating the firmware, so we can be hopeful.

Adam
09-21-2010, 02:13 PM   #297
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Janneman, swings and roundabouts. The better ISO performance is a function of a new sensor, so that seems to me the inevitable march of technology. The better focusing does seem to be actual development and cr*ppy focus speed has always been one of the complaints about Pentax. So well done on that. I think, together, they're surely the two main things that differentiate the K-5 from the K-7. I have the latter and can't fault the ergonomics or build of the body so re-using that chassis, taking advantage of scale of production, makes sense. Quite a nice little camera I think.

But I'd argue that those two things were actually really the absolute minimum that Pentax needed to do to even remain competetive, which isn't the same as a brand that's "out to listen to customers". There are many customers who have asked for SDM and DFS to be disableable and tethering and Pentax hasn't listened to them at all. But Pentax did add Z-axis levelling and nobody has asked for that.

So really what you can easily conclude is that Pentax doesn't listen to its customers but follows its own agenda. So they made a lazy cashcow out of the K-5 by reusing an already designed chassis and throwing a new sensor in it.

Once again I think it's clear there's a vast divide between the person/people/committee inside Pentax central that specifies these new models and us consumers in the west. I think in the Pentax US and Pentax Europe you see marketing activity but I don't get the feeling that there's much product specification input that is listened to by Pentax central.

Maybe the input to this stuff is in Japan from Japanese focus groups, I don't know. But I've always found it rather telling that this forum has only a handful of users from Japan, whereas there are thousands from the US/EMEA etc. So it begs the question who are they actually listening to and where''s the evidence?
09-21-2010, 02:31 PM   #298
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QuoteOriginally posted by Nass Quote
J
Maybe the input to this stuff is in Japan from Japanese focus groups, I don't know. But I've always found it rather telling that this forum has only a handful of users from Japan, whereas there are thousands from the US/EMEA etc. So it begs the question who are they actually listening to and where''s the evidence?
ah yes, I forgot about disabling SDM but that may be because dual drive DA lenses may be a thing of the past if the new (?) SDM is a success.
But her, and especially the DPR , I cannot recall that any request for for example tethering. It came up frequently but mostly by either the same people or by people who had little else to say.

But yes, Penstax does not listen to all. As far as I have been able to tell (mainly from DPR), a long tele, a wide fast sealed prime and a WR flash system were hgher on the general wishlist that tethering and flash sync.
09-21-2010, 03:24 PM   #299
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QuoteOriginally posted by Nass Quote
But why on earth have they completely ignored repeated requests for tethering, optional DFS and optional SDM. Looking at the petitions and various requests across successive models, they've just manage to alienate upwards of 1,500+ potential upgrade/replacement customers.
Couldn't agree more. Strange indeed.
09-21-2010, 04:38 PM   #300
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QuoteOriginally posted by JohnBee Quote
I like 'em
QuoteOriginally posted by climbertrev Quote
C'mon guys, you're photographers, or so I hope

Do you want something that implies
Just another boring DSLR
Or something that screams

Different

This camera is seeming more appealing the more I understand about it
I like 'em too. Everyone does the same old boring well-lit standard product shots. These give the camera some dynamism, some life.
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