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02-22-2011, 07:38 AM   #331
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QuoteOriginally posted by uccemebug Quote
But I'd rather see them make a fixed lens camera line in that space (a quality p&s*) and separately contribute lenses and bodies to 43.
Maybe a fixed lens Full Frame p&s with 43mm/f1.9 lens. :ugh:

02-22-2011, 08:23 AM   #332
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We've all seen what Pentax can do with an APS sized sensor giving the full frame cameras more than a run for their money with the K5, if they can come close with a half frame sensor I'm definatly interested.

Pentax doesn't have any legacy lenses in the m4/3 format, I have used Pentax 110 lenses on my G1 with stunning results, I figured out how to get around the no internal aperture adjustment by using the old slide in aperture approach.

Flickr: screwdriver1's Photostream

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02-22-2011, 10:00 AM   #333
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QuoteOriginally posted by ChrisJ Quote
Pentax doesn't have any legacy lenses in the m4/3 format, I have used Pentax 110 lenses on my G1 with stunning results, I figured out how to get around the no internal aperture adjustment by using the old slide in aperture approach.

Flickr: screwdriver1's Photostream

Chris
That looks very good.
02-22-2011, 11:26 AM   #334
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QuoteOriginally posted by ChrisJ Quote
Pentax doesn't have any legacy lenses in the m4/3 format
But they do have a legacy of participating in open mounts. 43 might not be 'open', per se, but it's certainly shaping up to be an important standard. I'm not sure that there will be a lot of room for also-ran mirrorless formats.

QuoteOriginally posted by ChrisJ Quote
Flickr: screwdriver1's Photostream
Nice work, in that set. You've got a real knack with making equipment, too.

02-22-2011, 04:47 PM   #335
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QuoteOriginally posted by Supernaut Quote
I hope the rumor regarding a Nikon 2.5x crop is true and that Pentax is using the same sensor format.

I guess Nikon will chose the sensor size so it won't compete with their traditional dslrs while Pentax chose it to be able to make a small, rugged MILC that is pocketable.

Guess who is making the finest camera out of that. And guess who sells the most..
If they're using a small variant of the Sony sensors delivering so much punch for the D7000 and K-5 in a truly small form factor, they do a few things at the same time for Nikon/Pentax:

1) It gets them into the MILC market without cannibalizing their successful APS-C DSLR's. They keep their DSLR's for the time being (becasue they sell very well and are profitable given the sunk costs and consumer lens investments) and adapt the larger APS-C (and maybe even 645 MF) to MILC at some point in the future.

2) It gives these 2 companies in particular something to take on the Canon G and S series, the Panasonic LX series, and the new Oly. Why buy an LX-5 when you can have a MILC for a reasonable upsell? Aftermarket lens sales? Got those! External flash? Yup? New ecosystem? You bet. Pentax and Nikon have simply not been able to compete in this price range/market segment.

3) If the argument of M4/3 is "good enough" with the form factor size advantage, then Pentax/Nikon continue the thread, through even smaller with a "close to good enough" sensor compared to m43.

The goal is to sell an uber-portable MILC and continue sales of the superior sensor APS-C (or, for Nikon, FF, and Pentax maybe a stretch for some to MF).

Selling 2 systems is better than one and the sales history of cameras is not that of the Holy Grail 1-size-fits-all compromise, but the market has been littered with multiple styles and designs and film sizes with consumers owning more than one to make it the market norm, not the exception.

The Pentax Auto 110 was not a great seller because the film held it back. It was always marketed as a miniature SLR, and maybe that's what we'll see. It was not really designed (not with the limitations of the all-Kodak film of the day) to replace 35mm SLR's. I'll laff me head off if there is a 110 lens adapter option from Pentax for any new MILC in the rumour pipe.
02-22-2011, 06:14 PM   #336
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QuoteOriginally posted by uccemebug Quote
But they do have a legacy of participating in open mounts. 43 might not be 'open', per se, but it's certainly shaping up to be an important standard. I'm not sure that there will be a lot of room for also-ran mirrorless formats.
Yes, I agree, 43 is becoming an important standard, and quite a few lens makers are jumping on board.
It looks to me like it's going to stay around for quite some time.
02-23-2011, 03:50 AM   #337
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On the contrary; m4/3 is becoming even less of a "standard" - not that it ever was one. There are more than one mirrorless formats, and IMO it makes no sense whatsoever to arbitrarily call one of them a "standard".
02-23-2011, 04:09 AM   #338
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It is no standard in the sense of an ISO approved standard but it may indeed become a de facto standard.
Still to early to tell though IMO

02-23-2011, 04:19 AM   #339
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Do you see Sony and Samsung switching to m4/3?
I didn't think so.
02-23-2011, 06:06 AM   #340
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QuoteOriginally posted by Kunzite Quote
Do you see Sony and Samsung switching to m4/3?
I didn't think so.
Standards co-exist (for the better or the worse).
Standard doesn't mean everything else doesn't exist.

The hot shoe we use is a stadard, Minolta/Sony use a different one and they still are around. It doesn't make our usual hot shoe a non standard hot shoe, does it?
02-23-2011, 06:54 AM   #341
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"The nice thing about standards is that there are so many of them to choose from" - A. Tannenbaum
02-23-2011, 08:04 AM   #342
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QuoteOriginally posted by Kunzite Quote
Do you see Sony and Samsung switching to m4/3?
I didn't think so.
Can you name a standard that Sony ever "switched to"?

But seriously, this sort of market maturation is well under way. What use a 'me-too' product unless it offers real distinction?

(Phew, 600 posts?)
02-23-2011, 08:11 AM   #343
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QuoteOriginally posted by uccemebug Quote
can you name a standard that sony ever "switched to"?



(phew, 600 posts?)
vhs
02-23-2011, 08:19 AM   #344
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QuoteOriginally posted by thibs Quote
It is no standard in the sense of an ISO approved standard but it may indeed become a de facto standard.
Still to early to tell though IMO
There are systems and standards.

Film is a standard. ISO is a standard.

35mm is a system. 645 another. 67 another. K-mount a subsystem.

CMOS is a standard. CCD is a standard. They have defined engineering and manufacturing principles (and patents).

m43 is a closed system. Oly's firmware makes them a subsystem of m43. K-mount is still a subsystem of the APS-C system.

The difference is the boundary.

That is how I have understood it.
02-23-2011, 08:20 AM   #345
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QuoteOriginally posted by thibs Quote
Standards co-exist (for the better or the worse).
Standard doesn't mean everything else doesn't exist.

The hot shoe we use is a stadard, Minolta/Sony use a different one and they still are around. It doesn't make our usual hot shoe a non standard hot shoe, does it?
Are you talking about ISO 518:2006? I'm quite sure that's a standard, but I'm not so sure the Minolta proprietary hot shoe is on a same level
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